I definately have my view on this issue but I was wanting to know what everyone else thinks? Granted this tough question to answer given how many guns are in circulation and how difficult it would be to do, but this is the interwebz so what do you think?
…in direct violation of the Constitution.
[quote]cwill1973 wrote:
…in direct violation of the Constitution.[/quote]
/thread
[quote]cwill1973 wrote:
…in direct violation of the Constitution.[/quote]
I’m assuming he means after an amendment to the Constitution.
Anyway, the answer is that it would make the country more dangerous, giving rise to yet another enormous black market and yet another opportunity for southerly cartels to diversify. And bad guys would still have guns.
OP, you are from Illinois. A trip to Chicago, having just recently adopted the Bill of Rights, will give you a decent approximation of the scenario.
I live in a suberb outside of Chicago. It will probably take a few years to see accurate data but I suspect there maybe a few less murders in Chicago now that we have CCW but it won’t make much difference. The problems in Chicago is much bigger that CCW or guns, it is a socio economic issue. Hence why the gun ban didn’t work in Chicago.
[quote]smh_23 wrote:
[quote]cwill1973 wrote:
…in direct violation of the Constitution.[/quote]
I’m assuming he means after an amendment to the Constitution.
[/quote]
They won’t amend it, they will just redefine it, it’s way easier. Or slip something in under the Patriot Act since you have already “Sacrificed Liberty for Security” there.
Obviously, it would flagrantly violate the constitution to do so. However, even if that were the case I just don’t think it would make anyone abundantly safer. Stiffer penalties for gun violence don’t act as a great deterrent. Criminals using and possessing guns to further their enterprise aren’t going to stop using guns. The fundamental problem here is that guns exist. That can’t be undone with a piece of legislation. Would the world be safer if guns had never been invented? Probably, but that simply isn’t the case.
… into an even more docile society ripe for a dictatorship. I don’t think the political will (or the will of the people) is there to enact that kind of reform.
[quote]pennstate29 wrote:
I live in a suberb outside of Chicago. It will probably take a few years to see accurate data but I suspect there maybe a few less murders in Chicago now that we have CCW but it won’t make much difference. The problems in Chicago is much bigger that CCW or guns, it is a socio economic issue. Hence why the gun ban didn’t work in Chicago. [/quote]
Well there you go. It did a whole lot of jack squat to curb violence. Do you think a national gun ban would produce a dissimilar result?
[quote]Mitchnasty wrote:
However, even if that were the case I just don’t think it would make anyone abundantly safer. [/quote]
Couldn’t agree more.
Death Penalty laws don’t really stop murder do they?
The War on Drugs certainly hasn’t stopped people from getting high or selling them.
I don’t understand why the anti-firearm fringe (yes, you are on the fringe) can’t actually look at reality.
[quote]angry chicken wrote:
… into an even more docile society ripe for a dictatorship. I don’t think the political will (or the will of the people) is there to enact that kind of reform.[/quote]
I seriously doubt any concerted effort would be made to take guns away from The People, period. I can see more regulation on a federal, state and local level perhaps which would only serve to keep guns away from the law-abiding.
[quote]beachguy498 wrote:
[quote]angry chicken wrote:
… into an even more docile society ripe for a dictatorship. I don’t think the political will (or the will of the people) is there to enact that kind of reform.[/quote]
I seriously doubt any concerted effort would be made to take guns away from The People, period. I can see more regulation on a federal, state and local level perhaps which would only serve to keep guns away from the law-abiding.[/quote]
The lessons of history would indicate otherwise. I know people think because we are the U.S. a government hostile to its citizens could never happen but they are wrong. If anyone thinks there are no Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot, etc. wannabes in our government they are delusional. Human nature does not change. The Constitution is the sole reason we have lived in relative freedom these past 200+ years. Without the U.S. leading the way, it is highly likely the rest of the world would be living under some form of despotic government. Hitler and Stalin’s successors would probably still be fighting over control of Europe. There would probably be a few countries, Australia being one, that would provide some freedom but they would not have been powerful enough alone to police the world, right or wrong, as we have.
[quote]cwill1973 wrote:
The Constitution is the sole reason we have lived in relative freedom these past 200+ years. [/quote]
I wouldn’t say sole. Very important and a cornerstone, yes, but sole I wouldn’t.
The relative prosperity of even the most destitute compared to impoverished nations certainly plays a major role here too.
Anyone that shits into water that is cleaner, after the poop hits it, than the drinking water of entire sections of the world isn’t poor.
It will never happen , I understand most people like me know how the GOV works , give them an inch and they take a mile . That is why they are having a tough time with any gun legislation . I personally could live with regulations like an auto mobile but like i say you give them an inch and they will take a mile
[quote]pittbulll wrote:
I personally could live with regulations like an auto mobile… [/quote]
I’m not a fan of the car analogy, but I’d say that’s more or less how firearms are regulated in most states today.
Want to own a sweet '84 IROC Z with T-tops and a booming system? You can do that in most states without any sort of licenses. You can toss it up on concrete blocks to show off to the neighbors or even take it for a little spin around your family’s compound. No problemo.
Now, if you want to take that IROC for a drive to the convenience store to get a pack of Winstons and a few tall boys, well you’re going to need a license to do that on the public motorways.
Guns aren’t much different. Have all you want on your own land, but if you decide to carry one in public you will need to go through the proper channels to get a carry permit.
[quote]pittbulll wrote:
I personally could live with regulations like an auto mobile [/quote]
Can you give some examples here? (Not this isn’t a call out and I’m not busting your balls. I’m actually curious what you mean here.)
[quote]countingbeans wrote:
[quote]cwill1973 wrote:
The Constitution is the sole reason we have lived in relative freedom these past 200+ years. [/quote]
I wouldn’t say sole. Very important and a cornerstone, yes, but sole I wouldn’t.
The relative prosperity of even the most destitute compared to impoverished nations certainly plays a major role here too.
Anyone that shits into water that is cleaner, after the poop hits it, than the drinking water of entire sections of the world isn’t poor. [/quote]
For sure but do you think the U.S. would have become as prosperous had we remained under the rule of an English king?
Edit: There are quite a few former British colonies languishing in poverty.
[quote]cwill1973 wrote:
For sure but do you think the U.S. would have become as prosperous had we remained under the rule of an English king?
Edit: There are quite a few former British colonies languishing in poverty.
[/quote]
We were very prosperous under the king. IIRC, the colonies had the highest literary rate based on citizens among any other country in the world and the highest # of land owners and what you would call the “upper-middle” class today in relation to the total population among all the other countries in the world.
[quote]cwill1973 wrote:
Edit: There are quite a few former British colonies languishing in poverty.[/quote]
Their situation is in no way comparable to the 13 colonies.
… it would make guns hard to get! As hard as… drugs. Oh wait.
The funny thing is the people murdering each other with firearms almost always are “illegally possessing it”.
What, 30 people killed in Chicago (Chiraq) this last weekend? Think any had a carry permit? I heard the waiting period for the Gangster Disciples is pretty lengthy.