T Nation

Toremifene better than Nolvadex?


#1

Ok, so I just started reading about Toremifene and this is what I have found so far:
More powerful than Nolvadex (TAM)
Less side effects
Lowers LDL and increases HDL
Greater increases in LH
Increases in bone mineral density the same as TAM
Less ocular toxicity
Increases FSH and sperm count quality
Helps in prevention of prostate cancer
Anyone have any experience with Toremifene?


#2

Tried it once while on TRT to get first hand experience. Was like I was taking nothing, which is good. Nolvadex was similar. Clomid really fucked me up. Tries again months later, ditto and tossed.

It does seem very promising. The medical community it stuck on clomid because is has all of the research and clinical trial data, because it was the first SERM. With the others, there really was no reason to go through all of that again.

The prostate is sensitive to estrogen and estrogen dominance. For those on TRT who are managing E2 with an AI, that may easily be half of the battle.


#3

I was on TRT with an AI and the side effects were worse than the condition: ED, low libido.
Switched to Clomid and the side effects were terrible: ED, insomnia, anxiety, low libido, girl brain.
Switched to HCG and the side effects were just as bad: Low libido.
Switched to Nolvadex and so far so good but what worries me is that I may have to be on TAM long term and I know that there is hepatotoxicity, and ocular toxicity associated with long term use which is why I may ask my Dr to switch me to TOR. I just wanted to hear it from the horse's mouth that all is well in candy mountain.


#4

When you say "I was on TRT with..." do you mean you were actually taking testosterone, in addition to these compounds?

For the life of me, I can't think of a good reason why one would use a SERM while on TRT....just hoping to block the receptors while E2 in the blood runs rampant?


#5

No I was just on TRT with an AI for 2 months and it wasn't working well for me at all, my T went up to 1400 but I was still having ED issues bigtime.
I was switched to Clomid (standalone) after that for a month and the side effects were really bad too: ED, anxiety, etc. T was 365.
After that nightmare, I was switched to TAM (standalone) and so far it's the best that has worked out for me, no ED, getting NPT, aggressive, haven't had BW yet but I will post results when I do. My concern is the long term, I know its hepatotoxic and ocular toxic therefore I was going to suggest to my Dr to switch me to Toremifene for long term use (5 + years). I just wanted to get feedback on TOR because I hear a lot of great things about it but I'm doing so well on TAM.


#6

Lately I have been thinking I do not need any AI, I stopped taking anastrozole and HCG, demanded a new contract for more money, kicking butt billing 60-70 hours per week. Best shreaded abs I ever had, neighbors just told me I look buff. Plenty of wood. Very little sleep, 2 hours one night, 5 the next 6 average since.

I might actually stop T because I got so busy I just had no time for the hassle, took 100mg over 2 weeks ago. I have been wanting to find out if I really need it -seems now is the time.

Hair stopped falling out too - I was overdoing the liquid AI.

Sleep like baby when I get the chance.


#7

Latest lab results after using TAM for a month

ESTRADIOL: 22
FSH: 3.7
LH: 7.6
TESTOSTERONE: 459


#8

Does anyone know a Dr in Texas that will prescribe Toremifene? I am having a difficult time finding one that will prescribe it.


#9

there is a great white shark that is known to carry liquid torem.


#10

Nice, is that with or without an AI


#11

What is your dose if tam ?


#12

BUMP


#13

Shit..

I didn't pay attention to the date of this topic !


#14

HA!........Makes 2 of us Mac.