T Nation

Tom Ricks

First slamming Fox on air: http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/erik-wemple/post/ricks-fox-doesnt-care-about-story-behind-benghazi-story/2012/11/27/b4f4ee0e-38ab-11e2-b01f-5f55b193f58f_blog.html

Then to MSNBC: “You’re just like Fox, but not as good at it.”

He’s a veteran and he calls it like he sees it. I agree that Fox has been hyperventilating on Benghazi out of sheer partisan hackery, though I wouldn’t characterize the incident as merely a “small firefight” and I wouldn’t flippantly avoid apportioning blame to the Obama administration for a less than surefooted response (which is not the same as calling this some kind of momentous scandal).

Still, I wish more people would be candid about Fox and MSNBC, especially on their respective programs. And Fox shying away from the criticism, cutting the interview immediately without so much as a hint of willingness to enter into debate, is about as cowardly and un-newsmanlike as conduct can be–not that I would expect anything different from them.

Thoughts?

[quote]smh23 wrote:

Thoughts?[/quote]

Main stream media is garbage.

New media needs to be fact checked, so laborous.

I’m of the current belief that if we had more journalism with integrity in this nation, the nation itself would be in much better shape. Politics will always be a clusterfuck, but a sound honest media, now that is a mark of a great and strong nation.

There are some good people trying hard out there, but the corruption goes deep. Part of it is the money, part of it is the citizenry, but part of it is the “journalists” themselves.

It should be called MSNBC opinions or Fox opinions. At least Stewart is just a comedy program and doesn’t masquerade as serious news. Fox and MSNBC are the left and right versions of pure confirmation bias.

[quote]H factor wrote:
Fox and MSNBC are the left and right versions of pure confirmation bias. [/quote]

I wouldn’t even give them that much credit some days.

I actually read the headlines from both websites daily, but couldn’t watch the network versions if I tried. The talking heads on both channels are a joke.

They are windbag propoganda machines really. MSNBC thinks the sun shines due to racism, and Fox thinks liberals are the cause of all the world’s ills. They can both shit sunshine once in awhile.

CNBC isn’t too much better, but better.

[quote]countingbeans wrote:

[quote]H factor wrote:
Fox and MSNBC are the left and right versions of pure confirmation bias. [/quote]

I wouldn’t even give them that much credit some days.

I actually read the headlines from both websites daily, but couldn’t watch the network versions if I tried. The talking heads on both channels are a joke.

They are windbag propoganda machines really. MSNBC thinks the sun shines due to racism, and Fox thinks liberals are the cause of all the world’s ills. They can both shit sunshine once in awhile.

CNBC isn’t too much better, but better. [/quote]

I flip through every once in a while. Other than sports not a big TV watcher. Everytime I land on either channel I can’t imagine that people get paid great money to do what these blowhards do. What’s really sad is even Fox said or even MSNBC is an insult towards the team they are cheering on. As in even MSNBC had to point out Obama was wrong on this (very rare). Or even Fox said Obama did this right (very rare). Of course the roles were reversed with GWB, but such is partisan politics.

this board is an example of why media is at peril . If you say something one side does not like , it will be called delusional , stupid , they will try and lump you into a mythical class of people that have no grasp on reality . Every one has to be right all the time . Just think of all the posters that 10,000 posts and have never admitted to being wrong

[quote]pittbulll wrote:
this board is an example of why media is at peril . If you say something one side does not like , it will be called delusional , stupid , they will try and lump you into a mythical class of people that have no grasp on reality . Every one has to be right all the time . Just think of all the posters that 10,000 posts and have never admitted to being wrong [/quote]

My point was really that someone that calls themselves a journalist should be above what you describe here.

But, to your point, what you are talking about is supposed to happen here, that is what a forum is for, bitching at eachother. Journalism is about presenting facts and allowing the reader to form their own conclusion. Too often the “journalist” will form your conclusion for you.

And also, I’ve been wrong a million times in my life.

[quote]pittbulll wrote:
this board is an example of why media is at peril . If you say something one side does not like , it will be called delusional , stupid , they will try and lump you into a mythical class of people that have no grasp on reality . Every one has to be right all the time . Just think of all the posters that 10,000 posts and have never admitted to being wrong [/quote]

As opposed to being labeled an ass-backwards Cretin wanting to take America back to the Stone Age ?

Should you be against any of the hot button issues, even only one of them, you are painted (successfully by the Leftist Media Machine) as some kind of Cro-Magnon knuckle-dragger.

[quote]countingbeans wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:
this board is an example of why media is at peril . If you say something one side does not like , it will be called delusional , stupid , they will try and lump you into a mythical class of people that have no grasp on reality . Every one has to be right all the time . Just think of all the posters that 10,000 posts and have never admitted to being wrong [/quote]

My point was really that someone that calls themselves a journalist should be above what you describe here.

But, to your point, what you are talking about is supposed to happen here, that is what a forum is for, bitching at eachother. Journalism is about presenting facts and allowing the reader to form their own conclusion. Too often the “journalist” will form your conclusion for you.

And also, I’ve been wrong a million times in my life. [/quote]

in my opinion the line is blurred from blogging to Journalism

[quote]MaximusB wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:
this board is an example of why media is at peril . If you say something one side does not like , it will be called delusional , stupid , they will try and lump you into a mythical class of people that have no grasp on reality . Every one has to be right all the time . Just think of all the posters that 10,000 posts and have never admitted to being wrong [/quote]

As opposed to being labeled an ass-backwards Cretin wanting to take America back to the Stone Age ?

Should you be against any of the hot button issues, even only one of them, you are painted (successfully by the Leftist Media Machine) as some kind of Cro-Magnon knuckle-dragger. [/quote]

I did not distinquish between left and right :slight_smile:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]MaximusB wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:
this board is an example of why media is at peril . If you say something one side does not like , it will be called delusional , stupid , they will try and lump you into a mythical class of people that have no grasp on reality . Every one has to be right all the time . Just think of all the posters that 10,000 posts and have never admitted to being wrong [/quote]

As opposed to being labeled an ass-backwards Cretin wanting to take America back to the Stone Age ?

Should you be against any of the hot button issues, even only one of them, you are painted (successfully by the Leftist Media Machine) as some kind of Cro-Magnon knuckle-dragger. [/quote]

I did not distinquish between left and right :slight_smile:
[/quote]

As well you shouldn’t. The right is equally as guilty as the left. Both play the exact same game. Of course it’s not big deal when someone’s side does it, but a huge deal when the other guys do. It’s like negative ads. It’s informing the public if it’s your side, but it’s demonization and too far if it’s the other. Lol, party cheerleaders.

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]countingbeans wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:
this board is an example of why media is at peril . If you say something one side does not like , it will be called delusional , stupid , they will try and lump you into a mythical class of people that have no grasp on reality . Every one has to be right all the time . Just think of all the posters that 10,000 posts and have never admitted to being wrong [/quote]

My point was really that someone that calls themselves a journalist should be above what you describe here.

But, to your point, what you are talking about is supposed to happen here, that is what a forum is for, bitching at eachother. Journalism is about presenting facts and allowing the reader to form their own conclusion. Too often the “journalist” will form your conclusion for you.

And also, I’ve been wrong a million times in my life. [/quote]

in my opinion the line is blurred from blogging to Journalism
[/quote]

I don’t disagree, but I would say the line needs to un-blur. And editor headlines are a bunch of bullshit half the time too.

[quote]countingbeans wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]countingbeans wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:
this board is an example of why media is at peril . If you say something one side does not like , it will be called delusional , stupid , they will try and lump you into a mythical class of people that have no grasp on reality . Every one has to be right all the time . Just think of all the posters that 10,000 posts and have never admitted to being wrong [/quote]

My point was really that someone that calls themselves a journalist should be above what you describe here.

But, to your point, what you are talking about is supposed to happen here, that is what a forum is for, bitching at eachother. Journalism is about presenting facts and allowing the reader to form their own conclusion. Too often the “journalist” will form your conclusion for you.

And also, I’ve been wrong a million times in my life. [/quote]

in my opinion the line is blurred from blogging to Journalism
[/quote]

I don’t disagree, [/quote]then we agree :slight_smile:

[quote]countingbeans wrote:

[quote]H factor wrote:
Fox and MSNBC are the left and right versions of pure confirmation bias. [/quote]

I wouldn’t even give them that much credit some days.

I actually read the headlines from both websites daily, but couldn’t watch the network versions if I tried. The talking heads on both channels are a joke.

They are windbag propoganda machines really. MSNBC thinks the sun shines due to racism, and Fox thinks liberals are the cause of all the world’s ills. They can both shit sunshine once in awhile.

CNBC isn’t too much better, but better. [/quote]

What do you think of C-SPAN Beans? I really enjoy it myself.

[quote]Legionary wrote:

[quote]countingbeans wrote:

[quote]H factor wrote:
Fox and MSNBC are the left and right versions of pure confirmation bias. [/quote]

I wouldn’t even give them that much credit some days.

I actually read the headlines from both websites daily, but couldn’t watch the network versions if I tried. The talking heads on both channels are a joke.

They are windbag propoganda machines really. MSNBC thinks the sun shines due to racism, and Fox thinks liberals are the cause of all the world’s ills. They can both shit sunshine once in awhile.

CNBC isn’t too much better, but better. [/quote]

What do you think of C-SPAN Beans? I really enjoy it myself.[/quote]

I will answer for him :slight_smile: n, I think they are ok , but they are like all the other whores , but not as bad as FAUX :slight_smile:

What I’ve found interesting is that prior to FOX News the mainstream media was only tilted a bit left. And usually only around major elections, otherwise it was close to being balanced. When FOX surfaced the main stream meida started leaning even further left as if to say “Oh yeah!”

Now because of FOX we don’t have anything even close to being balanced anymore. This is actually a giant step backward. But then again why shouldn’t the news media follow our entire culture?

[quote]ZEB wrote:
What I’ve found interesting is that prior to FOX News the mainstream media was only tilted a bit left. And usually only around major elections, otherwise it was close to being balanced. When FOX surfaced the main stream meida started leaning even further left as if to say “Oh yeah!”

Now because of FOX we don’t have anything even close to being balanced anymore. This is actually a giant step backward. But then again why shouldn’t the news media follow our entire culture?[/quote]

Fox News proved that many people preferred it when their news source routinely confirmed their biases. Its not surprising that a big chunk of the rest of the media followed suit. And I agree. This is a giant step backwards.

[quote]ZEB wrote:
What I’ve found interesting is that prior to FOX News the mainstream media was only tilted a bit left. And usually only around major elections, otherwise it was close to being balanced. When FOX surfaced the main stream meida started leaning even further left as if to say “Oh yeah!”

Now because of FOX we don’t have anything even close to being balanced anymore. This is actually a giant step backward. But then again why shouldn’t the news media follow our entire culture?[/quote]

I like the line about MSNBC being the same as Fox, just not as good at it.

If you’re going to be a collection of partisan hacks, you might as well make money hand over fist while doing it. Fox sure does that.

[quote]smh23 wrote:

[quote]ZEB wrote:
What I’ve found interesting is that prior to FOX News the mainstream media was only tilted a bit left. And usually only around major elections, otherwise it was close to being balanced. When FOX surfaced the main stream meida started leaning even further left as if to say “Oh yeah!”

Now because of FOX we don’t have anything even close to being balanced anymore. This is actually a giant step backward. But then again why shouldn’t the news media follow our entire culture?[/quote]

I like the line about MSNBC being the same as Fox, just not as good at it.

If you’re going to be a collection of partisan hacks, you might as well make money hand over fist while doing it. Fox sure does that.[/quote]

We can agree on the partisian media perhaps but I didn’t much care for your line about
FOX overdoing Benghazi. That could be the case, then again when you have a left wing media bias that won’t investigate Benghazi that makes FOX scream all the louder.

Four people dead and one of them an Ambassador who was raped killed and dragged through the streets. All the while they had asked for help having a hunch that something was coming. Help request denied by Obama and company. And then to top it all off obama and his crew claim that it was all over an anti Muslim video.

The entire incident stinks from beginning to end and I think you must know that.

If it were GW Bush in that position the press would be screaming for impeachment. The double standard is alive and well isn’t it?

[quote]ZEB wrote:

Ambassador who was raped[/quote]

Sterling example of conjecture and hyperbole masquerading as news in the partisan alternate-reality chamber.

“Greetings, Concerning your query on the report published by a Lebanese website according to which ambassador Stevens was sodomized. That report falsely quoted our news agency and has no truth whatsover to it. AFP promptly sent a strongly worded complaint to that website and they removed the report and published a denial, saying that AFP did not report such a thing.”

–AFP, 9/15/12

[quote]
If it were GW Bush in that position the press would be screaming for impeachment. The double standard is alive and well isn’t it?[/quote]

GW Bush presided over and was DIRECTLY responsible for a hell of a lot more American death than we were forced to watch on 9/11/12.

I will refer you to Ricks’ point in the video: how many security contractors died in Iraq? More or less than four? Are you as outraged about that as you are about this? If not, why?

Furthermore, how many Americans died because of things like this:

"Army Spc. Thomas Wilson: Why do we soldiers have to dig through local landfills for pieces of scrap metal and compromised ballistic glass to up-armor our vehicles? And why don’t we have those resources readily available to us?

Donald Rumsfeld: It isn’t a matter of money. It isn’t a matter on the part of the army of desire. It’s a matter of production and capability of doing it. As you know, ah, you go to war with the army you have–not the army you might want or wish to have at a later time."

What if Obama called a press conference and said: “You protect ambassadors with the security details you have, not the security details you might want or wish to have at a later time.” How do you think Fox would react to that?

I’ve said again and again on these boards that the Obama administration’s response to the incident was unacceptable. But am I going to pretend that I think it’s a crime against humanity that Susan Rice said the attacks were sparked by a Youtube video? No, I’m not.