T Nation

Thoughts on this Stack & Cycle?

Pharma
#1

Not sure if this is the right place for this, but any feedback is appreciated.

I’ve recently decided to start my first cycle. I’ve settled on

  • 50 mg Oxandrolone

  • 50 mg stanozolol

  • liv 52 as a liver supplement

  • clomid for PCT

  • HCG blocking shampoo (ketoconazol) for hair loss

  • MCT oil as an overall supplement
    Cycle : 4 weeks on 6 weeks off

Considering getting another liver supplement on top of the liv 52 (thistle).
I’ve done my research and this is what I’ve come to - Am I good to go or do I need anything else? Any constructivism is appreciated.

#2

It probably won’t chsnge your mind but I would ditch the orals and just run testosterone only for your first cycle. 400-500mg per week. AI and pct. amazing results if you know how to eat sleep train.

2 Likes
#3

I appreciate the response @atfit , I’ve considered it but the fact that test aromatizes (and syringes of course) has deterred me from it. I’m convinced with proper discipline orals can work just fine, any reason in particular you are against them other than the strain placed on the liver?

#4

Have fun getting big and strong for a couple weeks then losing it all and feeling like crap for a couple more.

#5

Orals never work for real actual gains when used without a test base.

You need the test just to function properly, then you need it to support any gains the anavar will help you get. If you don’t have test in there then you are trying to get the anavar and stanazolol to do all the work, they simply can not. Without test you will have no natural test or very very low test. It is unhealthy and your attempts at gains will be like trying to run up a mud slides. The anavar and stanazolol in no way replace test. No compound replaces test when it comes to all the natural functions it effects and on top of that you have two DHT family compounds.

By the time you PCT and recover there is a real chance you will have less muscle mass than before you started. The only time you see pros not using a test base (weather it be at anabolics levels or just trt levels) is right before a show when they are trying to get rid of any and all water not absolutely necessary for the volume of the muscle cell. That should make you think. They ALWAYS have some sort of test during any cycle especially a gaining cycle. Even the cutting cycles they include test.

The only people who get and keep gains on anavar or stanazolol without a test base are females. They get the gains only because their bodies are evolved to have low test levels and they are extremely strong responders for any AAS.

At four weeks a double oral stack at your doses is just going to hurt your liver and set you back because your natural test is not going to automatically come back to pre cycle levels. You will be low test for probably two months after you stop, provided your PCT does what it is supposed to.

Your cycle is basically shooting your self in the foot.

3 Likes
#6

It’s not a matter of discipline. You can’t use strong willpower to overcome science.

#7

Extremely informative answer @now_i_care , what would you recommend as a first stack instead? Just test like the previous answer ?

#8

I think it was covered by previous posters. If you can’t do test because of syringes then I wouldn’t bother with AAS anyways. You will regret an oral only cycle.

1 Like
#9

The best answer is a simple test cycle. However I have a feeling you are set against it and reasoning with resolve just never seems to go well.

Even though you are against needles the answer to your situation is needles. Load them with HCG. I am pretty sure your HCG shampoo that you listed is a typo. The HCG I am talking about is HCG pregyl. It is a synthetic replacement for FSH or LH I forget but either way it will keep you body producing testosterone. You do see some experienced users doing this, I have not though. They use the HCG to keep natural testosterone production then they use AAS on top of it. Typically they do this for cut cycles.
If you get insulin needles and go sub q then chances are you can get good enough that pinning yourself is painless even to the point you don’t feel anything at all.

On top of the HCG I would pick ONE AAS. You need to only ever try one new compound at a time. That way if something weird happens you can narrow it down to the new compound and act accordingly.

You will need to have extra Nolvadex on hand because the HCG can cause aromatization and the easiest way to counteract the estrogen from HCG is Nolvadex. An AI will not control all of the aromatizing from HCG, somehow the HCG makes some aromatizing happen inside your balls and no AI can counteract that.

I really think you should reconsider the simple test cycle there is a reason EVERYONE says that’s the way to go. Plus even with the HCG keeping your natural test levels up no oral will help you get any significant keepable gains. You will get gains and if done properly you will keep some but they just won’t be anything significant.

1 Like