I’m beefy but not lean. Abs are visible but not cookie cutter. I believe it is time to cut.
I’ve heard clen is good to take while cutting. Only ever taken test so would appreciate it if someone could school me on clenbuterol and/or other things I could use for cutting. forgive my ignorance.
Other things you could use? A calorie deficit.
Ooooo American eagle gold bullion… beautiful coin
Clen isn’t safe or needed for you’re goals
You should only add supplements when you can’t get any leaner with diet/cardio alone and hit a wall.
My favorite fat burner is Cardarine (GW501516). No it doesn’t cause cancer like some believe and is relatively safe at low doses. Start with 10mg/day.
How do you know?
Did you run RCTs for an extended period of time?
These guys stopped at the animal stage.
“Despite these promising early results, the further investigation and development of GW501516 was discontinued after observations in animal studies of its association
with the rapid induction of cancers in several organs (liver,
stomach, tongue, skin, bladder, ovaries, womb and testes)”
I can’t prove this stuff causes cancer, however studies prove it for animals.
How are you able to say it doesn’t?
If it doesn’t cause cancer, why would a large scale corporation give up on a drug that had serious potential to cure one of the most serious epidemics plaguing this era?
Rodent models indicate within HED’d equatable to what one would take for fat burning purposes, rapid tumour growth occurs… whilst what occurs within rodents doesn’t nececcarily equate to what happens in humans, we have enough genetic similarity for caution to be high enough to halt trials. To say “it doesn’t cause cancer, use it” is incredibly dangerous advice to be giving
That study you’re both referencing was done by giving rodents absurd amounts on a mg/kg basis that would never be a dose consumed by humans. If you give anyone an entire bottle aspirin they’ll die, one pill a day and they are fine. I remember reading another study that showed in small doses Cardarine actually reduced cancer. I’d find it for you if I wasn’t on mobile right now. Find me a study that shows that 10mg a day in humans causes cancer.
I’ve used it myself off and on the last few years with no side effects. I personally know guys in their 40s who have used it for longer and are fine. If you think it might cause cancer based on one rodent study then don’t use it.
Yes, you’re right I can’t say it for sure doesn’t cause cancer. Just as I can’t say that eating fruit every day for sure doesn’t cause cancer. But I can say that it hasn’t been proven to cause cancer in humans. That’s good enough for me.
look up HED calculations from rodent to human… the differences in dose after calibrating/ accounting for that is very marginal to none
I assume the study Alex referenced was the 2009 study, the link he posted didn’t work for me but below is a summary of studies:
“ Carcinogenic potential of cardarine (GW501516) was assessed in male and female Han Wistar rats by daily administration of GW501516 for 104 weeks. Male rats were given a daily dose of 0,5,15 or 30 mg/kg/day for first six months and 0, 5, 20 or 40 mg/kg/day for rest of the study.”
The lowest dose administered was 5mg/kg/day. For an average human that’s 400mg/day!! I haven’t used this substance above 10mg/day.
“ A few clinical trials have been performed on cardarine (GW501516) and its effects on lipid and lipoprotein metabolism. In contrast to the animal toxicity studies, no significant adverse effects were reported in any of the human studies, which may reflect the considerably lower doses administered (up to 10 mg/day) for much shorter periods of time (up to 12 weeks). However, the available clinical data on GW501516 safety is insufficient to assess the long-term health risks associated with its intake by human subjects. Long-term consequences have not been discovered yet due to the low number of clinical trials performed.”
So the jury is still out. Use it or don’t. If you’re scared of cancer, I think going out in the sun without sunblock is more dangerous than 10mg/d of Cardarine for a short period of time.
Rat to human calculation is to divide dose by 6.2, I tried to explain this earlier. So if you’re taking the 5mg/kg dose to humans for a 75 kg male 75*5/6.2 it’s 60mg daily
And in Australia (where I live) I sure as shit wouldn’t do this if I was you given the indicdence of melaoma… though I do this all the time
Regarding cardarine there are numerous reports indicating it may increase and decrease the risks of certain types of cancer. Until a full, peer reviewed report is out I’d be very, very cautious… chances are it isn’t safe… but then again neither are steroids and pretty much all of us on Pharma take them despite the numerous potentially adverse neurological, cardiovascular, endocrine etc outcomes… but at least we know in this case, cardarine is more of a wildcard
@unreal24278 I wasn’t aware of the rat to human calculation, you’re clearly better at interpreting studies than I am!
Either way, the Eric J. Olson et al. (2012) study in the link I posted earlier where they gave >200 human subjects 10mg/day for 12 weeks showed no notable negative side effects. That study and my personal experience with the drug are enough for me to consider it safe to use at that dose/length of time.
yeah heard of that before. also heard about the cancer lol. you run it at 10 or 20mg?
I’m trying to the point where I have dick skin all over my body without losing a lot of the gainz I’ve cultivated over the last year. I’ll do some googling. thanks.
Dont, not worth it not needed.
For a basic cut cycle Test Base and add in a DHT.
Test 200-500mg plus 500mg Masteron. Add Anavar or Winstrol last 2-3 Weeks. You could just skip the orals too and your sides/risks will be minimal.
You could run same cycle with EQ instead of Mast. I wouldnt run the 3 together yet as you want to single out new drugs and see how you respond to each.
Avoid Tren (over kill and sides), Clen (risk/reward), Nandrolone / Dianabol / Anadrol (counterproductive), SARMS (unproven / unknown).
you said the same thing about the american eagle a year ago on my first cycle post
I got off a cycle a few months ago so I believe I have a few more months to cool down before I shut my sack down again.
thanks for the info sir