T Nation

This is Pretty Sick...

Most people will agree that children shouldn’t be involved in psyops.

But does anybody understand the message Israel is sending to Lebanon with this operation?

http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/060717/481/f9bc38f9a3a9401fb864a02b3a24f678

I don’t think that’s happening on a large scale and I also don’t believe it was a planned op.

[quote]Nominal Prospect wrote:
I don’t think that’s happening on a large scale and I also don’t believe it was a planned op.[/quote]

Is there any kind of investigation on why grade schoolers are allowed anywhere near a military position ?

Both sides are recruiting and training radicals. The army canon fodder.

[quote]k.elkouhen wrote:
Nominal Prospect wrote:
I don’t think that’s happening on a large scale and I also don’t believe it was a planned op.

Is there any kind of investigation on why grade schoolers are allowed anywhere near a military position ?
[/quote]

Warzone. Middle East. Investigation concluded.

[quote]k.elkouhen wrote:
Is there any kind of investigation on why grade schoolers are allowed anywhere near a military position ?
[/quote]

Even though the soldiers are engaged in only sparse combat, I really don’t think their duties involve babysitting the neighborhood children.

Really, stop being such a propaganda swilling dufus.

In general, children are proud of their military, and have hatred for the enemy, and if they can find a way to play and have fun while serving those feelings, then they will.

I’m more concerned about Hezbollah purposely firing rockets at civilians in Israel than about whether children are playing where they shouldn’t.

Get a grip. If you want to claim sick and evil, you should really look at what groups have been purposely targeting civilians (terrorism) in an attempt to get their way while working against the wishes of even their own local government.

You know I hate to disagree with you Vroom. But 3 Israeli soldiers were abducted. I think we can all agree that they were not civilian targets.
The Israeli responded by targetting civilians in Gaza and Lebanon. Or how would you call the blockade off Lebanese ports? The bombing of the airport?

But that really doesn’t matter. This vicious circle of revinge must stop. The sooner it stops, the better.

Waiting for the other side to stop is the same as hoping they’re smarter than us (who ever they and us might be). It’s important that both sides come to their sences and do what they can to avoid any further escalation.

[quote]vroom wrote:
k.elkouhen wrote:
Is there any kind of investigation on why grade schoolers are allowed anywhere near a military position ?

Even though the soldiers are engaged in only sparse combat, I really don’t think their duties involve babysitting the neighborhood children.
[/quote]

Are you telling me those shells weren’t being guarded ? I doubt any army leaves ammunition untended.

By the way, did you notice the adult in the background?

What’s a dufus ? I googled but couldn’t find it.

As you have probably guessed English is not my native language. So I’ll apologize once and for all for my broken english.

[quote]Wreckless wrote:
You know I hate to disagree with you Vroom. But 3 Israeli soldiers were abducted. I think we can all agree that they were not civilian targets.
The Israeli responded by targetting civilians in Gaza and Lebanon. Or how would you call the blockade off Lebanese ports? The bombing of the airport?[/quote]

Nobody said the 3 soldiers were civilian targets. However, do you suggest that rockets flying into Israel, aimed at generic population centers, are not targeting civilians?

Blockading a port is not killing civilians.

Bombing the runway (at the airport) is also not killing civilians.

So, tell me, do you think launching unguided rockets into a city is targeting civilians or not?

Also, tell me, is acting to abduct Israeli soldiers not an act of war on the part of Hezbollah - from within the territory of Lebanon.

As shitty as it all is, Hezbollah takes the blame for the current situation. The whole concept of a proportionate response is a red herring.

[quote]But that really doesn’t matter. This vicious circle of revinge must stop. The sooner it stops, the better.

Waiting for the other side to stop is the same as hoping they’re smarter than us (who ever they and us might be). It’s important that both sides come to their sences and do what they can to avoid any further escalation.[/quote]

You are missing the point. One side, mainly Hezbollah, welcomes escalation and would eliminate Israel, and all it’s civilians, if it could. You don’t just sit around and wait for people like that to pummel away at you.

Considering the direction we were headed, with Israel withdrawing from disputed territories, peace was within reach. All it will take is for the terrorist attacks, the rockets and so forth, to stop.

I’m sure Israel will de-escalate, once again, and give the opposing side another chance to reject peace.

[quote]k.elkouhen wrote:
Are you telling me those shells weren’t being guarded ? I doubt any army leaves ammunition untended.

By the way, did you notice the adult in the background?
[/quote]

I don’t care. It’s a total non-issue. Trying to make it one is silly. Were the children harmed? No. Could they carry the ammo off? No. Did they harm anyone? No.

The west, and half the arab world, understands that Hezbollah brought this about and hopefully Hezbollah will be dismantled. With them out of the way, and an elected government in Lebanon, there will be a chance for peace.

A chance. Finally.

[quote]Wreckless wrote:
The Israeli responded by targetting civilians in Gaza and Lebanon. Or how would you call the blockade off Lebanese ports? The bombing of the airport?
[/quote]

On what planet are ports, airports, and roads NOT military targets? I could name, oh, fifty campaigns in less than five minutes where ports, airports, and/or roads were either key objectives or destroyed to deny something to the enemy.

[quote]vroom wrote:
k.elkouhen wrote:
Are you telling me those shells weren’t being guarded ? I doubt any army leaves ammunition untended.

By the way, did you notice the adult in the background?

I don’t care. It’s a total non-issue. Trying to make it one is silly. Were the children harmed? No. Could they carry the ammo off? No. Did they harm anyone? No.
[/quote]

I don’t remember seeing any american chidren writing stuff on US bombs or being any where near them during Gulf war I or II.

Why is that ?

I also hope that they will be dismantled.

Hey, I’d actually like them to be dismembered.

But it’s not going to happen.

Give me just one example of a BIG criminal organisation -like the mafia for example- that has been dismantled.

Stop being so naive.

An elected government is NOT a magic bullet. Hamas was part of an elected government after all…

[quote]k.elkouhen wrote:
vroom wrote:
k.elkouhen wrote:
Are you telling me those shells weren’t being guarded ? I doubt any army leaves ammunition untended.

By the way, did you notice the adult in the background?

I don’t care. It’s a total non-issue. Trying to make it one is silly. Were the children harmed? No. Could they carry the ammo off? No. Did they harm anyone? No.

I don’t remember seeing any american chidren writing stuff on US bombs or being any where near them during Gulf war I or II.

Why is that ?

The west, and half the arab world, understands that Hezbollah brought this about and hopefully Hezbollah will be dismantled.

I also hope that they will be dismantled.

Hey, I’d actually like them to be dismembered.

But it’s not going to happen.

Give me just one example of a BIG criminal organisation -like the mafia for example- that has been dismantled.

With them out of the way, and an elected government in Lebanon, there will be a chance for peace.

A chance. Finally.

Stop being so naive.

An elected government is NOT a magic bullet. Hamas was part of an elected government after all…

[/quote]

American children weren’t writing on bombs because they won’t ALL eventually be in the army. They don’t have family members in the forces because the American military is not a citizen militia.

You do understand that everyone in Israel is either in the army or is in the reserves, right?

[quote]k.elkouhen wrote:
I don’t remember seeing any american chidren writing stuff on US bombs or being any where near them during Gulf war I or II.

Why is that ?[/quote]

Perhaps because they didn’t live in Kuwait? Perhaps military units weren’t camped out in their back yards?

The mafia. It may still exist, but it isn’t like it once was.

[quote]Stop being so naive.

An elected government is NOT a magic bullet. Hamas was part of an elected government after all…[/quote]

LOL. I said it was a chance.

The Lebanese government, if you are paying attention and reading between the lines never had the strength to control it’s own country.

It is possible, that after this, if everything turns out right, that they will have the strength to exert the rule of law over their own land.

I wasn’t talking about being a democracy and magically becoming peaceful or anything like that…

[quote]ChuckyT wrote:
Wreckless wrote:
The Israeli responded by targetting civilians in Gaza and Lebanon. Or how would you call the blockade off Lebanese ports? The bombing of the airport?

On what planet are ports, airports, and roads NOT military targets? I could name, oh, fifty campaigns in less than five minutes where ports, airports, and/or roads were either key objectives or destroyed to deny something to the enemy.[/quote]

An extension of that thought would be to suggest that the world trade centres was a viable target to Al’Qeada as it was the financial centre of everything said antagonists hated, no?

Not saying I think you are right or wrong, and in fact I feel I need to know more on the history from less subjective sources than today’s news to have a clear opinion on what I feel about this one…I’m just saying is all… A ‘viable’ target doesn’t necessarily make it the ‘right’ thing to target.

[quote]vroom wrote:
k.elkouhen wrote:
I don’t remember seeing any american chidren writing stuff on US bombs or being any where near them during Gulf war I or II.

Why is that ?

Perhaps because they didn’t live in Kuwait? Perhaps military units weren’t camped out in their back yards?

Give me just one example of a BIG criminal organisation -like the mafia for example- that has been dismantled.

The mafia. It may still exist, but it isn’t like it once was.

Stop being so naive.

An elected government is NOT a magic bullet. Hamas was part of an elected government after all…

LOL. I said it was a chance.

[/quote]

Gotcha, you LOLed.

I win. Those are the rules.

End of discussion :slight_smile:

In my opinion, a cease fir is only a temporary solution. We should just let them beat the shit out of each other until one wins. This is the only real solution. If you want peace prepare for war. As for the article, this nothing more than GI’s putting stuff on planes and bombs in WWII. I wish our country still had a WWII mentality. The pussification of America has to stop.

American children collected scrap metal to make bombs.

[quote]Zap Branigan wrote:

k.elkouhen wrote:

I don’t remember seeing any american chidren writing stuff on US bombs or being any where near them during Gulf war I or II.

American children collected scrap metal to make bombs. [/quote]

Yeah that’s true.

But were they involved in war propaganda ?

I don’t think so. However, I may be wrong.

I think this is on target with the Isreal situation and not a bad thing. They’ve been assulted constantly and are living in a hostile area where they deal with terror every day. Kids must deal with it too.

I think this strengthens and unites their cause to exist. That’s all they want…to exist.