T Nation

Thinnest Test Needle


Im 32. I've gone from 145 lbs to 176 over a period of 4 years @ 5'6". Currently, I am approximately around 8 - 10%. I've tried prohormones and I dont want to use them anymore; I find them ineffective in the long-run and cause all kinds of internal havoc. I am now ready start cycling correct cycles, but am very averse to needles. I've had shots before like anybody else, and I feel that the 27ga ... maybe even 25ga needles might be OK for me. It is my understanding though that most oil steroids are thick and will not pass through anything thinner than 22 or so. I've seen a 22. It scares me. I can already see the "pussy" comments coming...chill... I know... I cant help it. What I would like to know is, what is the "thinnest" oil steroid you know of and what is the thinnest needle that can be used for it?

I saw on a forum somewhere that a 27ga can be used for some oil based compound, but... I know what 27ga needles look like (I work for a dental supply company) and it just looks way too thin for anything thicker than water...so im skeptical at what I've read. This is why I come to the experts of Tnation.

the kind of steroids im most interested in are those considered basic.
I'm not interested in tren or other super high side-effect steroids.

I'm interested in something along the lines of testosterone, deca, eq .. etc... steroids considered relatively safe by "non-pro-card" users. I will eventually be using this with HGH once I get the hang of how my body responds to the injectables.
I am basically in somewhat of a new mode. For the past 4 years, I was basically in the "as much muscle as possible as quickly as possible to look as hard and tough as possible" ... now... I've recognized that I am not going to get a pro-card for a handful of reasons, the main one being my torn up shoulder, so I've given up that balls to the wall mentality about putting on muscle.

What I am interested in now is to maintain my youth and vitality. I wanna live fuller and longer, physiologically speaking...which is why I now wanna stay away from the methylated compounds and just use low dose oils as well as hgh to accomplish this. I do though, still wanna put on some more muscle, but not much too much more.... around 190 pretty lean is around what I want to maintain over the course of the rest of my youthful life...so im thinking a smidge above TRT style dosing would be my target range (im in no great hurry). I will be consulting a doctor soon to figure out what my current hormone, lipid levels, and overall state of health. I've not yet figured out the proper dosing for this...but... suggestions on this would be appreciated as well.

What I had in mind was some kind of test, deca, hgh, and low doses of arimidex during cycle.

Other suggestions are also welcome.
I know I'm a noob. I wanna learn from you. Teach me.


Without going into a discussion of how fluids move through tubes, pipes, needles.

29g insulin needles are fine to use.

Drawing with them is difficult but its possible. Alternative method is to take a normal 3cc syringe with a bigger needle, draw out the oil, then backfill the insulin needle.

There is no way to categorize steroids by how thick thye are unless you are exclusively using pharmaceutical grade stuff. That info can be had with a google search.

UGLs use all different kinds of oil. Vegetable, soy, cottonseed, grapeseed are common.

Warming the oil makes it flow easier.

Borrow the smallest needle your office has. Put some oil in it some how. Press the plunger. Watch how easily (and fast i.e. how much pressure is generated) the oil comes out.

If youre really interested in how all of this works pick up a physics book and read about how flow changes depending on the diameter and length of the needle and the diameter of the plunger.

I dont recommend deca. Ill use tren 10 times out of 10 compared to deca. If you dont suffer from nadrolone side effects then deca is a great drug. If you do, its the absolute worst.


Thanks Bonez.

I didnt think of drawing with a thicker needle. I've tried drawing oil with a thin needle, and it didnt work well... I used a 30ga. I didnt think of drawing with at thicker needle and plunging with a thin needle. This solves my problem. I thought that if it wouldnt draw, then it wont plunge... I didnt take in consideration that theres so much more pressure plunging the oil than drawing it. Great suggestion bud. A 29ga needle is something i can handle.


Test and GHRP-6 would be a better cycle if you want to play it safe IMO. Backloaded insulin monojects are incredibly easy and effective for small volume injections. For example, if you wanted to use 350mg of Test E a week you would inject .2ml ED (assuming 250mg/ml). I use this method, and I wouldn't go back to using higher gauge needles.


One thing you may be confused on.

Insulin syringes (29,30g) do not have unscrewable needles. You have to take the plunger out and squirt the oil in from the back.

Regular syringes (3cc) have unscrewable needles. But Ive never seen smaller than 27g. Drawing with a 23g and replacing it with a 25g is very common


I am learning. Thank you. Ill give the 29 a shot. haha. 'a shot' .. get it?

the 27 & 30ga needles we have at work at for anesthesia... metal hub needles that are meant for cw syringes (anesthesia bottle slides INTO the syringe...back end of needle punctures top of of bottle... other end injects into patient)

Thanks for all the info Bonez. Youre a great help.


ghrp-6 is fascinating. ive read a lot about a lot of stuff steroid related... not so much on gh. I just read the info on hgrp-6 and seems like what you said... fairly safe. The site did say though that it causes huge amounts of weight gain. I was targeting 190 ... only cause I wanted to keep the steroid use at levels that wont affect my health adversely. this though, ghrp-6. seems like its something that would push my weight waay up there through appetite stimulation. i suppose i dont mind getting up to 200.... the test should help keep fat down anyway.... right?

would ghrp-6 have any positive effects on natural test production? in other words... would taking ghrp-6 with test help keep my natural test production up at any level during my test cycle? or is hcg still something of value during and on closing the cycle? i remember reading somewhere that some types of hgh stimulate test production to some degree. Is that right?


The appetite stimulation is not significant with 100mcg of GHRP-6. It's easy to manage, anyway, you won't feel the urge to run to the nearest buffet with that dose.

You would use hCG on cycle to maintain testicular function, not GHRP-6 or hGH.


i see. thanks.


GHRP6 has no effect on testosterone, that I know of.


Im not that comfortable with backfilling.

I built a little holder custom with padded grippers to hold the bottle and syringe upside down and stable, I warm the oil, let it fill. Took about 20 minutes and a few little rubber grippers and a stand for electronics work.

With a 29 half incher it takes about 3-4 minutes to fill a full mL.

I go do something else, come back and shoot. Shooting takes about twice as long mL per mL as a 25 or 23 gauge.

But you should not be shooting fast anyways, and really for everyday injects your not shooting 3 ml usually, a 29 half inch feels like nothing compared to a 1 inch 25g, the ammount of scar tissue/pain/damage with a 29 is just not even close.

If I need up to 2ml's everyday ill load two 29's and shoot both into two different sites on rotation, or use larger needles and shoot quads, glutes, etc, if more than ill use a 3ml syringe with a normal needle on it, usually a 25g.

I was worried at first that a half inch isnt deep enough for even delts, tris, pecs, which are usually lean on most guys, but I trusted Bill, and sure enough, no issues at all. I still do deep on quads and such even though I know Im likely lean enough. Big muscles just dont bother me in the slightest with a 25g, cant feel it, so its a non-issue.

Do it, dont cling to nonsense. Dont rape your shoulders and pecs with huge pins, your just damaging the tissues.

I use 29 half inchers for every upper body injection site, and I dont really use my bis or tris or even lats often, just delts and pecs, better reach, Im steadier, with smaller needles you really have to work at it to abuse a site.

I use 25 1 inchers for quads, or 1.5 inchers based on mostly whim. Most often the 1 inch.

And always 25, 1.5 inchers for glutes.

I used to be all gung ho like every-other guy, thinking a little injection pain was just a tickle, a part of the game, using 23's for lots of stuff, 1.5's in quads, 1 inch needles in delts and pecs, I always just thought deeper is better, but it doesn't seem to matter as long as you play it smart, that extra half inch isnt worth anything but scars.


Nice. This makes oil possible for me. Im now doing research for what I will be using. Ill probably start it in two months....more likely 3. I gotta finish this bad decision I made, recoop, normalize, then do some test.


Find a good source you trust that uses Ethyle Oleate(if your not allergic) and it should go through a 27g no problem.


29g sounds so much sexier. ill look that up though... ill assume it will go through 29g fine as well.


The OP has no idea of what his hormone levels are, but wants to inject "a smidge above TRT levels", doesn't want to gain much muscle, has no idea what he wants to do in terms of steroid use or any other therapy for that matter, and everyone is providing advise on the length and gauge of needles he should be using. Am I the only one who sees something wrong with this picture?


If you had a fear of needles why would you even bother doing research on injectible drugs?

Doesnt it make sense to get past your fear of needles before putting much time into making definite plans?

He said hes waiting a few months before doing anything. What exactly is wrong with the picture


No he should definitely be doing the research if he's considering it. Especially considering it sounds like its going to take awhile for him to get over his needle phobia. It's one thing to get over it before you have the stuff and another when it's in your hands about ready to enter your system.

So many people have talked about how hard the first inj. was for them. They sat there for like an hour trembling before finally doing it. I think once everyone gets over that hump you're home free. You just have to man up and do it. Though I don't think anyone wants to sit there for five minutes with a needle in them...

I'm completely shocked at people talking about test inj with 27 and 29g needles. That seems absolutely fucking insane to me. I only did ONE injection with a 25g 1" and that was enough to make sure I never did that again. The test was damn near impossible to get through a needle that small. Took probably close to three minutes. I'll never go smaller than 23g, ever.


I dont know what the first half of your rambling was about.


A 29g needle attached to a 1ml or .5ml insulin syringe acts much differently than it would if it were attached to a 3ml syringe. It would be difficult to use a 23g needle attached to a 10ml syringe compared to a 18g needle.

Physics. Its important here.


If you had a serious fear of flying/heights would you go about looking for the best places to skydive, before trying to get over your phobias??

the fuck has the common sense gone???


obama is in the white house common sense was outlawed