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Thermogenic vegetables

NHE says that some vegetables are so thermogenic that the carbs don’t count. Is that true?

Who is the NHE by the way? I’m not too sure if those claims are in anyway substansially true. The only vegie I know of that might cause this are a certain type of peppers (red I think). Spice tends to increase the metabolism by roughly 25% for a duration of an hour depending on the quanity consumed. However, it’s not a bit surprising that spicy foods make you crave water no? :slight_smile: Water acts as a body coolant so don’t expect miracles and don’t deprive yourself of water either. :slight_smile:

By the way, can you post the link to the source of that information so I can read it up myself? Link or article you read in a certain mag?

Thanks,

Joe.

Its Natural Hormonal Enhancement by Rob Faigin. He has a list of 10 of these carb-free vegetables but I didn’t see any references about them.

I showed Ko this post last night and he said that there is no such thing. I’ll see if he can post something more specific.

I have heard that celery takes more calories to digest than it has in it. I don’t know if this is true or not, but if it were the case-it would be thermogenic.

The term thermogenic is being misused here; however, some vegetables (such as raw brocolli and calliflower) can have a negative caloric impact due to the fact that it requires more energy to digest the veggies than the actual calorie content of the vegetables themselves.

I think Joel hit it on the head there. I’ve read the book and believe it’s this negative calories due to digestion that he means.

The secret is out! It’s the new MD6 replacement…Broc6. I’ve tried it and this stuff has ROCKS!
Seriously, vegetables can be great. It really depends on the veg. and it’s carb count though (G.I. level too!).
Some would fit into the “zero carb count” though…I really wouldn’t think of them as anything thermogenic in the fat burning sense.

The idea that foods have negative caloris is a myth. There are still people out their trying to push this as the next “diet”. Heres a little excerpt from a site that I found:

If losing excess pounds is a goal of yours, then read on. An amazing new diet has been discovered by a medical doctor. The Catabolic Diet includes over 100 foods that require more calories (energy) to digest them than the total caloric value of the food. As a result, stored fat is burned up from your body. According to the doctor, this “diet works three times faster than starvation” with an average daily weight loss of one pound a day. Accuracy and results, of course, are guaranteed.

If this sounds too good to be true, it is. This diet is an old gimmick that has been repackaged. Several years ago, there was a widely circulated list of 19 foods that cause you to lose weight. (No food causes weight loss). The promotional literature stated that these foods have negative calories, and even if you ate too much, you could still lose weight easily. In fact, the more you ate, the more weight you would loose. A partial list of these “exceptionally healthy” foods included coffee, celery, cauliflower, onions, and apples.

The concept behind this diet is that a person will burn more calories chewing the food than are in the food itself. Plus, the body will burn up more calories during digestion than the total calories in the food. Best of all is that you didn’t have to make any dietary changes. You could eat cake, pastries, butter, ice cream, or anything you liked. Just add some of these negative calorie foods to your usual meal and watch the pounds of fat disappear.

People quickly figured out that weight loss won’t happen by chewing certain foods. But the idea of negative calorie foods obviously has staying power. What weight loss method could be easier than having no accountability for total caloric intake and being able to eat all of those high fat foods? After several years, this weight loss method faded into history, only to resurface as The Catabolic Diet. The Catabolic Diet uses the following examples: “A 300 calorie piece of cake may require 50 calories to be digested resulting in a net gain of 250 calories to be added to your fat storage. On the other hand, a 25 calorie catabolic food may require 100 calories to digest, resulting in a net loss of 75 calories from your stored fat deposit.”

The Catabolic Diet is another example of slick marketing. One of the ways nutrition fraud survives is through creativity. People are always looking for something new to help with weight reduction, especially when the latest weight loss craze doesn’t work and no longer is appealing. Like all weight loss gimmicks, The Catabolic Diet takes the physiological fact that the body requires energy (calories) to digest food and builds a falsehood around it. The digestive process is very complex and well regulated. It is a myth that foods have negative calories. If the previous examples were true, weight loss would happen by eating rice cakes all day, regardless of how many were eaten. Losing weight by eating apples, celery, cauliflower, and other very low calorie foods have nothing magical about them. People lose weight in two ways: they are taking in less food than their body requires and/or they are expending more calories than they are taking in.

I dont get it… if cellery is 25 cals and it takes 100 cals to digest it… u still burn 75 extra cals that u woulnt have burned unless u ate the cellery???

It does not take 100 calories to digest 25 calories of celery, but there are people who want you to buy into their diet who will tell ou that it does. Your body is very efficient, and if you are aleady on a low calorie diet, your body is not going to waste calories on digestion. Much of the work in digestion is a chemical, and gravitational process anyways, so I doubt the caloric expenditure is that great anyways.

Agree with KO. I’ve seen myself put on fat from eating (as in several lbs. per day) of broccoli, cauliflower, onions, salads, etc. Grapefruit was also another thing being promoted as something that led to weight loss.

now i got it thanks ko

In “Massive Eating,” John Berardi makes you calculate the thermic effect of the foods you are eating. I would think that there is a bit of truth to some foods creating a caloric deficit in the digestion process. Don’t get me wrong…it isn’t going to cause weight loss, but I think there is some truth to it. Any time you run food through your system, your body MUST create energy to pass it through.

All bodily systems require energy and of course this includes digestion but the body will NEVER consume more calories digesting than contained in the food being digested. The body is smarter than this. As Kelly said, you can gain weight on any food if consuming enough of it. If there was nay truth to this nonsense of a food requiring more energy to digest than it contains, than you would literally starve to death if only eating that food…not going to happen.

Do you think before and after glucose tests would detect any absorbed carbs?

how bout this-lets say you eat 50 cals of protein…with the thermic effect of protein how many of those cals will yourbody burn during digestion. i would think almost all of them even if your body down regulates?? am i wrong again??

It’s absurd to think your body burns up most of the calorie content of protein during digestion. If this was the case, you would never be able to build or support any muscle because you wouldn’t be able to get protein into the body. And also if this was the case, NOBODY would be fat because of all the “calories consumed in digestion”. In reality, digestion is very efficient and consumes very little of the calorie content of the foods and this is why most of us can easily put on fat and are always having to cut. geeesh! The thermic value of food is a small % of total calories.

I think that the thermic effect of protein comes from the fact that your body converts extra protein in glucose. If you burned 1g of protein in a bomb-box (or whatever those things are called), you’d get 4 kcal of heat. However, you body expends energy converting the protein into carbs (throwing away the nitrogen), so you only get .85g of carbs from 1g of protein. Put that .85g of carbs in a calorimeter (is that what it’s called) and you’d get 3.4 kcal of heat. I think.

Think about this. Water has no calories. When you ingest water, your body must use energy to process it. Your body must use even more energy to warm the water if it is cooled or contains ice. Have you ever urinated ice water? Absolutely not! Where does your body get the energy to process it? Food, no matter what origin, P,F, or C requires the body to use energy to process it. The process is called “peristousis” (sp?) This is the process of the digestive system contracting and churning food to process it. Again–this process isn’t going to cause extreme weight loss, but some foods will ALWAYS require more energy to process than they contribute. Fiber is another example. We need it, but it does nothing nutritionally based for the body.