No. But smoking a joint once per month isn’t going to (according to literature) have much of an impact
As to enacting policy change… I’m damn tempted to get involved. Either ban alcohol/tobacco (public backlash would be too great) or erase current hypocritical double standards
Would you agree that the current militaristic/assault style war on drugs is expensive and ineffective? If we openly celebrate the notion of drinking/drinking to excess (We have a HORRIBLE binge drinking culture in Aus). It would be beneficial in nature to have the same risk/reward ratio when looking at currently illicit substances. We need to take a rational approach, put in the research (long term effects, effect on neurology long term, burden of disease induced, addictive potential) regarding current illicit substances be it psychoactive or performance enhancing drugs
Thinking the “prohibitive, punish, fine and imprison” measures currently in place would be effective has turned out (in my opinion) to be a grave mistake
I understand you’re frustration regarding anecdotal experience. I lost a good friend (we were inseparable) due to extensive alteration present within his demeanour (heavy drinker, used drugs daily)… he’s better now (supposedly, lost contact)… this didn’t change my conveyed ideology. A select few will acquire substance abuse disorders. The same can be said about gambling, sex… just about any vice. Within regards to softer substances, this is an exception to the norm
A person casually popping a tablet of ecstasy isn’t typically a threat to society, nor is he a selfish, good for nothing addict. Many use these substances occasionally with the intent of merely having a good time on occasion (yes, good times can be had without drugs… that’s not what I’m getting at… I’m referring to the notion of enhancing an experience. Say at a club, music festival etc… to say “no, you need to go to jail ASAP for use of a substance arguably safer than booze” seems ludicrous. If we are to tolerate alcohol, we should set a bar of which states substances deemed less dangerous than alcohol should theoretically be legal to take (we don’t have enough research to accurately decipher which these are)
I’ve heard “that doesn’t make sense, just because it’s not as bad doesn’t mean it should be legal”… sure it does, because if this is the case, then why IS alcohol legal but shrooms net one jail time?
And it’s a serious issue that shouldn’t be taken lightly, drug addiction is no joke, it ruins lives… can hurt the user and those around the user (if the user steals, lies, cheats ad manipulates)
One must remember though such behaviour isn’t typically associated with say… cannabis, anabolic steroids, psychedelic drugs etc. thus I believe the punishments (for this and many reasons more) are disproportionate in nature.
Im a former Marine grunt so the word “militaristic” is just silly to me. No offense. We’re some brutal savage mfer’s. I doubt the Aussie fellas; great soldiers btw, are going militaristic on ye
I’m sorry to hear about you’re brother, that’s rough…
Cavity searches for all those indicated via drug dogs at pubs, train stations and festivals… police tackling teenagers, shoving their face into the ground over a joint… mandatory prison sentencing for AAS possession in QLD/NT, roadside drug tests pinging you over smoking some weed three days ago… sounds fairly extreme.
Granted the ACT legalised cannabis this year, it’s a step towards the right direction
I should clarify, within my conveyed ideology I don’t believe meth, heroin, cocaine, barbiturates etc should be regulated and legalised… decriminalised for possession pertaining to very small amounts perhaps (in which a fine, referral to a detox centre etc) may be a better route than putting said person in prison, having them associate with hardened criminals and be unable to acquire employment when they get out… I believe this turns people to crime rather than acting as a rehabilitative measure/deterrent.
I dislike the notion that people should expect unreasonable force to be used against them if they don’t comply. If I’m smoking a reefer, minding my own business, I don’t deserve to be tackled/tasered if I refuse to put it down… I shouldn’t have to put it down to begin with. I’m fine with police… however my experience with cops has been nothing short of “abusing power and appearing to find pleasure within ruining some poor kids life”… one stupid mistake you made at a music festival aged seventeen shouldn’t determine how the rest of you’re life plays out (criminal record = abysmal employment opportunity)
I understand it isn’t the cops fault, they are enforcing government law… though the strip/cavity searches in NSW don’t appear to be government mandated, furthermore a cop should have something better to do with their time then bust some kid with a minuscule amount of pot/whatever… go after the supplier, not the user… do something productive
Is he beyond the point of rehabilitation/no return… meth isn’t a substance one can survive on… it induces rapid deterioration of the user. The neurotoxic, cardiac effects are of particular concern. Theres a reason you don’t see any old meth-heads (sorry if I’m being insensitive)
If he’s beyond the point of no return, I’d suggest ensuring he doesn’t take advantage of you. Those who are heavily addicted to hard drugs looking for a fix when out of funds can be incredibly manipulative… they’ll do ANYTHING to get that fix (have you seem requiem for a dream… the part towards the end… what the dudes GF goes through to score smack will give you an idea)… Though the abcess/arm schtick was inaccurate. Many IV drug users develop these all the time, they simply drain the accesses before they get so infected amputation becomes a necessity.
I wanted to create another subthread discussing gun control, but I saw it had been done three times prior and thus perhaps people wouldn’t want to discuss it
Literal rat claws… that’s a fairly spot on depiction given how emaciated these people tend to be
Methamphetamine has ravaged Australia, America has it’s opiate epidemic… we have the ice epidemic… KIDS are using this shit (like aged 14)… Prohibition isn’t doing anything to stop the manufacture/usage though.
I recall reading an interview/writeup from a British emergency physician practicing to Australia. He recalled “what happens here on a daily basis regarding ice/hospital admissions would cripple the NHS”
He recounted patients having to be given anaesthetic dosages of sedatives just to calm them down… I can only imagine how extensive the tachycardia would be during one of these erratic, psychotic episodes… I’d imagine chest pain/angina would be present from prolonged arrythmia (cardiomyopathy notwithstanding)… Entering the hospital with a RHR of 190BPM… (I don’t know how high it gets, but I do know adrenergic storm is a potential consequence stemming from methamphetamine usage)… caffeine can also cause this in sufficient amounts, as can cocaine
MAOI’s can also induce it if foods high in tyramine are consumed (MAOI’s are nasty drugs, primarily phased out for good reason)… so no fermented pickles on MAOI’s… PUT THOSE PICKLES DOWN
He’s not emaciated at all. The dummy was actually a very accomplished hockey player. Played in Europe. Just started doing speed. Spoiled growing up too. Has a union job but always disappears when it’s piss test time.
The future won’t be kind to him if he continues using this shit. Has he expressed any desire to quit?
Many don’t/won’t
I give you my sympathies regarding you’re situation. I imagine it must be painful to watch such self destructive behaviour without being able to do anything about it.
This is the sub-topic that will likely put me at odds with some T-Nation posters and libertarians and other “freedom”-obsessed people.
Here is perhaps by way of compliment what I think or rightfully or wrongfully assume about the average T-Nation demographic:
Above-average intelligence.
Low time preference.
College or advanced degree.
Above average income.
Physically fit.
High investment parenting.
Rule and law abiding.
So… I foresee having a conversation and have had conversations with people who do everything they can to insure their well-being and future and safety and success of their children, even making it so their own might not even have the option or thought of using drugs but leave these community and life destroying “freedoms” to others. Many Americans are huge hypocrites in this regard. They want freedoms to be there while making their own unfree. That is, moving to a super zip or gentrified area and/or slapping the shit out of their own kids if they were to come home high on drugs.
With enough abuse one or a community isn’t “free”! No one is free being a slave to vice! When I worked in a high-drug-use town for five years I wasn’t waking around on lunch breaks as freely as I do in my town and I wasn’t “laid back” in doing so… for good reason.
Do you see a clear differentiation between hard and soft substances? Do you recognise cannabis won’t have the same societal impact, even if used en masse compared to say… crystal meth. My ideology doesn’t advocate for the legalisation of hard drugs, though I do think prison sentences are stupid, counterproductive, a waste of public resources and lead to the individual being very likely to re-offend when let out… a criminal record = lack of employment options = organised crime
How exactly does a parent enforce this… once the kid is in college (18-21+) a parent has little grasp over their child… who has presumably moved away
I don’t think the punitive approach (especially physical violence) is the right answer to this. It depends on the maturity and age of the child… if a 13 y/o comes home high, something needs to be done… literature demonstrates even occasional use has the potential to profoundly impact brain development, stunt cognition (potentially)… these risks appear dramatically/entirely level off if the child starts over the age of seventeen. Alcohol is admittedly worse… but the younger a child is, the more adamant one needs to be that this is unacceptable behaviour. Even when legalised, a parent should never condone/enforoce behaviours such as the consumption of alcohol (to excess), smoking tobacco etc. There probably is the prospect of responsible, low dosage marijuana usage, but how much is say the equivalent of one drink… we don’t know yet, nor are we quite there in terms fo societal progression wherein a parent will give their grown child (say 18-20) cannabis… but alcohol appears to be viewed within a different light
Well then ban fatty foods, gambling, cigarettes, porngraphy (and at times… sex) AND alcohol. To stipulate it’s possible to live in a society free of vice would be absurd. What we can try do is mitigate the harms associated with these vices.
Food, though it can be addictive, is sold for nourishment, to keep us alive. The other three aren’t. Hence there are restrictions on the others which are only used for diversion and several societies have flat-out banned them or made them difficult to access. Personally I wouldn’t give a rat’s ass if they weren’t around, though I think flat-out outlawing nicotine and gambling would be excessive and silly. I wouldn’t be the slightest annoyed if porn was outlawed.
I’ll try to comment more later or during the week.
But cannabis, psychedelic drugs etc should be outlawed, people in possession should be given jail sentences despite the fact that chronically they contribute to far less burden of disease, nor are they as dangerous as tobacco.
Had nicotine and alcohol surfaced today (absent of a monopoly being created) I can almost guarantee with our current prohibitive stance in place the substances would’ve been criminalised.
As to pornography being outlawed, I don’t think this should be the case… though I do believe more regulation is required within the industry so those who act in such films can be within a safe environment… rape/sexual assault is incredibly common within this industry and it’s unacceptable
Gambling ruins lives in terms of addiction on par with that of drug use, there are members within my distant family who have lost EVERYTHING to gambling addiction
In terms of areas that have banned alcohol… these tend to be third world countries with authoritative regimes, the basis of said ban pertaining to religious extremism/ideology. I don’t believe religion should dictate our policies
I was being hyperbolic when I mentioned “slapping the shit out of”. If my child were to use hard drugs I would likely feel a profound sadness come over me, maybe even fall into a depression and feel as if I failed. I’d probably break down in tears. I certainly wouldn’t be sleeping easy.
My first moves would be talk, understanding, and compassion. First I would ask WHY?!
With soft substances I believe it’s experimentation… with harder substances I believe a facet of mental illness must be present. I can’t see why any SANE individual would willingly smoke crack/ shoot heroin… it doesn’t make sense
Unfortunately we have a lack of stigma surrounding the abuse (medical use is a very different story) of prescription opiates… snorting/injecting oxycodone is arguably no less addictive than heroin itself
I’ve seen kids smoke this stuff (crudely constructed, burnt in tinfoil)… it’s beyond fucked up that this is somehow considered to be “experimentation”, I have the same problem with cocaine, it’s a substance all too normalised now… yet the harm induced is significant, worse than booze. I don’t think drug experimentation is healthy, yet it appears to be a right of passage for many (I consider alcohol and cigarettes to be within the realm of recreational drug use)
Have you ever smoked a cigarette? Initially it makes one feel very, very good (calm, relaxed, a nice buzz in the head). Whilst dopaminergic dysregulation eventually occurs leading to these effects no longer occurring, I can certainly see why one would find initial use reinforcing