T Nation

The Upside of an Obama Whitehouse


#1

OBAMA IN THE WHITEHOUSE....

Perry de Havilland (London) North American affairs

Unlike many, well, most of my compatriots, I am not filled with a deep sense of gloom and foreboding at the prospect of the most left wing president since FDR gaining the Whitehouse. In truth, I can see many reasons to think it may well be a far better outcome than if a Big State Republican like McCain won.

Of course Obama will bring an avalanche of policies that will be truly appalling and quite wicked, of that I have no doubt, much like his predecessors in office in that respect. As the global economy continues to come unglued, everything Obama does to deal with the mounting crises will I fact make things worse. Civil liberties will be hammered, all in the name of 'fairness', and the flood of regulations pertaining to every aspect of economic life will grow into a drowning ocean.

And that is actually the good news.

Why? Because in truth the Republicans under John "I support the bailout" McCain would scarcely have done much better. The economic global meltdown is only just starting to roll: if you think the sub-prime mortgage crisis was the biggie, just wait until you see the fallout from the fun and frolics of the impending mess in other areas, such as debt swaps. This is all going to get worse, a lot worse, and Obama is going to do absolutely everything to dig the holes deeper. Looking back on this period ten to twenty years from now, the Republicans crying into their beer tonight will be saying "thank Christ it was not us in office then".

The lesser evil is not going to win this time and much as it may not seem that way now... or any time soon I suspect... in the long run this has a far far better chance of leading to the rebirth of a genuine pro-liberty, pro-market political culture that the gradual incremental surrender of recent times made impossible.

Many will find the glee of the statist left over the next few days and weeks hard to endure, but to be honest I have been walking around with a grin all day. Finally the era of gradualism is over and the masks are going to come off. The USA has voted for statism and it is going to get exactly what it voted for at a juncture in history where it will very quickly be impossible to hide the cost of those votes.

Obama is not the start of a new era, he is the death knell for the old one.

http://www.samizdata.net/blog/archives/2008/11/obama_in_the_wh.html


#2

I kind of wanted McCain to win so that the Republicans would have to swim in their own shit for the next four years. They created this meltdown, they should have to fix it.

It’s really not fair to pass this situation to a Dem and blame him for not fixing not. It may actually be beyond repair. Let’s hope not.


#3

BO is a gun grabber that scares the shit out of me.

Higher taxes arent going to fix anything either. If anything they will makes things worse.


#4

[quote]Noodle_Arms wrote:
I kind of wanted McCain to win so that the Republicans would have to swim in their own shit for the next four years. They created this meltdown, they should have to fix it.

It’s really not fair to pass this situation to a Dem and blame him for not fixing not. It may actually be beyond repair. Let’s hope not. [/quote]

Explain to me how pushing lending to unqualified borrowers is the Republicans’ fault.


#5

From the selfish perspective of a non American, I am relieved that McCain lost.

Personally I believe that the US economy is in an extremely unhealthy situation, and regardless of which party is in control, things will get nasty over the next few years. If John McCain had won, I have no doubt that everything would be blamed on 12 years of “free market policies”. Regardless of how much government interference was present during that time, I have no doubt that capitalism would take the blame.

This situation could then easily be used by politicians to justify further government intervention in other countries, including my own. Fuck, my countries prime minister has already declared that the financial crisis was caused by “excessive capitalism”.

The problem is that if you are as ignorant as most people are, it sounds like a reasonable argument.

edit - When I wrote “government intervention in other countries”, I meant by their own governments, not the US.


#6

[quote]jawara wrote:
BO is a gun grabber that scares the shit out of me.

Higher taxes arent going to fix anything either. If anything they will makes things worse.[/quote]

You DO know that the Second Amendment was only ever made so American citizens could protect themselves from British forces in the 1700’s, right? To say that the Amendment has lost all of its true meaning and merit is a huge understatement. I hope we see some gun reformation laws and all of their lobbyist supporters (see: NRA) squirm in their seats.

Remember, guns don’t kill people, people kill people. With guns.


#7

[quote]SSC wrote:
jawara wrote:
BO is a gun grabber that scares the shit out of me.

Higher taxes arent going to fix anything either. If anything they will makes things worse.

You DO know that the Second Amendment was only ever made so American citizens could protect themselves from British forces in the 1700’s, right? To say that the Amendment has lost all of its true meaning and merit is a huge understatement. I hope we see some gun reformation laws and all of their lobbyist supporters (see: NRA) squirm in their seats.

Remember, guns don’t kill people, people kill people. With guns.[/quote]

What an absolutely ignorant fucking statement. Good grief.

EDIT: I just seen that you’re listed as being from Michigan. What an embarrassment to the rest of us Michiganders. I’m betting you’re from the Detroit area, that would explain your douchebaggery a little.


#8

[quote]SSC wrote:
Remember, guns don’t kill people, people kill people. With guns.[/quote]

And knives. And rope. And cars (actually, a LOT more with cars). And their bare hands. And round house kicks. And shovels. And baseball bats. And poisons. And pillows.

Really, you can stop me at any time…


#9

This post was flagged by the community and is temporarily hidden.


#10

[quote]SSC wrote:
jawara wrote:
BO is a gun grabber that scares the shit out of me.

Higher taxes arent going to fix anything either. If anything they will makes things worse.

You DO know that the Second Amendment was only ever made so American citizens could protect themselves from British forces in the 1700’s, right? To say that the Amendment has lost all of its true meaning and merit is a huge understatement. I hope we see some gun reformation laws and all of their lobbyist supporters (see: NRA) squirm in their seats.

Remember, guns don’t kill people, people kill people. With guns.[/quote]

Ban yourself from the forum for posting this tripe.


#11

[quote]AssOnGrass wrote:

Explain to me how pushing lending to unqualified borrowers is the Republicans’ fault.[/quote]

That is nowhere near the whole story… and Bush had eight years to do something about it… if he had thought it was a problem!


#12

[quote]Noodle_Arms wrote:
I kind of wanted McCain to win so that the Republicans would have to swim in their own shit for the next four years. They created this meltdown, they should have to fix it.

It’s really not fair to pass this situation to a Dem and blame him for not fixing not. It may actually be beyond repair. Let’s hope not. [/quote]

You are and idiot, Kennedy put the act in place to allow subprime mortgage, Clinton added his twist to really start the downward spriral, Obama actually worked at a lawfirm and was one of the lawyers that filed suite against lenders like Citibank, who were being responsible and not giving out subprime loans.

Guess who tried to stop it, that so called idiot President Bush.

Learn your history, Liberal Dem’s passing bills to allow unqualified people to be considered qualified at whatever we are discussing has ruined the idea of capitolism, democracy and freedom in this country.

Whether it be equal opportunity employment, meaning less qualified employees to fill a minority quota, to our education system. Making it impossible to reward hard working intelligent students because it isn’t “fair” to the ones who aren’t.

But thank God Obama will ruin our country so the ones who have some intelligence can get back in control. It is just too bad we will have to suffer with these idiots through the next couple decades.


#13

[quote]vroom wrote:
AssOnGrass wrote:

Explain to me how pushing lending to unqualified borrowers is the Republicans’ fault.

That is nowhere near the whole story… and Bush had eight years to do something about it… if he had thought it was a problem![/quote]

Bush tried 3 on three separate occasions with 3 separate peices of legislature starting in 2003. Thank the Democrats and corrupt politicians making too much money fromt he fiasco. Not their scapegoat.

Again the outsider sticks his foot in his mouth.


#14

[quote]vroom wrote:
AssOnGrass wrote:

Explain to me how pushing lending to unqualified borrowers is the Republicans’ fault.

That is nowhere near the whole story… and Bush had eight years to do something about it… if he had thought it was a problem![/quote]

Go read up on this subject before pretending to know a fucking thing about it. It has been covered in quite some depth in this forum. The fact that you think Bush attempted to do nothing is laughable.

Or don’t, and get your ass handed to you yet again.


#15

Bush may have tried to stop lending to unqualified borrowers but he didn’t really try to stop the problem at the root. Of course he doesn’t really have the power to turn of the money pump at the Federal Reserve – it is doubtful he even understand why the FED is the problem.

If Bush had been successful at stopping unqualified borrowers the bust would have come from some other misdirected venture as will always happen with cheap an easy money. He didn’t even recognize the dot-com bubble for what it was so…yeah, things aren’t looking good at all.


#16

[quote]apbt55 wrote:
vroom wrote:
AssOnGrass wrote:

Explain to me how pushing lending to unqualified borrowers is the Republicans’ fault.

That is nowhere near the whole story… and Bush had eight years to do something about it… if he had thought it was a problem!

Bush tried 3 on three separate occasions with 3 separate peices of legislature starting in 2003. Thank the Democrats and corrupt politicians making too much money fromt he fiasco. Not their scapegoat.

Again the outsider sticks his foot in his mouth.[/quote]

Learn YOUR history. Don’t you remember Bush’s speech in '03…the one where he said “families with bad credit histories qualify for home ownership loans. You don’t have to have a lousy home for a first-time home buyer…” Remember his Ownership Society? That was a Fannie/Freddie initiative sponsored by Bush’s administration! Deregulation (from '99) is what allowed it.


#17

[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
If Bush had been successful at stopping unqualified borrowers the bust would have come from some other misdirected venture as will always happen with cheap an easy money. He didn’t even recognize the dot-com bubble for what it was so…yeah, things aren’t looking good at all.[/quote]

The dot com bubble burst under Clinton. Bush inherited the bust from 8 years of Clinton.

I might somewhat agree with the rest, but put the blame for the dot com bust and the Enron-like crap squarely on Clinton. They were his babies.


#18

Man this is fucked up shit. The worst part is that race is now strongly tied into it. This is just shaping up to be the perfect storm.


#19

[quote]vroom wrote:
AssOnGrass wrote:

Explain to me how pushing lending to unqualified borrowers is the Republicans’ fault.

That is nowhere near the whole story… and Bush had eight years to do something about it… if he had thought it was a problem![/quote]

His administration recognized the issue and proposed reform. It was shot down by Congress, primarily Frank and Dodd.

The jackasses that ran Freddy and Fannie into the ground are Obama’s chief advisers.


#20

[quote]rainjack wrote:
The dot com bubble burst under Clinton. Bush inherited the bust from 8 years of Clinton.
[/quote]

But that is also a fallacy. The dot-com bubble burst for the same reason – money was cheap and easy. Clinton didn’t try and restrain Greenspan any more than Bush. They both misunderstand the primary causes of malinvestment. And make no mistake – the blame mostly lies with Alan Greenspan.

The only control any president can have on the economy is with tax policy and how they choose to spend counterfeit money. The rest is all an illusion.