@idaho I see a lot of Jocko Willink’s stuff being pushed in the media and fitness areas, I obviously don’t know bupkis, so thought I’d ask, is he putting out good content? Or is it cashing in? I don’t fault him either way, ha, simply curious.
I am aware of his work, but, I have never met him, so, I cannot judge with any professionalism. However, when I see articles with the phrases " World’s Scariest Man" and read comments like this:
He is a lean 230 pounds. He is a Brazilian jiu-jitsu expert who used to tap out 20 Navy SEALs per workout. He is a legend in the Special Operations world. His eyes look through you more than at you.
I have have a tendency to ignore the material, now, that is certainly not fair to him, he may be one of the best. Its just a personal quirk of mine. I just have no experience with him or his methods, maybe someone on this thread can offer an opinion.
1 Like
Wednesday’s Weapon: The .12 gauge Shotgun:
When doing civilian work, (SWAT, Police, DSS), I had access to several weapons systems. If the situation was a barricaded gunman in a large apartment complex, government housing or hotel/ motels, anywhere where projectile penetration was going to be a concern, my usual choice of entry weapon was going to be the 14 inch police model Benelli auto shotgun ( not sold on civilian market). I started carrying a Benelli after a raid on a meth lab, where one of the “security guards” was wearing heavy jacket (winter) and body armor, took about a 6 rounds out of MP-5 and still managed to stay on his feet and fire several rounds back at the entry team. I am sure the meth helped, but, that was too close and unacceptable.
I didn’t switch to the shotgun for a better kill ratio, but, to make sure I had enough “force” to put someone on their ass and stop the fight. It worked on two occasions; however, as much as the media tries to portray it as death ray that doesn’t have to be aimed, this is simply not true. You have to train to use a shotgun effectively, just like any other weapon system.
Shotguns are unique because between 15 and 20 yards, the pellets will actually rise above the point of aim and start dropping after that (average). If you target is in that range, you should aim about 4 to 6 inches lower that the point of impact. If I wanted to shoot a perp in the chest, then the aiming point would be his belt buckle. Since most people buy a shotgun for home defense, this really not an issue, since room ranges would be less than 12/ 14 feet. (Average).
Choice of ammo is another important consideration. In testing that I was involved in, 00 buck shot was not my choice for room combat, these are .32 caliber pellets and their penetration was ( due to the heavier weight) too excessive for cheap apartment walls or sheetrock. (we are talking police action here, not battlefield combat)
The movies always show the cops evacuating the buildings around a hostage situation, but, that is simply not feasible serving a high risk warrant or if there are exigent circumstances ( killed a hostage, children involved, setting the room on fire, etc). Also, you always have to consider that most people are assholes and will lock their apartment doors and refuse to leave, so, over penetration is always a factor.
Our tests concluded that .04 buck was a good compromise. For inside a home, with family present in different rooms, if you decide to use on a shotgun for defense, with very short ranges, then anything from number 5 to 7 shot would work ( IMHO). The shotgun is a valuable tool, but, you must train and learn its advantages and disadvantages. Just always have a mounted light source, holding a flashlight in your hand and operating a pump shotgun is folly.
Shotgun: Another View:
Since 1961, the Mossberg 500 12 gauge pump shotgun and the Remington 870 have been sold to well over 10,000,000 individuals. It has become the favorite first choice of those whom have made the decision to arm themselves for home defense.
The decision to purchase a firearm for home defense must begin with a family meeting and preferably with either a Certified NRA Instructor present or another individual whom the family considers to be knowledgeable in firearms. Before the choice of what firearm is to be purchased comes into play, the family needs to realize that if they should choose to purchase a firearm for home defense, there is a likelihood that they may have to use it against an armed intruder and in so doing either severely injure or even kill them. They need to be shown exactly what it is going to look like both verbally and graphically. They need to be made aware of the high stress factors involved and how they will manifest themselves.
**_They also need to be made aware of the fact that when law enforcement arrives, there is a very good chance they themselves will be arrested. Additionally, there will be criminal court, costly legal counsel and an almost 100% certainty that civil action will be brought against them regardless of the outcome of the criminal trial. None of this is done to discourage the future gun owner. It is done to bring the harsh reality of the situation out in the open so that those whom are considering the purchase of a firearm for home defense can make the decision with all of the facts in front of them.
For the purpose of this article, the family above has weighed all of what was presented to them and has decided to purchase a 12 gauge pump shotgun as their home defense weapon.
There are a number of practices undertaken by the new gun owner which are counter productive to the safe and effective use of the 12 gauge pump shotgun. First and foremost is the belief that just by placing the weapon by their bedside will give them the feeling of protection they were striving towards.
Nothing could be farther from the truth.
The new gun owner who falls victim to the above belief will almost never fire a single round of ammunition and more than likely will not even understand how the weapon operates and what the safety features are. What this means is that when or if an armed intruder invades their home, the immediate realization that the weapon is a completely foreign object in their hands becomes evident at exactly the wrong time. T**hose whom are killed or severely injured by their own firearms fall into this category. Often because the intruder(s) have taken the firearm away from the resident or homeowner and used it on them.**
Associated directly with the above is the fact very few actually practice with their new shotgun. They have no idea of the amount of recoil involved nor do they know what the results will be when firing slugs, 00 Buckshot or Bird shot within their residence at varied distances. S**o, regardless of whether their new shotgun is a Mossberg, Remington or Benelli, a total lack of familiarization results in unsafe and ineffective weapons handling.**
How is this relevant to the use of the tactical shotgun in the home?
To translate this to the private resident and homeowner, by walking the layout of the home or other residence, special needs such as a light, sidesaddle or other modifications can be understood and met. Once your own tactics for dealing with an armed home invasion are recognized and understood, the necessary changes to the shotgun to meet the needs of these tactics can be undertaken.
I addition to learning and understanding the safety and operational features of your shotgun, practice is a must. Focused practice. Learn the longest distance in your home where it may be possible for you to take a shot if necessary. This might be a long hallway, staircase or across the living room. Measure the distances of any conceivable shots you may have to take. Write these distances down and where they occur within your home. Purchase some slugs, 00 Buckshot and yes, birdshot.
Locate a range or other safe location where you can set up targets. Using a standard B27 NRA police silhouette target, begin with five slugs. Before loading your shotgun, be sure you are wearing proper ear and eye protection. After loading all five in your shotgun, aim and fire all five into the mid center chest region of the target at the closest distance you recorded. Don’t concern yourself with speed. Right now, it is technique and follow-thru that counts.
As you begin eliminating unnecessary movements in your technique it will become smoother and speed will come. The same is true with tactical loading techniques, target transitioning and other skills you will eventually learn. After firing the five rounds of slugs into your target, note the shot placement on the target. Tape the five holes made by the slugs. Now, fire one round of 00 Buckshot mid center chest. Most brands of 00 Buckshot contain nine .33 caliber lead or in some cases steel pellets. All nine of those pellets should be in the mid center chest region of the target. Make a note of the position of each hole in your target.
Continue the same procedure at all distances you have recorded. The purpose for using five slugs against one round of 00 Buckshot is to begin centralizing your shot placement through correct sight alignment and target acquisition. By doing so, you will do the same with 00 Buckshot loads thus keeping all pellets in the mid center chest region. Note also the spread of the 00 Buckshot loads at different distances. It is very possible to miss with a shotgun and even peripheral hits will penetrate through a soft body target and either kill or severely injure a family member or innocent bystander behind the target.
Birdshot has been at the center of debate for a long time concerning home defense. Many will tell you that it lacks the punch to stop an armed intruded. You will further be told the spread of the pellets is too wide to insure a solid hit. Prove it to yourself.
Begin at a distance of five feet from the target. With one round of birdshot, aim for mid center chest and fire. Look at the impact area. You will notice the shot pattern has not yet opened up. It is still a solid mass of pellets leaving a ragged hole a bit smaller than an adult’s fist. Medical examiners will tell you this leaves a devastating internal wound cavity thus incapacitating and literally destroying vital organs. This translates to solid stopping power without over penetration. Let us not leave it there, however. Move the target out at five foot increments and fire one round each time, noting the increase in shot spread. In most 18.5” tactical shotgun barrels with an improved cylinder choke, you will begin seeing the shot pattern increase significantly. You will want to stop once the shot pattern increases to 12” in diameter or roughly the same diameter of the average dinner plate. Note the distance at which this occurs. A 12” diameter circle is recommended based on autopsy photos which indicate all major vital organs necessary to a one shot stop are located within that 12” circle when the round is correctly placed in the mid-center chest region.
Practice of this type at least 2-3 times a month or more in the beginning will not only improve your skill level but will also show you the effective ranges of the loads you choose for the home.
1 Like
Thought for the day: A very happy and safe Thanksgiving to all
As you enjoy your holiday, take a silent moment and give thanks to those who serve abroad and to the LEO’s, Fireman, EMT’s , First Responders, who are working today to insure you have a safe holiday.
1 Like
Saturday morning coffee break:
1 Like
Coffee Break:
Coffee Break:
Coffee Break:
1 Like
4 hours of the curriculum you describe for $60 sounds like a good deal to me too. I’m sure you’ll come out of it well ahead, especially if you’ve never trained like that before. Whether that’s enough for you or not depends on what sort of readiness you and your daughter want to achieve, and whether or not you enjoy training martial arts.
It is my privilege to assist my BJJ instructor in delivering a self-defense, safety and awareness class to home care workers at our area hospice (on a no-charge volunteer basis, of course). It is a one hour class that usually runs 15-30 minutes over. We cover vehicle parking tactics, how to approach a residence door in preparation for uncontrolled dogs, room assessment, and then spend the majority of the time on stripping various grips and a basic arm drag counter to someone trying to stop you from moving past them. That makes for a pretty busy hour of practicing very rudimentary elements of stopping another person from putting their hands on you and exerting their will.
In practical terms, we train unathletic people how to make grabby grandpa let go of them and then find the door. That said, it is real self-defense. The same grip stripping techniques are what you’d use against grabby Joe Biden or grabby big strong asshole at the beginning of an unpleasant confrontation. And that’s just how to get someone’s hands off of you while you’re standing politely, leaving a lot of ground uncovered like the clinch or a bear hug from behind. If you want to know how to make someone let go of you on the ground, well, learn to love it and settle in to the process.
Realistically, it is a win if even a few of the techniques are retained or even if some anxiety is relieved for home care workers so they can do their jobs more effectively. None of these people will leave the 60-90 minute class impervious to being held on to. You just don’t get that ability when training is measured in a few hours. Gaining that ability is going to take reps, and lots of them.
Those reps and the time you invest in them is the difference between hitting up a seminar to gain awareness you didn’t have before, and developing a skill set that has a much higher percentage of working under stress (and is fun as hell to develop, in my humble opinion). Unless you’ve gained an injury or disability I’m not aware of, you seem to be absolutely fit to learn how to really handle yourself. Truth be told, I think you’d eat it all up and be a freaking machine.
That’s my $0.02, at least, with a little over 8 months of immersion into this subject matter.
1 Like
That’s a good bet. Here’s a Puff-sized gal showing how it’s done when you do get within arms reach!
2 Likes
Wow. Ha! That’s hopeful. He kept getting her off her feet. I thought he had her at least three times.
Ok, the pic at top with lady shooting prone clearly illustrates where I’d want to place my chow hall tray for every damn meal! I’ll leave it right there …
That revolver would fire 45 Long Colt correct?
Honest question too dammit.
Powerpuff,
Never worry about that, this thread is for all. I am just glad you are here. Best of luck with the class and the power lifting meet.
1 Like
Correct. That is a 1872 Colt Peacemaker, the “gun that won the west”. Colt only produces a few each year from their custom shop, last time I checked they were cost to $1000.00, outside my pay grade for a new one. It is a piece of American history.
Motivational Monday:(1) Sometimes a man just has to get his pump on!
Motivational Monday (2):
_You will be put in a situation where your skills and/or level of fitness will either get you killed or seriously injured OR allow you to go home to your family. I’m not sure where someone being in shape became a joke or an opportunity to make fun of each other, but no matter who you are, I guarantee that when you call for help you want the biggest baddest mother fucker there showing up.” - Mike Counihan. Pure truth , brother.**
On a personal note:
I have been in enough situations to know that if you are close to being killed or you are getting your ass kicked , you really don’t care who shows up to help you. Doesn’t matter what race, creed, religion, color or sexual orientation. Funny how that works, all that crap goes out the window when you are close to dying.
2 Likes
The first step, and unfortunately it isn’t easy, is getting women to acknowledge that the world can be an ugly place with uglier people. And in this regard, women are their own worst enemies as they promote silliness like take back the night or, instead of teaching women how to avoid sexual assault, come up with slogans like “teach your sons not to rape.” Maybe it’s a cultural thing in which women are programmed to see themselves as protected rather than protectors. What I’m getting at is that women, generally speaking, will have a problem responding to dangerous situations because they don’t even know how to recognize one until it’s too late.
I’ll give an example. One night I was heading to the parking garage on campus after class. As I was walking through the garage to my car there was a young woman ahead of me and I could sense that she had become very nervous as she heard my footsteps behind her. She didn’t look back though, a mistake, and kept walking with me behind her. I decided to go in a different direction for a minute then turn back to my car so she wouldn’t have to worry. She didn’t recognize that she was in a potentially dangerous situation until it was too late.
2 Likes
Thought for the day (1): This worth watching even thou I think Aaron’s message is a little convoluted. His thoughts mirror mine, because, I have seen this happen many times with people who train hard, do well, and suck at real world situations.
The boundaries we get used to training in can act as a fatal deterrent. If you have trained for years in JJ on mats, a boxer sparring in a ring, or only trained in a “square room”, then the techniques you have always used are limited to the square. Take to the time to train somewhere outside your environment, learn to operate in a totally different spacial realm. This is vital in surviving a lethal force encounter. ( IMHO).