T Nation

The Supreme Court Fight is On. The Divide Worsens


#2631

That’s the first time you answered my question in a straightforward manner without trying to play both sides.

At any rate, I’m glad we are on the same page. I disagree with the Democrats who call black conservatives Uncle Tom, just like you do.

See how easy it can be to find common ground?


#2632

Not to sound offensive, but it’s a pretty clear straightforward approach. Acknowledging the varying views on the correctness of the word isnt all that strange considering it’s a very polarizing phrase that clearly doesn’t have a single definition.

Especially when you don’t have to pretend like it needed to be pulled out of me 6 posts later :wink:


#2633

Well why did you spend 6 posts splitting hairs with me like @zecarlo instead of just saying “yes, I agree with you twojarslave, labeling people as an ‘Uncle Tom’ is bad rhetoric”? A simple like on one of my posts could have gotten the job done too.

Speaking of posts you like…

Do you think calling people you disagree with an “Uncle Tom” is good or bad, @lucasmon?

Most can agree that Bill Cosby is a bad person on account of the many women he raped. Is this what you’re talking about? If not, please elaborate on what you think is warrants a label like “Uncle Tom” as it relates to Bill Cosby’s stances, aside from raping women, of course.

This is something I’d like to explore further. Please explain how you think this behavior qualifies someone as being an “Uncle Tom”.


#2634

I apologize. My intent was a clear answer with each post. It wasn’t confusing to me.

You’re awfully cute tonight, especially considering


#2635

Accepted. Now that we agree that American treasures like Thomas Sowell do not deserve the label of "Uncle Tom, let’s move ahead, shall we?


#2636

I do not think it is good to call someone an uncle tom.

Bill Cosby has been called an uncle tom for his criticism of the black community in terms of education, lack of parent involvment, among other things.

Supporting law enforcement can be seen that way because you are supporting the “otherside”. Going against the narrative that you are a victim, and/or unfairly treated.


#2637

I, just as you, do not have anything more to go on than a few anectdotes. I won’t judge millions based on that.


#2638

Explain to me how this rhetoric isn’t the exact same type of rhetoric we saw from Republicans toward Obama.

If we’d done a drinking game where we took a shot every time Obama was called one of these things in media, we’d have died of alcohol poisoning within 10 minutes of starting.

Point is not “whataboutism” - the point is to show that your claim that this is the exclusive Democratic playbook is nonsense. Trump isn’t some unique victim of political vitriol that Democrats have a monopoly on.

There are zero parallels to Lincoln and the run-up to the Civil War. I mean, that’s laugh out loud worthy.

Yeah, sowing racial division is bad. So, where is your condemnation of Trump in this regard?

You mean like repealing Obamacare and pay off the national debt?


#2639

I gave specific examples when challenged. I did the same type of cursory google search and I can’t find any examples of assassination rhetoric against Obama. It wasn’t all good rhetoric, but I don’t recall anyone in the public eye calling for his assassination or really anything that rises to the level of hate and vitriol used against Lincoln. Or Trump, for that matter.

It seems rather self-evident that the Democrats’ rhetoric is quite similar today as what it was in 1864. Take any of those statements I quoted above, switch out a few words and it will seem like a normal day at CNN in 2018. The levels of self-righteous hysteria are quite similar.

Again, I gave specific examples to back up my point, which is not that the modern Republican party is an unblemished institution of great ideas being put into action. It is that the Democrats are most definitely not, and again wondering why anyone, anywhere would vote for them.

All throughout the last few days I’ve challenged others to provide examples. Name a Republican slaveholder (nobody could, but assured me they were out there. Must’ve been!). Name a Republican using the term Uncle Tom. Name a Republican who voted for Jim Crow laws. No examples given. Name a Republican policy that’s racist. The only example given was the Drug War. I can mostly agree with that, but one national policy that’s put plenty of people of all colors in jail hardly makes Republicans stand out from the many, many race-based policies and mainstream rhetoric of the modern Democrats.

So I ask you, can you provide any examples of mainstream rhetoric against Obama rising to the level we’ve seen against Lincoln? Or Trump, for that matter? Or do I just need to take your word for it again?

That’s a good question. People certainly say he’s the worst, so I took the time to examine the great New York Time’s definitive list of Trump’s awful racist things.

Now I can definitely agree that he is racist by the new definitions of the word. He is, after all, a white male at the top of a power structure. He also fails to apply politically correct speech codes and often speaks plainly about policies. This will certainly upset many people.

What I see much, much more of in this article is a clearly biased press going to great lengths to twist his words and attribute meanings to them that he didn’t say. I see second-hand quotes. I see outright fabrications. Trump was “reluctant” to disavow David Duke, apparently, but when I follow the links (which almost all link to other left-biased websites) I see quotes where Trump clearly disavows David Duke not just once, but many times over many decades. I suppose he’s racist because he didn’t denounce him before the reporter asked the question, or perhaps didn’t have his David Duke radar set to scan before the interview.

A lot of that stuff is, well, pretty easy to see as fake news. I also don’t see how it is possible for anyone to attempt to, say, enforce immigration laws without being branded as a racist by people who seemingly want no immigration laws. They go hand-in-hand, and there’s literally no way it could be done without being called a racist in 2018.

The left has gone insane. Completely insane. And it is very difficult to navigate all of the noise we hear. 20 years ago I would have trusted what I read in the New York Times. Now it is easy to follow the links and start raising eyebrows right away. I’ve been getting sucked into politics for the last several weeks because of the upcoming elections coupled with the emergence of Stalin-esque kangaroo courts in our Senate, and all I’m seeing is hysteria from Democrats. No good policy at all that I’ve been able to discern.

Again, I’m more than happy to hear someone make the case for the Democrats. I’ve been pretty clear on explaining my thoughts, even if you don’t agree with them.


#2640

I’m crawling back into my cave where I don’t give politics much attention, btw. I think I’ve done all that I can to defend my notion that the left has completely ruined Star Wars.

I’ve been spending too much time typing for free and need to get back to paying my bills. Thanks everyone for taking the time to read and reply to my thoughts.


#2641

^^^^ RIP to another poster who tired of jousting with the same insolent 3 or 4 liberals that have basically ruined this sub forum with a virtually unlimited supply of: having to get the last word, being tone deaf to their political heroes’ lies, malice, illegal acts, and parsing other posters’ comments while deflecting or ignoring questions directed at their own positions.


#2642

Take it from someone who has been on these Forums for a while, @treco

This is FAR from being behavior limited to liberals.


#2643

Does anyone remember what Ted Nugent said should happen to Obama? But, but, liberals.


#2644

@twojarslave

Enjoyed your posts. Thanks for the effort(s). And actually being genuine in wanting to have a discussion. Man, you are one patient dude.


#2645

Ted’s no Ruth Ginsburg, but (from a quick Google search, from June 2017)

“At the tender age of 69, my wife has convinced me I just can’t use those harsh terms,” he said on the 77 WABC radio program Thursday. “I cannot and will not and I encourage even my friends, slash, enemies on the left, in the Democrat and liberal world, that we have got to be civil to each other.”

“I’m not going to engage in that kind of hateful rhetoric anymore.”


#2646

I can’t picture Ted with a 69 year old wife. 16 or 19 maybe.


#2647

And you did not disappoint with your typical type of response.

Lol, and not because you’re funny.


#2648

Sorry, Ted.


#2649

see @treco’s post above


#2650

I don’t need to; the tears are running down the thread.

A poster accuses Dems of assassination speech and I point out that Nugent called for Obama’s death and you get all pissy. How dare I be contrary!