The Supplements

If I were to purchase just one supplement. which of the following would you recommend: Mag-10, ZMA, Tribex500, or M-anti estrogen?

I already take a quality protein powder and cycle creatine on occasion. I am in my 40’s and weigh 190lbs at 5’ 10", body fat 11% (according to one of those hand held instruments, which probably are not worth a dam).

Any suggestions would be helpful, thank you.

In order of preference:


This from another guy in his 40s who’s tried everything that Biotest has ever made. I’m assuming that your basic nutrition is okay.

1.) Surge - An absolute must!
2.) Low Carb Grow - makes everything else taste like shit!!!
3.) MAG-10/4-AD-EC - a GREAT plateau buster!
4.) I also use an awful lot of BCAA’s.

  1. Mag-10 (truly a miracle supplement)
  2. Low Carb Grow!
  3. Good Multi Vitamin
  4. Fish / Flax Oil
  5. Creatine
  6. Surge

I would go with ZMA. Mag-10, tribex, and M you should be cycled. ZMA doesn’t need to be cycled, doesn’t need to be cycled, boosts Test levels, and the extra deep sleep from the ZMA will help boost GH levels while sleeping. If you ever get a chance for anything else then go with it, but ZMA should be a staple in everyone’s supplement use.

Out of the ones you listed, I second dyno’s suggestion on ZMA. Gotta love the better quality sleep! And if nothing else, it’s rather cheap too.

Gotta jump on the ZMA bandwagon - love that stuff! Surge (or homemade concoction closely resembling Surge while waiting for shipment to arrive) is a necessity in my book, and I gotta have my creatine.

Just started my first cycle of Tribex, and will be experimenting with Mag-10 soon.

Joey, I agree low carb Grow is without question the best tasting protein powder on the market! I have tried the Chocolate and it’s something that you have to try to believe.

Dyno and Jeff, what makes ZMA help you sleep better? Im sorry, but I don’t get that one. It’s Zinc, magnesium and B-6. Bring me up to date on this.

Like I said, I take Protein and cycle the Creatine now and then. The rest of my supplementation looks like this: Twin Lab Milti (no iron), Twin Lab Amino Fuel <(anyone ever tried this?), Fish Oil, Garlic caps, Ginkgo, Bilberry, Lycopene,L-Carnitine, Choline and something called “Green Food”.

Most of the above are taken to maintain good health not directly for building muscle, but then again its’s hard to build muscle if you are sick!

Thanks a lot for the feedback guys!

clears throat…

Do a search, ZEB.

Type in something like “ZMA Victor Conte”, and you’ll find an interview that goes into all the details.

Even covers stuff like why ZMA was shown in studies to increase levels of free testosterone, in addition to improving sleep (which it definitely does for me).

I have to say that for ME TOO sleep is better w/ZMA.

Don’t know or care why - it works so I’m happy :wink:

Other than that, I’ve gotten good results with Tribex. I’ve used other brands of tribulus, and Tribex is best IMHO.

If timed correctly, and you take your ZMA on an empty stomach (or just haven’t eaten something with calcium since it can potentially block the absorption of both Zinc and Magnesium), you should get the full absorption of it. From what I know, Magnesium in and of itself has a relaxing/calming effect, which can help ease you into sleep. I don’t remember if that holds true for Zinc as well but I’m sure there are some articles on T-mag that cover this in greater detail. If nothing else, Zinc, being an aromatase inhibitor, can be beneficial for any man looking to preserve and even increase his Testosterone levels. As mentioned, it could be considered as part of your core of supplements. Hopefully I didn’t mess things up too badly. Haha. Good luck.


Or you can totally skip my post and just go along with what Mike Mann said.

(Yeah, it helps to read the whole thread before repeating what others have already stated…)

Now I know…

Hey Mike, I have an idea! Why don’t we just do a search on everything and not discuss anything on the message board.

You can find all the information you want regarding training and supplements when you do a search! And if Testosterone does not have the information for some reason, You can Google it and find it anyway.

I look at a message board as a way of exchanging ideas and opinons. You get to hear it from the horses mouth, so to speak. The human touch. Something you do not find on a search.

Thanks for all the info regarding my supplement questions guys, your opinions are appreciated. And more importantly they can’t be found on a search engine!

Touched a nerve, did I, ZEB?

Actually, one of the reason’s I posted that is because the answer to your question can be quite lengthy, and that article provides a nice, informative, detailed summary of the benefits of ZMA and how it works.

And frankly, I was too damned burned out to type it all out for you, or even search for the link, which I normally do for people.



No not at all. But, some people (not you) I have noticed always start out by acting all disgusted and then tell the person to go do a search.

Again, the message board is a convnient way to not only obtain information but get to know the people who are giving it to you. Its nice to talk directly to people who have tried or are using a product that you are thinking of buying.

Like I said on other boards, I work out alone usually and having the sort of contact that this board provides is a real positive thing for me.

Incidentally, I have read some of your comments on other threads and have found them helpful! Thanks.

yup. Gotta agree with ZEB here. Although we should do the research first, it is nice to get some anecdotal info from other members.

That is why the message board is here…

Although we should do the research first, it is nice to get some anecdotal info from other members.

What do you think a search will get you? Something other than anecdotal info from other members?

Here’s why you should do a search, no matter what: One, you get some really expert opinions. Doing a search might turn up something from Bill Roberts, for example, whose opinion on just about anything is worth more than the average person’s. Bill doesn’t post much anymore, so a search is the only way you’re going to find out what he thinks.

Unless (two) one of the vets decides to chime in, saying, “Well, Bill Roberts said…” - as I did on another thread relating to ZMA just a week or so ago. That would be almost as good. Thing is, since most of us long-termers have been around forever, we’ve already answered questions like these many many times before. And eventually, we get tired of it and just don’t want to answer again. So a search will get you more in the way of “veteran” opinions, and less in the way of “whoever’s posting at the moment” opinions. Not that whoever’s posting at the moment might not be right. But chances are that someone with more experience is going to give you better advice.

Three. After doing your search, if you still don’t feel happy, you can always post your question. But this time, you’ll be able to say, “I did a search and the consensus seems to be X, but I was wondering if anyone had anything new to say about the subject.” Then everyone will be happy to chime in (if there’s anything new).

Bottom line: doing a search gets you more and better information than not.

And now on a completely different subject, I really have to question anyone who would say that ZMA is going to give you better results than Surge. Some people respond to ZMA, some don’t. Everyone that I know of who’s tried it responds to Surge, and responds pretty dramatically. Furthermore, the better sleep that you get with ZMA (assuming that you actually do get it) can’t, IMHO, compare with the workout-to-workout raise in recovery and intensity that you get with Surge.

The original question was not whether or not ZMA was a good supp, but what the best supp would be if you could only pick one. And I can’t believe that, protein requirements taken care of, Surge wouldn’t give you the more in the way of measurable results than ZMA.


The original question was what the best supplement would be from the following choices of Mag-10, ZMA, Tribex, or M. ZEB’s question in the beginning didn’t include Surge.

Had there been that choice Surge would definitely rank at the top.

Good post, char.

I do want to point out that, although I’m on a kind of ZMA “high” right now, given the choice between Surge and all it does to help me achieve my fitness goals, and ZMA, the choice would obviously have to be Surge.

One more thing, ZEB, char makes some great points on the quality of the answers being higher with someone that’s been around longer and might have more training/nutrition experience. And the fact that they may also have answered the question repeatedly over the years and don’t feel like doing it one more time.

Given that, one thing I’d like to point out is that you may or may not have noticed that the search function in the forum is separate from the one on the home page. The forum one displays findings for all threads pertaining to a subject (previous dialogue), while the home page one displays all past T-Mag articles.

All that being said, I guess you’re always free to say “Screw it. I’m posting my question” and filter through the inevitable smart-ass responses and glean the valuable ones.

P.S. I’m glad you noticed that, on occasion, I do try to offer some helpful advice.