T Nation

The State and Virtue


Would somebody please explain this to me, why the virtuous honorable state does this to people???



Why do dogs lick their balls?


What the hell is a virtuous and honorable state?

Seriously, some governments are better than others but they all have a dark side.


Thing is, there's no way to really know how many of those are isolated incidents, and how many are "accepted" by the people in charge. Not to mention the great amounts of stress put on these Soldiers/Marines while they're deployed, with their lives at risk every day. If you believe that has no effect on the human psych, you're crazy. People rape women in the USA every day, and it's horrendous. But I don't hear a battle-cry about how evil all civilians because of the actions of a few. Some civilians are evil people. Some military folk are evil people. It's called life, sadly.


Agreed. These and other incidents are horrendous and extremely disappointing. I hate to know that stuff like that goes on in our military. But like hungry said, do you think this is just occurring in the U.S forces? How bout you check your own military out and see if there is anything occurring that is similar?


There's no need because no one goes around claiming civilians to all be heroes who we must all "support".

I joined a facebook group once, called "Soldiers are NOT heroes." The message was pretty simple, if you took the time to read it: Being a soldier does not inherently make someone a hero and hero worship of soldiers is a dangerous form of brainwashing.

Of course, a bunch of soldiers and haters joined so they could shout "YOU OWE EVERY SECOND OF YOUR ENTIRE LIFE TO ME".


To say every soldier/marine/sailor etc is a hero is untrue. BUT it IS us that keep our country safe from foreign threats, just as the police are supposed to keep the country safe from domestic threats. So for those of us that AREN'T psychopathic scumbags in the military, yes, I think a level of respect IS deserved.


Respect is absolutely deserved. However, hero worship is dangerous. One of the biggest claims regarding the war in Iraq/Afghanistan has been "You have to support the troops!" Which translates to "You have to support any American military action, because the troops carry it out and you have to support the troops. If you don't you're unamerican and you disrespect the people who protect you."

Ironically, these same people who say this turn around and claim that the troops carry no responsibility for what they do so long as it's "following orders".

To make clear, I respect the troops of this country immensely and I'm very thankful for the job they do.


I can agree with your viewpoint Cap. Im from a family with alot of military involvement. Most agree that MOST soldiers now days(actually they say Marines) do not have the respect that they used to have. I have come to notice and agree.


Don't worry, I got where you're coming from, and you've got the right idea.


It's their nature.


True, and I would also like to point out that it is highly unfair that they can and we dont.

Then agin we probably would not even have invented the wheel by now if we could, so.....


Decimation (roman). It's good.

These people (these soldiers) are degrading themselves/allowing themselves to be degraded, becoming subhuman. (I hope the meaning is clear...although I guess decadence and degeneration would've been even more clear)

Anyone else think that nowadays we should return to more...shall we say gruesome...corporeal punishment? For anyone committing such acts, whether in his home country or abroad, as soldier or civilian.