The Racial Thing

[quote]Soco wrote:
I agree that race relations had something to do with the reaction in New Orleans, but I think you could insert any race group into that scenario and get the same results.
[/quote]

That’s my point nitwit . . . whites ARE in the same situation and ARE NOT acting like the black population in New Orleans.

They have not historically.

[quote]JJJJ wrote:
That’s my point nitwit . . . whites ARE in the same situation and ARE NOT acting like the black population in New Orleans.

They have not historically.[/quote]

“Whites” are not the majority, or anywhere close it, when it comes to those trapped in New Orleans. To then praise the actions of “whites” in this situation as if your study pool were even balanced deserves someone making up new names for you as well.

[quote]JJJJ wrote:
Despite your name calling and outrage, you really don’t explain what we’re seeing do you? Why aren’t poor white communities shooting at helicopters?
[/quote]

First, what is the news deciding to show vs what is happening? How many “blacks” are shooting at helicopters? One, two? Or are they hispanic? Or are they something else? What is the percentage of black people in New Orleans (the most devastated area by far) compared to whites? In fact there is an infintesimal percentage of people doing the shooting. So, this is a black trait, huh?

Damn, you are really laying all of your bigoted cards on the table. It’s because whites hugely outnumber blacks in the country. There is a lot larger percentage of blacks that are poor than whites if you look at race as whole in this country. And guess what, the lower the socioeconomic level, the more crime that occurs regardless of race.

But you do see the lower the socioeconomic level, the more violence that occurs across racial boundaries. Try again, KKK supporter.

Do you have numbers? Do you know the race of each thos people who looted? In this mixed neighborhood, was the so-called blacks closes to the area of the crash? Or are you just looking through you bigoted-colored lenses again and making your snap judgements. You are unreal, dude.

[quote]
I can’t exaplin why, and I don’t condemn all blacks . . . but blacks are more prone to violence and anti-social behavior.[/quote]

And here we have it folks, after years of meticulous research crunching numbers from various incidents around the country and analyzing blood and skin samples of thousands of “blacks”, JJJJ has come to the scientific conclusion that blakcs are more prone to violence and anti-social behavior. You’re are one huge bigoted prick.

[quote]etaco wrote:
graphicsMan wrote:
It’s all social conditioning. Put a white kid in a black family and he will “act black”, and put a black kid in a white family and he will “act white”.

Put a white kid in an upper middle class white family and he will still TRY to act black… until the first sign of difficulty when he will promptly cry for mommy. I hate wiggers.[/quote]

Another hate-filled post by a bigoted asshole. I really think the Mods should be stepping in here and not letting these obviously race-hate posts to go through.

[quote]Professor X wrote:
JJJJ wrote:
That’s my point nitwit . . . whites ARE in the same situation and ARE NOT acting like the black population in New Orleans.

They have not historically.

“Whites” are not the majority, or anywhere close it, when it comes to those trapped in New Orleans. To then praise the actions of “whites” in this situation as if your study pool were even balanced deserves someone making up new names for you as well.[/quote]

This guy is so obviously bigoted its not even funny.

[quote]randman wrote:
etaco wrote:
graphicsMan wrote:
It’s all social conditioning. Put a white kid in a black family and he will “act black”, and put a black kid in a white family and he will “act white”.

Put a white kid in an upper middle class white family and he will still TRY to act black… until the first sign of difficulty when he will promptly cry for mommy. I hate wiggers.

Another hate-filled post by a bigoted asshole. I really think the Mods should be stepping in here and not letting these obviously race-hate posts to go through.
[/quote]

Thank you for the lead in, randman.

I will keep this brief and to the point:
Either everyone can have an intelligent discussion on an obviously sensitive issue or else their posts simply will not be going through. Consider this the warning. I have been trying to let this thing sort itself out to a degree and everyone be grown-ups about it, but I can see some are just seeking to stir things up for the sake of doing so.

Discussions on sensitive topics are fine and there is no problem with them getting heated. It’s part of what makes T-Nation great. But if this is going to devolve into a series of posts based in bigotry, it’s going to go and the whole thread will be locked.

Mod Mav

[quote]Soco wrote:
ps - go to hell [/quote]

Excellent post script to a very well written response.

JJJ is a fucking moron. If whites had been oppressed by blacks for two centures, then whites would be the ones living in poverty and near poverty, and whites would be doing the majority of the rioting.

People, when you strip us down to the genetic level, we are, more or less, identical. Color of skin matters not a bit.

However, there remains no excuse for rioting and looting of non-essentials, no matter your skin color.

Someone else mentioned that the poor behavior we are seeing was influenced by both the pre-natal and childhood environments of the looters. Partially correct. However, if a storm had not struck, and this was business as usual, would we being seeing these images?

No, because They. Know. It’s. Wrong.

[quote]JJJJ wrote:

That’s my point nitwit . . . whites ARE in the same situation and ARE NOT acting like the black population in New Orleans.

They have not historically.[/quote]

No, they aren’t. The white population overall had cars, and where able to get out. The only white people there were those elderly who couldn’t get out. 80 year old men with heart conditions are not very likely to join gangs and rape or pillage.

Point of reference, most of you need to stop being so overly sensitive.

Yes, there are differences between black and white culture. No, that doesn’t mean one is particularly more violent. Just different. Northerners may not understand. It’s cultural like I said, and it’s great. I’m actually living in Louisiana right now and the kind of culture melting pot we have is great. And this comes from our DIFFERENCES.

“Since the majority of the people in New Orleans are from a lower socio-economic class, that’s why you see mostly blacks on TV. 99% of these people are not rioting, looting, etc. Many of them are fighting for their lives. They have family members dying right in front of their eyes. And we’re focusing on the less than 1% that are looting for personal gain and then labeling all blacks as rioters. Again, you are one bigoted piece of shit.”

Why do you think we are seeing these images? Why do you think it makes the news? Not many stories of how someone had a difficult time but got out with out seeing horrific things? Not just because these stories are few and far apart – but mostly because the other stories get you to watch, tune in! News of any kind that is shocking shall we say is BIG! It means ratings and most of all it keeps the public interested. How many stories do you hear about the Tsunami now, but the clean up and rebuilding still go on. The devestation is still there – but even before Katrina the story had died. The need did not, but the ratings were gone – it was yesterdays news.

Every one can claim racism – but how many of you on this forum are doing anything to help? Have you gone to your local Red Cross and offered to volunteer? Here in Texas many shelters are now open – many agencies need supplies, money ect! So instead of placing blame or finding a scapegoat – be productive, find a way to change society - for the good!

There is my 2 cents worth.

Wow bigotry, and on both sides.

I am not even sure I want to get involved in this discussion, but here goes.

First there is a general cultural difference between whites and blacks. Nothing to do with race whatsoever. There are bigger differences between the black people of South Africa and the Black people of the USA. Differences in the way people act is not a race issue, it is completely culture.

Now that looting has been brought up again, and the people shooting at the cops, and raping, and the whole host of crimes down there right now. This is not the majority. There are a few people that cause trouble, and they make the news. You cannot extrapolate the actions of a few idiots to a whole population.

I think almost everyone on previous threads have said there was a difference between getting some food, and the big screen tv.

I can actually give you one thing most of these people have in common. They are most likely young. You want the biggest indicator of crime, it is being young.

Now does anyone remember when the power went off in New York City? A big melting pot of races, and still very little crime during that time. Things people were worried about never materialized.

People should delve into our countries history more,there s a lot of things that happened that you never hear of in our education system. in the ealy years there were riots over religion,people of different nationalities etc. This is back when most people running the streets were white.Hell in the early 1900’s the national guard was called out to confront workers who were tired of slave labor and wanted a raise ,a lot of the workers ended up dead. Big Business reared its ugly head. Most of thes rioters were white and a lot ended up dead.

[quote]LBRTRN wrote:
orion wrote:
I have just seen two pictures on Bill Maher?s show.

One showed a black man with food and water, that according to the caption he “looted” earlier.

One showed a white couple that, according to the caption, had “found” food and water in a nearby grocery store earlier.

How much of what you see is perception and how much is reality?

God, am I stoned.

By the way, as far as I know, NO had a black population of 70% to begin with, so who do you expect to see on TV?

As far as those two photos are concerned, has anyone taken into consideration that one is an AP photo and the other is an AFP photo? Did it occure to anyone that maybe, just maybe, different companies have different caption guidelines? I dont know if that is the case but crying racism at the slightest provocation cant be helpfull. People are becoming numb to it and I think in the long run its going to harm race relations in this country. [/quote]

http://www.wvoss.com/apracist.jpg

drop it like its hot.

[quote]randman wrote:
etaco wrote:
graphicsMan wrote:
It’s all social conditioning. Put a white kid in a black family and he will “act black”, and put a black kid in a white family and he will “act white”.

Put a white kid in an upper middle class white family and he will still TRY to act black… until the first sign of difficulty when he will promptly cry for mommy. I hate wiggers.

Another hate-filled post by a bigoted asshole. I really think the Mods should be stepping in here and not letting these obviously race-hate posts to go through.
[/quote]

How does “I hate wiggers” earn the harshest reprobation on this page? Wiggers are little spoiled shits who pretend they haven’t had every advantage in their sheltered life and instead conduct themselves as really bad parodies of those who’ve grown up in most impoverished and desperate conditions. Wiggers don’t care about the plight of the innercity poor nor do they really care for black culture. The wigger isn’t the white kid who has an appreciation for the poetic or rhythmic qualities of rap. Wiggers are the punks who idealize the worst symptoms of innercity poverty-- most notably the violence and crime-- and attempt to emulate it to the extent of their limited capabilities. These wannabe thugs represent themselves as the worst stereotypes of the black community. When was the last time you saw one of these kids trying to emulate a positive african-american role model? When was the last time you met one who actually gave a shit about people instead of having concern only for projecting an image of toughness in a sad attempt to look cool? What makes these kids pathetic is that they have no excuse. They didn’t grow up in grinding poverty in a dangerous area with no opportunities in which they felt pressure to be tough in order to survive. Rather, they grew up in suburban subdivisions with all the oportunites and advantages available and have had all there shit bought for them. Not only are they posers, but they are really bad posers. They look ridiculous.

Kid, you go to prep school.

You’re not bustin a cap in anyone’s ass.

You can’t dance.

If it weren’t for all the other kids just like you, you would be the worst rapper in the history of the world.

Just because a black guy can pull it off and look cool doesn’t mean you can… In fact it probably means just the opposite.

Kid, please do us all a favor and actually go to the hood. And no, your gated community is not it.

As for the thread topic itself, I’d like to point out that caucasians still have the following to live down among others:
Holocaust
Stalin’s purges
Ethnicly cleansing the NA continent of natives
Slavery on a scale never seen in human history
Institutionalised racism
etc.

It’s not that white people, black people or any others are the worst, rather, we just forget that we are all animals. On the upside, at least we aren’t THAT much worse than cats.

All I want to add here is that POVERTY IS NO EXCUSE FOR RIOTING OR CRIME. Just look at crime rates in and around the Great Depression. I dare to say racism was more widespread then than now. In light of this, please SOMEONE try to make a coherant excuse for the rioting, shootings, looting and rapes now (and the LA riots for that matter).

By the way, during the aftermath of the Tsunami (which victimized a populace MUCH more destitute than New Orleans et. al), were there riots, rapes, shootings, large scale looting, murders? Honestly I don’t remember reading anything about that stuff then.

[quote]derek wrote:
By the way, during the aftermath of the Tsunami (which victimized a populace MUCH more destitute than New Orleans et. al), were there riots, rapes, shootings, large scale looting, murders? Honestly I don’t remember reading anything about that stuff then.[/quote]

No there were not. And in NONE of the well-documented urban floods and earthquakes in Chinese and Japanese cities (maybe 15-20 in the last 100 years) there has NEVER been the level of urban violence that we saw as a result of this flood, . . . or the police acquital in the first Rodney King trial, or the assassination of MLK or the blackouts.

Yeah, I didn’t think so. The events you cited were interseting as well as cementing my (our) point. So is there anyone willing to excuse/explain this stuff going on now?

[quote]derek wrote:
All I want to add here is that POVERTY IS NO EXCUSE FOR RIOTING OR CRIME. Just look at crime rates in and around the Great Depression. I dare to say racism was more widespread then than now. In light of this, please SOMEONE try to make a coherant excuse for the rioting, shootings, looting and rapes now (and the LA riots for that matter).

By the way, during the aftermath of the Tsunami (which victimized a populace MUCH more destitute than New Orleans et. al), were there riots, rapes, shootings, large scale looting, murders? Honestly I don’t remember reading anything about that stuff then.[/quote]

High population density is another necessary condition for rioting. There needs to be a certain critical mass of people with the other factors in place for the group dynamics (or mob mentality if you prefer) to take over.

As for crime following the tsunami, there was plenty, including all of the things you mentioned in many areas. A rise in brigandage was a related problem for a while. It tended to only be mentioned in passing in the news though. Compared to the devastation wrought by the disaster itself, its effects were negligible. Moreover, some of the worst hit areas were in the midsts of long running civil wars.

Oh and JJJJ, you’re right, Asians never riot after disasters or otherwise. ?!?!?
Riots in most parts of the world just aren’t considered news worthy.

…You will ALWAYS get on a slippery slope when attributing “total goodness” or “total evil” to a group or race of people…

I could say (and rightly so) that most of the crime that the original poster has raled on is mostly a) black-on-black and b) confined to relatively small areas like Watts, Harlem and inner-city (and VERY poor) New Orleans…

While historically the atrocities of whites have engulfed regions, Civilizations and whole cultures…coupled with the creation and invention of ever-increasing weapons of death and destruction…(not many guys named “Leroy” or “Silas” or “Puff-Daddy” in those original Karishnokov, Colt, Winchester, or Spanish ,French, English and American Armories and Weapons factories…or involved in The Spanish Inquisition, the Crusades, British Colonization, Wounded Knee, the Manhattan Project or at Krakow…)

Does this make my white brothers, sisters and friends inherently evil?

No…and it’s a ridiculous (and dangerous) to even entertain the thought…

Mufasa

“…As for crime following the tsunami, there was plenty, including all of the things you mentioned,in many areas…”

Crime was Widespread in the hit areas…just didn’t hit the news…and there was nothing as large as a “Wal-Mart SuperCenter” being looted to “showcase”…

Mufasa