T Nation

The Media and Roids?


#1

All this baseball alex rodriguez shit just makes me laugh. The media is so stupid when it comes to juice. does anyone actually believe that AR just used a bit of juice three years ago?

Or that there is only a select group of baseball players have done a couple of cycles once in there life. Hes probably on GH AS WE SPEAK. and there is no test for that!

I would say that 95% of NFL players of juice (hard to catch in there water based offs season).

baseball was probably 85% catching up

Track and FIeld (100%)

Basketball ( I would say has less immediate gains from roids so they probably are at around 70%)

How would you feel if you knew that every single pro athlete you ever liked juiced ?

Im not a fan of steroids , Ive seen to many lame asses build there entire physiques off of them which some how qualifies them as experts. I also think for the most part those guys just look like there muscles are baloons. IMO pro athletes today are mostly built there quality from juice as a minor foundation. Not there skills first.


#2

I wouldn’t care if they were, and I’m for a test that would put a cap on test levels. Test all the athletes and everyone can be at the level of the highest testing athlete. Let team doctors prescribe and administer the dosages to help ensure safety. It’s not perfect, but better than what they have now.


#3

TBH It really doesn’t bother me too much … at least in the competitive aspect, but I don’t like how it’s taking away from the athletes in the past with the amazing, long standing records (Hank Aaron). He did it using pure God given talent and dedication … I’m just glad no one’s outdone Ted Williams as far as batting .400 in a season.

As a fan we’re into professional sports for the entertainment value pure and simple. If these athletes can perform at a higher, more competitive level so be it.

I’m not sure that these athletes consider the consequences and effect it has on the younger kids who idolize them, however. It does send a message that the only way to be the best is to juice. I think the media, however, fails to report that these athletes who use the “performance enhancers” still work their ass off to utilize the potential encased within the performance enhancers.

Even without them, these guys would still be doing amazing things and that aspects been taken away and watered down by the media imo.


#4

Steroids don’t replace talent or work ethic. Ronnie Coleman take steroids, do you think he would have any chance against a natural pro athlete in say baseball or football.

I think it’s stupid that they are banned. Sure some records may be broken, but I guess they can always put an * next to it.


#5

IF - we could have a real dialouge as a nation and get these Jackasses to stop grand standing about how PEDs are going to kill children then I would not really mind.

So many people in this country think that if you take a pill something magical happens. That you can hit a ball farther, or run faster or be thinner, etc. It just does not work like that. You have to work to get better at these things an 99.9% of the population is incapible of that sort of single minded dedication and sacrifice.

That and we would also have to address all the people who “could’ve been pro” IF they had taken some thing. I would not ever walk into another bar if one more guy sat down and told me how he was going to be a pitcher but wouldn’t take juice.

It is an easy arguement for the establishment to get behind and these jackasses in the media need to sell papers and politicians need to save your children or the country’s soul.

Let’em dope and admit we have been watching the best sports money can buy for a long time.


#6

The indignant sports writers get to me, man. These guys that talk about how the fans and game have been cheated. It’s non-stop. First off, as evidenced by threads I’ve seen on this site and a few others, fans care a lot less than the writers. They seem to be trying to convince us that we should be outraged. I’m not. Never have been.

I admit to taking steroids in the past. I’m not ashamed of it. I don’t feel like I ‘cheated’. I did what everyone else was doing. I have no problem with those who decide not to. It’s a personal decision. Where do you draw the line, though? There are many things that enhance performance. Some legal, some not. A lot of guys can’t afford, say, a hyper-baric chamber. Does that mean that the guy who can ‘cheated’? Did Hines Ward cheat before the Superbowl when the team doctors removed his blood, medicated/manipulated it and replaced it to speed healing?

A-Rod’s sorry he got caught. Sounds about right to me.


#7

It is my humble opinion that if an individual is not willing to take that step, and all risks associated, to be the best, then they dont deserve it.

Its not like they are taking some magic pill that replaces all the hard work they put in so they just are the best from sitting on their ass watching Jenny Jones, eating ho-ho’s and masturbating to Jamie Lyn Discala pictures on the internet. Shit, if steriods where some magic pill that would make it so I could pop some fucking pills and hit 60 home runs i would do that as long as I could till i got caught, then laugh my ass all the way to the bank. But, sadly, it doesnt work that way.


#8

[quote]polo77j wrote:
TBH It really doesn’t bother me too much … at least in the competitive aspect, but I don’t like how it’s taking away from the athletes in the past with the amazing, long standing records (Hank Aaron). He did it using pure God given talent and dedication [/quote]

How do you know that? They didn’t even test them back then.


#9

well if coleman had a baseball player in him instead of a bb he probably would be BBonds.

Its not a magic pill what it does is create an uneven playing field for those not on Juice. Thats were its unfair.

hence a natural a rod could have been a sub par player all these years.


#10

[quote]MISCONCEPTION wrote:
well if coleman had a baseball player in him instead of a bb he probably would be BBonds.

Its not a magic pill what it does is create an uneven playing field for those not on Juice. Thats were its unfair.

hence a natural a rod could have been a sub par player all these years.[/quote]

Anyone who thinks a “natural” A-Rod would or even could have been a sub par player is just dumb. With or without roids, A-Rod is one of the best players in the game now and maybe ever. Same can be said for Bonds, Clemens, et al.


#11

[quote]oneforship wrote:
MISCONCEPTION wrote:
well if coleman had a baseball player in him instead of a bb he probably would be BBonds.

Its not a magic pill what it does is create an uneven playing field for those not on Juice. Thats were its unfair.

hence a natural a rod could have been a sub par player all these years.

Anyone who thinks a “natural” A-Rod would or even could have been a sub par player is just dumb. With or without roids, A-Rod is one of the best players in the game now and maybe ever. Same can be said for Bonds, Clemens, et al.[/quote]

WHHHHHHHHYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY

AGAIN someone else acting like steriods doesn’t do shit.
Good maybe, great possibly, best ever… doubt it. They just wouldn’t last as long without roids. If you can’t last you can’t break half the records. Think about what bonds has done the last 2 years compared to the years right before that.

Theres a reason why they spend millions to create Balco… It works.


#12

[quote]Airtruth wrote:
WHHHHHHHHYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY

AGAIN someone else acting like steriods doesn’t do shit.

Good maybe, great possibly, best ever… doubt it. They just wouldn’t last as long without roids. If you can’t last you can’t break half the records. Think about what bonds has done the last 2 years compared to the years right before that.

Theres a reason why they spend millions to create Balco… It works.[/quote]

Bonds was a perennial .300+ hitter, with multiple 30/30 seasons.

He had a plus arm on defense, and, despite still being an asshole, was one of the best players in the game during that era. The case can be argued, that he would have gotten consideration as one of the best ever. Maybe not THE best, but up there.

ARod was already the most prolific shortstop to ever play the game. He was touted as an 18 year old out of high school, when he first made it to the bigs. He has 10x the defensive player that Jeter was, and he had the power game to go along with it.

He was hitting .350 with 35+ home runs, and putting up numbers NEVER before heard of from a shortstop. Also puts him in the running for one of the best ever.

Both Bonds and ARod (more so Bonds, because he played longer) were first ballot HOFers without any performanc enhancing supplements.

Don’t put words in my mouth, I didn’t say PEDs didn’t work, I didn’t say they didn’t have an effect on longevity. All I said was that anyone who just makes the blanket assumption that these players would have been merely average without roids is an ignorant fool.

Look at all the terrible players in the Mitchell Report. If it were the steroids, they would have been great too. Now if for some reason this is still confusing you, then work on your reading comprehension.


#13

Anyone catch the Jose Canseco Biography on A&E last night? Interesting to say the least. He’s damn near lost everything, his test level was at 140 due to years of being on and no PCT and he regrets writing the book he did.

D


#14

What gets my goat is that cigarettes, which contribute to 400,000+ deaths a year, are legal. But if I want to take something to help me achieve a more muscular physique, that’s wrong and illegal.

And really, who cares if professional athletes take PEDs? Why the outrage? I just don’t get it. “Oooooohhhh, someone I have never met is taking roids, I’M SO MAD!!!” People are idiots.


#15

Fuck children. Some kid starts using steroids because he saw his favorite NFL player doing it and then 20 years later has severe hormonal problems will learn a valuable lesson.

We need to get some smart people in congress.


#16

In general I am just so tired of this argument being brought up over and over. The only ones who even care about people using steroids are just people who are jealous.

“Im not a fan of steroids , Ive seen to many lame asses build there entire physiques off of them which some how qualifies them as experts. I also think for the most part those guys just look like there muscles are baloons. IMO pro athletes today are mostly built there quality from juice as a minor foundation. Not there skills first.”

That entire statement is just blanket bullshit. These “lame asses” you are referring to are probably the biggest guys in your gym, you chalk it up to steroid use, and then to justify your own sub par physique you convince yourself that they really no nothing and are only big because of steroids. Right on!

And what is this bullshit about pro athletes? These guys are pro’s b/c they are talented and gifted in their sport.

I find it hilarious that someone who has never used steroids, and is against them, thus meaning you have done no research on them, is an apparent expert on what they can do. You are making the claim that Pro’s are Pro’s because of steroids, so ignorant.


#17

I find it hilarious that someone who has never used steroids, and is against them, thus meaning you have done no research on them, is an apparent expert on what they can do. You are making the claim that Pro’s are Pro’s because of steroids, so ignorant.[/quote]

I see a fallacy here… You don’t need to watch someone fall to their death by jumping off a bridge to be an expert on the fact that jumping off bridges is not a good idea…

I believe there is a little bit of truth in everything…Roids will make you more of who you really are.

But you should really exercise a little more depth of character here …


#18

[quote]waylanderxx wrote:
In general I am just so tired of this argument being brought up over and over. The only ones who even care about people using steroids are just people who are jealous.

“Im not a fan of steroids , Ive seen to many lame asses build there entire physiques off of them which some how qualifies them as experts. I also think for the most part those guys just look like there muscles are baloons. IMO pro athletes today are mostly built there quality from juice as a minor foundation. Not there skills first.”
[/quote]

You seem to have the attitude that you can’t have a good physique without them. Who knows, maybe I’m reading you wrong here, but that’s the vibe I’m getting. You saying you don’t find “Natties impressive” stands out in my mind, especially.

What I feel the person you quoted was referring to is clueless dudes who jump into steroid use without doing the proper research, and putting in the time to get to know their body first. I agree with him - I think it’s fucking retarded, even though these guys DO seem to see good gains, at least in the short term.

Then again, the OP seems like a pretty douchey character after a re-read, so you may just be right on!


#19

I’m surprised there are people here who don’t condone the intelligent use of steroids.

I agree with Dre, that it’s inconsistent and inappropriate to allow cigarettes without also allowing 'roids (the same argument can potentially be made for marajuana, although those are my thoughts, not his).

I agree with Sick Rick, that there’s a line between protecting children and infringing upon the rights of American adults, and that this examples bends too far in favor of children (and it doesn’t work).


#20

I think with athletics in general, you can only compare the standout athletes to those who are competing in the game at the time, or era in question. With constant advances in nutrition, supplementation, and training techniques, new methodologis are available to all of the athletes.

The issue I think with steroids, is the fact that at the moment, they are illegal. Still, they are available to every ballplayer should he choose to make use of them. It does not belittle natural skill, or effort, or dietary issues, it’s just one more aspect that can be attended to.

Now I’m no sports fan, and my attention paid to this whole A-Rod thing has been the main headlines in the newspapers, but I gotta agree with the Ronnie Coleman example someone else made. If Ronnie’s using the same ‘stuff’ as everyone else, and he’s at the top, then it must be more than just the drugs that creates his champion caliber physique. If Steroids are indeed used all across sports, then wouldn’t A-Rod standing out exemplefy a similar champion level degree of skill?

As to Waylander’s not being a fan of natty physiques,… well, that’s because what we’re used to seeing has progressed so far beyond that. Sure, most of the bodies in the magazine are geared, but imagine a new baseball player came on the scene, and was amazing by 1960’s standards… well, most folks who are accustomed to seeing the players of the 2000’s wouldn’t bat an eyelash… see where I’m going here?

It’s all audience based. Nothing wrong with that, but you also have to understand the difference in viewpoints between someone like Waylander, who aspires to be a pro BBers, and the average guy who loves training, and would be impressed by an average dude who weighed 180 lbs, but had single digit bodyfat.

S