T Nation

The Great Spiritual Divide

I am sure that many of you saw the front page of USA Today, 6-3-04.
" Church Going Closely Tied To voting Patterns."

68% of those who attended church more than once per week voted for Bush in the last election.

58% of those who attended church once per week voted for Bush in the last election.

65% of those who never attended church voted for Gore in the last election.

Just as interesting was the chart found on page 2-A. It shows that since 1992 the percentage of church going voters, voting republican, has grown considerably from several years past.

Let’s do our own T-man poll:If you attend church once (or more) per week will you be voting for Bush?

If you never attend church will you be voting for Kerry?

Very rarely go to church and I voted for Bush last election. The next election I think on voting day I will just go piss in the wind, it will do about as much good. Both candidates in my mind have their own agenda and it has nothing to do with the good of this great country of ours.

Those numbers seem about right. Even in my religion (Judaism), I’d say they would be pretty close, despite the popular description of Jews as liberals. I think folks who go to organized religious services regularly are sensitive to family issues and the effects of a “vibrant” secularism on society’s “moral values” hence the appeal of the conservative candidates. With that said, it’s refreshing to see that this is not an all-or-nothing approach for the religious types.

I don’t go regularly, but swing towards the conservatives, with regular exceptions. Then again, in New York, our conservatives are quite moderate (usually), so that’s not saying much.

I attend church almost every week and I will be voting for Bush.

ZEB: Going to church has little to do with sprituality. What spiritual divide are you talking about? Whenever I read the bible all I see is a very non-judgemental individual attempting to show people the house of God. That isn’t a building made by men.

Men seem to create their diety in their own image, hence the death penalty and pre-emptive strikes.

The holy spirit to me seems to be a contentment and resonance with nature. It has little to do with a congregation of the “faithful”.

I guess with that said, the church is simply another avenue of politics.

This divide has been known now for some time and OReilly talks about how the democratic party has been HIJACKED by the secularists. It is true that most of the Jewish and Catholic/Christian teachings are against things like abortion and such and therefore those people tend to vote Republican. This is just ONE issue. The only thing I don’t understand is how Jewish people can really vote democrat. The biggest supportors of Israel and Jewish people are conservative Christians. And some Jewish people don’t realize this is perplexing. I even talked to a girl who was Jewish by birth but believes in Christ and she says the same thing of her own people: how can they be so liberal when someo of their biggest supporters are Christian conservative people.

BTW: albore used to be pro life back when he first got into politics. He only went prochoice when it was apparent the only way he would get far with the dumbocrat party was to sell out.

Never go to church. Voting for Kerry.


The problem with people who are fed religious doctrine their entire lives is that they have no perspective. Its impossible to change your mind based on life experience and “sell out” because people that wrote the Bible thousands of years ago said so. Life experience is the only teacher. I know plenty of people that speak the word and drink to excess. Life experience has taught these people nothing because they were never listening.

My viewpoints about abortion have changed drastically due to life experience. It has more to do with the adverse affects on the mother-to-be than it does on the fetus.

If someone changes their mind about something it has to do with their ability to think and reason relative to live experience. It isn’t about hellfire and some bullshit world view drilled into their heads at birth. I would rather have people making decisions that have experienced life’s problems rather than handed out life’s “solutions”.

Religion is the one true sickness in this world. Christians think its ok because they are “saved” and are exclusive in God’s eye. That is the biggest crock of shit ever. Its your own narrow view of the world that makes it impossible to place yourself in someone else’s shoes and understand that all humans are generally the same. Its the narrow view of people who are driven by mystical bullshit that is causing every major problem in this world today. I’m sorry, God doesn’t bless America. God blesses all that accept what God is. It has nothing to do with “us” against “them”. That is the problem with religious thinking, or lack thereof.

This isn’t geared towards people who find their spirituality in Christ, it is against the people who are hell-bent against every other type of person in the world simply because they are too stupid to understand them. Wake the fuck up.

go to church almost weekly: voting for the winner, THE PREZ!

Never go to church. Wife and I will both vote Bush again.

well ill just put my 2 cents into this. i have been raised christian my whole life and am a porn again believer, however i do agree with one point being made in here:
Christian people are to much close minded. For example on the gay marriage issue, they believe that juss because they dont believe its right to be gay, that they should take away their right to get married, its not like a church is going to marry gay people, so its not sacriligious.
As far as abortion goes, im against it. I think it should be allowed in certain situations, such as rape and danger to the mothers live,m which would eineitably get abused, but u wont be able to stop abortion ever, at least not totally. However juss cuz a girl got knocked up and didnt use protection they shouldnt be able to juss pay money for they baby to get killed. its just not right. if i was voting in the election i wouldnt vote for anyone becasue like mentioned above they are both in this for the bettering of themselves, not the country.

Wow it’s amazing how lucid could turn a simple survey question into a Christian bashing opportunity. I’m glad you are not bashing gays that way. If so you would be called “homophobic.” Hmm, are you “Christianphobic?” Haha.

Okay…I hope the responses keep coming in, I find this interesting!

Start thread hijack:

dictionary definition of the word liberal:

  1. Not limited to or by established, traditional, orthodox, or authoritarian attitudes, views, or dogmas; free from bigotry.
  2. Favoring proposals for reform, open to new ideas for progress, and tolerant of the ideas and behavior of others; broad-minded.

“Religion is the one true sickness in this world.”

Can anyone explain this to me? And conservatives are narrowminded?

end thread hijack

Spiritual but don’t go to church. Bush is the lesser of two evils.

Have not been to church in 6 years. Voting for Bush, and I am a minority. Wow, huh.

Bush believes in Armageddon and the Rapture. How many Bush supporters here believe in the Rapture? Raise your hands.

When the Rapture comes, can I have your stuff???

Do we want a prez who believes that Armageddon will bring the return of Jesus? Is that who we want with his finger on the nuclear button?

Attend church reguarly. I’ll be voting for Bush.

PtrDR: I too am amazed at how people can seemingly contradict their own expressed views with their vote due to some perceived allegience to a party banner. I see it all the time here in Michigan. Guys who would not in any way agree with a candidates views or priorities, vote for him because they think they are supposed to, or someone with perceived authority endoresess them.
old dogg

Its amazing the amount of of anger that is felt toward religious people. The fact that someone may drink or sin or whatever is a testament to the fact that they are human. And if someone is doing things of that nature on a regular basis then maybe they arent in their heart what they say they are. Dont judge all Christians because of that.

Lumpy-How in the world do you know that is how he thinks? A true knowledgeable Christian knows that the time when Jesus will come back is not known. There are a few theories on the rapture. Some have it before “Armageddon” some in the middle and some after. Some say not at all. There is biblical evidence for all four. So how do you know what he feels and thinks? I dont think you really do.

Yes I do believe in the Rapture. No i dont know when it will be. Yes I do trust that God will make it when he sees fit and not a moment too soon. It seems as if a few on here might do themselves some good with a little reading of the Bible.

thats a ridiculous scenario Lumpy…you know the Prez would never do that… and belief in the rapture or armegeddon are “secondary issues”; things you can disagree as Christians over…but not DIVIDE.
and why do you care anyway? You don’t belive in Christ or the rapture…why should you worry about someone who believes in nonsense?

And old dogg…you made an excellent point. this is especially true among black people. they grow up being told they have to vote dumbocrat. i never got that kind of brainwashing. i started listening and paying attention once i became an officer in the Air Force…

What about the rest of the universe Goldberg? What about every other life-supporting world in this universe that is absolutely implied? Nuclear weapons were merely implied and yet they exist now. Where is Christianity going to go when other worlds are discovered and that God doesn’t give a crap about this one planet. The simple fact is that God only cares about who looks for God; its for you, not for “him”. Science keeps making religion takes step backwards. Actually, it keeps making people go forward; forward towards humanity. Jesus never spoke of pre-emptive strikes or any kind of outward agression. Jesus spoke of total tolerance and understanding which is something conservative right cannot understand. Don’t expect rapture because its not happening. Why rapture the people that cannot accept that humans are common no matter what their race or creed happens to be? Doesn’t that signify ignorance? Tell me where Jesus spoke of ignorance. Tell the the message that incouraged violence. You will not find it. Eye for an eye is about ignorance, not retribution. Listen to the message of your own savior.