The Everything about Racism Thread

  1. systemic racism is definitely true. I’ve made this post a few times here, I’ll make it again:

There are huge advantages to being white in this society. Racism persists in many areas of US life: black people pay more for mortgages, are offered worse interest rates on everything from car loans to mortgages, are paid less wages for doing the same job, are offered jobs less frequently for the same credentials, are imprisoned more often and longer for the same crimes etc etc ad infinitum…

black names a disadvantage in job application:

racial discrimination in the job market:
http://www.chicagogsb.edu/pdf/bertrand.pdf
sounding black hurts your wages:

racial gap in employment:
http://www.lri.lsc.gov/pdf/03/030105_racepref.pdf
differential sentencing by race:
http://justicepolicy.org/images/upload/07-02_REP_MDMandatoryMinimums_DP-MD.pdf
http://www.justicepolicy.org/images/upload/03-10_REP_MDRaceIncarceration_AC-MD-RD.pdf
http://justicepolicy.org/images/upload/07-02_REP_MDMandatoryMinimums_DP-MD.pdf
racial disparities in drug arrests:

This above one is especially important because a lot of people (including black people) have the mistaken idea that half the black community is criminal drug users. White and black rates of drug use (per capita) are about the same http://www.oas.samhsa.gov/2k7/popDensity/popDensity.htm
, yet blacks are imprisoned far out of proportion to their criminality. http://www.hrw.org/en/reports/2008/05/04/targeting-blacks

minorities pay more for mortgages/autoloans:

rental bias:
http://hamptonroads.com/2008/10/rental-bias-study-argues-oversight
disparities in sentencing:
http://answers.google.com/answers/threadview/id/170062.html

thanks for the info valiance.

If it is like you say it is, how would you go about to change that?

[quote]valiance. wrote:
2. systemic racism is definitely true. I’ve made this post a few times here, I’ll make it again:

There are huge advantages to being white in this society. Racism persists in many areas of US life: black people pay more for mortgages, are offered worse interest rates on everything from car loans to mortgages, are paid less wages for doing the same job, are offered jobs less frequently for the same credentials, are imprisoned more often and longer for the same crimes etc etc ad infinitum…

black names a disadvantage in job application:

racial discrimination in the job market:
http://www.chicagogsb.edu/pdf/bertrand.pdf
sounding black hurts your wages:

racial gap in employment:
http://www.lri.lsc.gov/pdf/03/030105_racepref.pdf
differential sentencing by race:
http://justicepolicy.org/images/upload/07-02_REP_MDMandatoryMinimums_DP-MD.pdf
http://www.justicepolicy.org/images/upload/03-10_REP_MDRaceIncarceration_AC-MD-RD.pdf
http://justicepolicy.org/images/upload/07-02_REP_MDMandatoryMinimums_DP-MD.pdf
racial disparities in drug arrests:

This above one is especially important because a lot of people (including black people) have the mistaken idea that half the black community is criminal drug users. White and black rates of drug use (per capita) are about the same http://www.oas.samhsa.gov/2k7/popDensity/popDensity.htm
, yet blacks are imprisoned far out of proportion to their criminality. Targeting Blacks: Drug Law Enforcement and Race in the United States | HRW

minorities pay more for mortgages/autoloans:

rental bias:
http://hamptonroads.com/2008/10/rental-bias-study-argues-oversight
disparities in sentencing:
http://answers.google.com/answers/threadview/id/170062.html[/quote]

I’m not up to speed on all of that, but I do know things like names are correlated but not causally related to success. In other words, people who have kids who are in a situation where they are less likely to succeed name kids “black sounding” names. If you correlate for economic situation of parents and intelligence and such, the disparity in names goes away. So, a name actually has nothing to do with success.

I would also say “sounding black” isn’t a racial issue, it’s a speech issue.

But the bigger issue here is that racial disparity and racial discrimination are many times separate issues. Disparity certainly exist, linking that disparity causally to systematic discrimination is much more elusive.

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:<<< But the bigger issue here is that racial disparity and racial discrimination are many times separate issues. Disparity certainly exist, linking that disparity causally to systematic discrimination is much more elusive.[/quote]There is a real point here. The black people in my church would be guilty of much of this. Not because they hate other black people, but because experience has taught them some things they’d be idiots to ignore. Again, locally polled black people here in Detroit overwhelmingly are more suspicious and un-trusting of other blacks they encounter than they are whites. Why? Because of what they see. Why they see it has been discussed here forever and is a different issue altogether having nothing whatever innately to do with race.

[quote]florelius wrote:
This thread is dedicated to those who wants to discuss everything that has something to do with
racism, be it black racism, white racism, jewish racism, muslim racism, latino racism, systemic racism, history of racism, racism from a sociological point of wiew, racism from a criminological point of wiew, racism from a economical point of wiew etc. If you want to excuse racism or if you want to hate on racism, this is the thread for you.

Some opening questions to get the discussion going:

  1. who of the etnich groups are most racist?

  2. Is systematic racism true?

  3. Is the public more sensitive about racism towards blacks and jews then whites and arabs?

  4. Is racism just about race?

  5. Are racism a natural part of the human species or is it a cultural phenomonen?

discuss.[/quote]

I think racism is a part of peoples’ need to be apart of a group. A part of being apart of a group is excluding others. Excluding others because of race is just one form. I think we will always need to be apart of a group, so people will always be excluded from our groups for one reason or another.

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]valiance. wrote:
2. systemic racism is definitely true. I’ve made this post a few times here, I’ll make it again:

There are huge advantages to being white in this society. Racism persists in many areas of US life: black people pay more for mortgages, are offered worse interest rates on everything from car loans to mortgages, are paid less wages for doing the same job, are offered jobs less frequently for the same credentials, are imprisoned more often and longer for the same crimes etc etc ad infinitum…

black names a disadvantage in job application:

racial discrimination in the job market:
http://www.chicagogsb.edu/pdf/bertrand.pdf
sounding black hurts your wages:

racial gap in employment:
http://www.lri.lsc.gov/pdf/03/030105_racepref.pdf
differential sentencing by race:
http://justicepolicy.org/images/upload/07-02_REP_MDMandatoryMinimums_DP-MD.pdf
http://www.justicepolicy.org/images/upload/03-10_REP_MDRaceIncarceration_AC-MD-RD.pdf
http://justicepolicy.org/images/upload/07-02_REP_MDMandatoryMinimums_DP-MD.pdf
racial disparities in drug arrests:

This above one is especially important because a lot of people (including black people) have the mistaken idea that half the black community is criminal drug users. White and black rates of drug use (per capita) are about the same http://www.oas.samhsa.gov/2k7/popDensity/popDensity.htm
, yet blacks are imprisoned far out of proportion to their criminality. http://www.hrw.org/en/reports/2008/05/04/targeting-blacks

minorities pay more for mortgages/autoloans:

rental bias:
http://hamptonroads.com/2008/10/rental-bias-study-argues-oversight
disparities in sentencing:
http://answers.google.com/answers/threadview/id/170062.html[/quote]

I’m not up to speed on all of that, but I do know things like names are correlated but not causally related to success. In other words, people who have kids who are in a situation where they are less likely to succeed name kids “black sounding” names. If you correlate for economic situation of parents and intelligence and such, the disparity in names goes away. So, a name actually has nothing to do with success.
[/quote]

Correlation != causation is all well and good, but it doesn’t apply here. I’d encourage you (and everyone) to read at least some of the links provided.

In the links I provided there are controlled experiments, not mere correlation studies. Send out identical resumes and change the name at the top to a black-sounding or a white-sounding one. Measure the differences in callbacks. Pretty cut and dry.

Your idea about the disparity decreasing upon controlling for education sounds plausible to me but I’d need to see some data on that before subscribing to it. After all in the links provided the differences studied persisted in spite of controls.

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:
I would also say “sounding black” isn’t a racial issue, it’s a speech issue.
[/quote]

A speech issue with racial components. There are dialects/sublanguages spoken by specific subgroups of society, some of which are racial. Discriminating against people for sounding like a certain racial group can be racial discrimination (it isn’t always).

Read the article at the link. It discusses black people who sound white and black people who sound black, controls for education, training etc. These aren’t amateurs here…

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:
But the bigger issue here is that racial disparity and racial discrimination are many times separate issues. Disparity certainly exist, linking that disparity causally to systematic discrimination is much more elusive.[/quote]

They can be. Discrimination can be difficult to prove, after all “Who knows what evil lurks in the hearts of men?” And on top of that, what if the discrimination is unconscious (as it oh so often is)? Disparate Impact is a pretty well proven legal theory meant to root out unconscious bias and control for the fact that we often can’t tell who is and is not discriminating.

As I said earlier, take a look at some of the links provided. There is a fair bit of causal proof there, or much evidence towards building up that case.

[quote]florelius wrote:
thanks for the info valiance.

If it is like you say it is, how would you go about to change that?[/quote]

You’re very welcome.

You ask a good question. On the legal side we need to decide what kinds of discrimination are illegal and enforce anti-discrimination laws, including funding the DOJ appropriately.

But there are forms of discrimination that are not illegal, that we cannot legislate away, but that are still detrimental to society as a whole. To that end we need increased education, outreach, and societal change on a broad scale.

[quote]valiance. wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]valiance. wrote:
2. systemic racism is definitely true. I’ve made this post a few times here, I’ll make it again:

There are huge advantages to being white in this society. Racism persists in many areas of US life: black people pay more for mortgages, are offered worse interest rates on everything from car loans to mortgages, are paid less wages for doing the same job, are offered jobs less frequently for the same credentials, are imprisoned more often and longer for the same crimes etc etc ad infinitum…

black names a disadvantage in job application:

racial discrimination in the job market:
http://www.chicagogsb.edu/pdf/bertrand.pdf
sounding black hurts your wages:

racial gap in employment:
http://www.lri.lsc.gov/pdf/03/030105_racepref.pdf
differential sentencing by race:
http://justicepolicy.org/images/upload/07-02_REP_MDMandatoryMinimums_DP-MD.pdf
http://www.justicepolicy.org/images/upload/03-10_REP_MDRaceIncarceration_AC-MD-RD.pdf
http://justicepolicy.org/images/upload/07-02_REP_MDMandatoryMinimums_DP-MD.pdf
racial disparities in drug arrests:

This above one is especially important because a lot of people (including black people) have the mistaken idea that half the black community is criminal drug users. White and black rates of drug use (per capita) are about the same http://www.oas.samhsa.gov/2k7/popDensity/popDensity.htm
, yet blacks are imprisoned far out of proportion to their criminality. http://www.hrw.org/en/reports/2008/05/04/targeting-blacks

minorities pay more for mortgages/autoloans:

rental bias:
http://hamptonroads.com/2008/10/rental-bias-study-argues-oversight
disparities in sentencing:
http://answers.google.com/answers/threadview/id/170062.html[/quote]

I’m not up to speed on all of that, but I do know things like names are correlated but not causally related to success. In other words, people who have kids who are in a situation where they are less likely to succeed name kids “black sounding” names. If you correlate for economic situation of parents and intelligence and such, the disparity in names goes away. So, a name actually has nothing to do with success.
[/quote]

Correlation != causation is all well and good, but it doesn’t apply here. I’d encourage you (and everyone) to read at least some of the links provided.

In the links I provided there are controlled experiments, not mere correlation studies. Send out identical resumes and change the name at the top to a black-sounding or a white-sounding one. Measure the differences in callbacks. Pretty cut and dry.

Your idea about the disparity decreasing upon controlling for education sounds plausible to me but I’d need to see some data on that before subscribing to it. After all in the links provided the differences studied persisted in spite of controls.

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:
I would also say “sounding black” isn’t a racial issue, it’s a speech issue.
[/quote]

A speech issue with racial components. There are dialects/sublanguages spoken by specific subgroups of society, some of which are racial. Discriminating against people for sounding like a certain racial group can be racial discrimination (it isn’t always).

Read the article at the link. It discusses black people who sound white and black people who sound black, controls for education, training etc. These aren’t amateurs here…

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:
But the bigger issue here is that racial disparity and racial discrimination are many times separate issues. Disparity certainly exist, linking that disparity causally to systematic discrimination is much more elusive.[/quote]

They can be. Discrimination can be difficult to prove, after all “Who knows what evil lurks in the hearts of men?” And on top of that, what if the discrimination is unconscious (as it oh so often is)? Disparate Impact is a pretty well proven legal theory meant to root out unconscious bias and control for the fact that we often can’t tell who is and is not discriminating.

As I said earlier, take a look at some of the links provided. There is a fair bit of causal proof there, or much evidence towards building up that case.

[quote]florelius wrote:
thanks for the info valiance.

If it is like you say it is, how would you go about to change that?[/quote]

You’re very welcome.

You ask a good question. On the legal side we need to decide what kinds of discrimination are illegal and enforce anti-discrimination laws, including funding the DOJ appropriately.

But there are forms of discrimination that are not illegal, that we cannot legislate away, but that are still detrimental to society as a whole. To that end we need increased education, outreach, and societal change on a broad scale.[/quote]

Good points. I wasn’t saying there it isn’t there. For example Higher sentencing for black could be partially do to living in inner city areas where judges are less forgiving. Just like there aren’t many black in the NHL and whites are underrepresented in the MLB/NBA. It doesn’t always mean racism.

Though I must admit I have been witness to a couple incidences recently in which I was taken back by several people of authority’s racism and has made me re-think some things.

What I was talking about with names was from 1 of the 2 freakonomics books. Though he discussed life outcomes in terms of earnings and such if I remember correctly, not directly job applications.

[quote]florelius wrote:
This thread is dedicated to those who wants to discuss everything that has something to do with
racism, be it black racism, white racism, jewish racism, muslim racism, latino racism, systemic racism, history of racism, racism from a sociological point of wiew, racism from a criminological point of wiew, racism from a economical point of wiew etc. If you want to excuse racism or if you want to hate on racism, this is the thread for you.

Some opening questions to get the discussion going:

  1. who of the etnich groups are most racist?

  2. Is systematic racism true?

  3. Is the public more sensitive about racism towards blacks and jews then whites and arabs?

  4. Is racism just about race?

  5. Are racism a natural part of the human species or is it a cultural phenomonen?

discuss.[/quote]

  1. All ethnic groups are racist. There are numerous studies showing that children react differently to different races from early age. Race has numerous implications from skull structure and brain volume to how we react to different drugs or deposit fat.

I think we also need to differentiate between two major forms of racism:
Passive Racism:
Passive racism is isolation; wanting to be with your own kind. This means socializing, dating and mating inside your race. Trading when possible. Passive racism does not seek to put down other races, passive racists just want to pick their own company. We all practice a form of passive discrimination every day of our lives. We choose who to hang with, who to avoid on the streets, what businesses to use or not etc. In short, passive racism is trying to make the choices that make us most happy without infringing the rights of others.

Active Racism:
Active racism is invasion; cherishing your own race but also demanding support from a different race. In Norway or Finland, active racism is supported by the government and directed against whites. Active racism in Norway and Finland is realized by africans, arabs and mystery meats coming to our countries to use and abuse the benefits granted by the state, and to demand more and more of white people’s space as well as cry racism at every opportunity. Active racism also leads to high crime against a different race. Example: In Norway (or is it just Oslo) a staggering 40% of rapes are committed by minorities, and white women and girls suffer disproportionately. Active racists mostly sit unemployed but even if they were to work, the living standards of Norway, Finland or USA would still go down because a lower IQ society (brought by non-whites) cannot function as effectively and perform the same work as effectively as a higher IQ one.
Active racism is born out of the fact that a race figures they have things to gain from associating with another race, such as disproportional money, housing, access to attractive women, fictional hero status based on no merits whatsoever and all kinds of luxuries their own race cannot provide them with.
America is also a severely battered victim of active racism with mestizos (increasingly), small minorities, jews (figuratively, the black will stab you but the jew will give him the knife through his indoctrination and legislature) and blacks waging a kind of undeclared race war against whites in a manner us in Finland and Norway are starting to feel too, though our non-white populations have not yet reached the same mass. A finnish, norwegian, american or african society is such because of biology; humans make up the society. When africans dominate the numbers in Norway, Norway essentially becomes an african society, similar to South Africa, Sudan or Sierra Leone. Beautiful philosophies cannot transcend flesh, blood and genes. Our flesh produces the kind of philosophies we believe in.
If active racism is not cut at the root quickly, it becomes harder to root out. Americans can still voice their sound against non-white muslims to some extent without being hunted down (partially because jews are ambivalent about them at least) but they can no longer do the same about blacks. Blacks have infiltrated so thoroughly that only a few have the gall to challenge the status quo anymore. Extended Scandinavia has shown similar with its indian gypsies as a marvelous example. They are not white and almost every one of them is a thief and scoundrel at best and a murderer at worst, but due to them being around for centuries, we have grown accustomed to accepting them as ‘swedes’ or ‘finns’. Our countries still have the chance.

  1. Is systematic racism true? Racism follows the guidelines set by biology.
    A cuckoo will lay her eggs in the nest of a bird of alien race because it’s in her nature. Her biology dictates that it is the best for her. It’s good for them and sucks for the other race (the other bird)
    With humans, even dull humans, there is arguably more learning involved but people still seek the same instinctual gratification which they consider to perpetuate their genes the best.

  2. Yes. My above answer addresses this a bit. Whites have built such wealthy civilizations that whites think they can afford to take a knife to a gun fight, so to speak and because of white people’s big brains, whites can ironically be taught to act against their instincts and best nature by feeding them a pack of sophisticated lies and instilling guilt in them, which feeds into the sophisticated moral character of whites, becoming their weakness. You can’t take a dog into university and lecture him about the evils and racisms of his ways because a dog does not have the smarts and morals to care, but will instead do what comes naturally to him. A dog will not be swayed by a professor’s sleight of verbal gymnastics and credentials.

  3. I don’t understand this question.

  4. Racism is genetic. However, racism can be heightened or weakened depending on one’s influences

[quote]MaximusB wrote:

  1. Everyone not from your tribe. I think this is biological programming at work, which is instilled at a young age. Go to a playground, and most kids are playing with each other. It is adults who program the kids to lean one way or another as to who to side with.

  2. Unknown.

  3. No, each group is an equal opportunity hater. I don’t think any single group is more racist than another, none that I can think of at least. I think the media does pick and choose what it wants to show which creates a bias.

  4. No, not just about race. It could be religious, socio-economic, political, the haterade runneth deep.

  5. Yes. This is a biological instinct IMO. You see this with immigrant communities who flood a particular city and take root there. [/quote]

You mean it’s social programming from parents or society as they grow older. I agree, kids do not know racism until they are taught it. Therefore, it is most definitely not “biological”.

[quote]valiance. wrote:
2. systemic racism is definitely true. I’ve made this post a few times here, I’ll make it again:

There are huge advantages to being white in this society. Racism persists in many areas of US life: black people pay more for mortgages, are offered worse interest rates on everything from car loans to mortgages, are paid less wages for doing the same job, are offered jobs less frequently for the same credentials, are imprisoned more often and longer for the same crimes etc etc ad infinitum…

black names a disadvantage in job application:

racial discrimination in the job market:
http://www.chicagogsb.edu/pdf/bertrand.pdf
sounding black hurts your wages:

racial gap in employment:
http://www.lri.lsc.gov/pdf/03/030105_racepref.pdf
differential sentencing by race:
http://justicepolicy.org/images/upload/07-02_REP_MDMandatoryMinimums_DP-MD.pdf
http://www.justicepolicy.org/images/upload/03-10_REP_MDRaceIncarceration_AC-MD-RD.pdf
http://justicepolicy.org/images/upload/07-02_REP_MDMandatoryMinimums_DP-MD.pdf
racial disparities in drug arrests:

This above one is especially important because a lot of people (including black people) have the mistaken idea that half the black community is criminal drug users. White and black rates of drug use (per capita) are about the same http://www.oas.samhsa.gov/2k7/popDensity/popDensity.htm
, yet blacks are imprisoned far out of proportion to their criminality. http://www.hrw.org/en/reports/2008/05/04/targeting-blacks

minorities pay more for mortgages/autoloans:

rental bias:
http://hamptonroads.com/2008/10/rental-bias-study-argues-oversight
disparities in sentencing:
http://answers.google.com/answers/threadview/id/170062.html[/quote]

Guess what? Stop naming your kid some ridiculous fucking name that will hamstring him for life!

Keep good credit! Mortgage apps and such do not have race included in the application!

There are NO white neighborhoods that I’m aware of that have “open air” drug dealing. Maybe that explains the differential in the arrest figures.

I’m not denying racism exists or even attempting to be insensitive to real racism, but I have no fucking sympathy for self-inflicted wounds.

[quote]Alffi wrote:

  1. All ethnic groups are racist. There are numerous studies showing that children react differently to different races from early age.

[/quote]

Post at least one peer reviewed published study supporting the above claim and that "reacting differently is evidence of “racism” at an early age.

[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:<<< Guess what? Stop naming your kid some ridiculous fucking name that will hamstring him for life!

Keep good credit! Mortgage apps and such do not have race included in the application!

There are NO white neighborhoods that I’m aware of that have “open air” drug dealing. Maybe that explains the differential in the arrest figures.

I’m not denying racism exists or even attempting to be insensitive to real racism, but I have no fucking sympathy for self-inflicted wounds.
[/quote]I pretty much agree and the many black people I call brothers and sisters pretty much do as well.

snipping the quote tree

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

Good points. I wasn’t saying there it isn’t there. For example Higher sentencing for black could be partially do to living in inner city areas where judges are less forgiving. Just like there aren’t many black in the NHL and whites are underrepresented in the MLB/NBA. It doesn’t always mean racism.
[/quote]

I agree it’s not alwaaaays racism but why would judges necessarily be less forgiving in the inner city? That’s a weird assumption that bears some thinking about I think.

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

Though I must admit I have been witness to a couple incidences recently in which I was taken back by several people of authority’s racism and has made me re-think some things.

What I was talking about with names was from 1 of the 2 freakonomics books. Though he discussed life outcomes in terms of earnings and such if I remember correctly, not directly job applications.

[/quote]

Good on you for thinking about things openly. Yeah the Freakonomics data is interesting but not even close to the strongest data out there.

@ Alffi, I hope to god you stay in fuckin Finland forever. Holy shit your attitude is scary.

[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:
Guess what? Stop naming your kid some ridiculous fucking name that will hamstring him for life!
[/quote]

Why are black sounding names automatically ridiculous?

Why should “sounding black”? or sounding “southern” disqualify you from a job for which public speaking and customer interaction isn’t necessary? (this isnt necessarily racism it could be discrimination of a geographical kind)

[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:
Keep good credit! Mortgage apps and such do not have race included in the application!
[/quote]

Hard to keep good credit when you pay more for everything and can’t find a job. In studies it’s been shown that it’s easier for a white man with a felony conviction to get a job than it is for a black non offender: http://www.northwestern.edu/ipr/publications/newsletter/iprn0509/incarceration.html

[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:
There are NO white neighborhoods that I’m aware of that have “open air” drug dealing. Maybe that explains the differential in the arrest figures.
[/quote]

Good point!

My question: Is it fair to disproportionately target “open air” drug dealing? It hasn’t reduced drug consumption, as far as I know. The only disceraable effect of this discriminatory policy (today, not 30 years ago) is to imprison black men out of proportion with their criminality.

And after arrest, is it fair for sentencing to be harsher for blacks over whites?

[quote]valiance. wrote:
snipping the quote tree

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

Good points. I wasn’t saying there it isn’t there. For example Higher sentencing for black could be partially do to living in inner city areas where judges are less forgiving. Just like there aren’t many black in the NHL and whites are underrepresented in the MLB/NBA. It doesn’t always mean racism.
[/quote]

I agree it’s not alwaaaays racism but why would judges necessarily be less forgiving in the inner city? That’s a weird assumption that bears some thinking about I think.

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

Though I must admit I have been witness to a couple incidences recently in which I was taken back by several people of authority’s racism and has made me re-think some things.

What I was talking about with names was from 1 of the 2 freakonomics books. Though he discussed life outcomes in terms of earnings and such if I remember correctly, not directly job applications.

[/quote]

Good on you for thinking about things openly. Yeah the Freakonomics data is interesting but not even close to the strongest data out there.

@ Alffi, I hope to god you stay in fuckin Finland forever. Holy shit your attitude is scary.

[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:
Guess what? Stop naming your kid some ridiculous fucking name that will hamstring him for life!
[/quote]

Why are black sounding names automatically ridiculous?

Why should “sounding black”? or sounding “southern” disqualify you from a job for which public speaking and customer interaction isn’t necessary? (this isnt necessarily racism it could be discrimination of a geographical kind)

[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:
Keep good credit! Mortgage apps and such do not have race included in the application!
[/quote]

Hard to keep good credit when you pay more for everything and can’t find a job. In studies it’s been shown that it’s easier for a white man with a felony conviction to get a job than it is for a black non offender: http://www.northwestern.edu/ipr/publications/newsletter/iprn0509/incarceration.html

[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:
There are NO white neighborhoods that I’m aware of that have “open air” drug dealing. Maybe that explains the differential in the arrest figures.
[/quote]

Good point!

My question: Is it fair to disproportionately target “open air” drug dealing? It hasn’t reduced drug consumption, as far as I know. The only disceraable effect of this discriminatory policy (today, not 30 years ago) is to imprison black men out of proportion with their criminality.

And after arrest, is it fair for sentencing to be harsher for blacks over whites?
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/07/weekinreview/07glater.html[/quote]

This is racism?
Last week, the Supreme Court heard arguments over the right of a judge to depart from sentencing guidelines that call for far harsher penalties for crimes involving crack cocaine compared with powdered cocaine. The difference in these guidelines unavoidably involves race since black cocaine users are more likely to use crack, which is a cheaper form of the drug

Since when is a study from 31 years ago considered relevant today?

…And the study used in the McCleskey case, conducted in Georgia back in the 1980s,

I suppose the rich should also be taxed more heavily now to pay for better representation for blacks in America because it is racist for them to get longer sentences after using FREE legal counsel? If a group of people wants to better themselves, work hard and stop falling into the sterotypical roles. When people of any color continue to act like a sterotype, it will continue being a sterotype. When is it truth and not just a sterotype?

[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:

[quote]Alffi wrote:

  1. All ethnic groups are racist. There are numerous studies showing that children react differently to different races from early age.

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Post at least one peer reviewed published study supporting the above claim and that "reacting differently is evidence of “racism” at an early age. [/quote]

Sorry if that does not satisfy you. A lot of stuff goes back decades and I could not hope to locate it online, as it predated wide internet use. Anyway, I don’t see it as groundbreaking because I think it’s pretty well-established that humans react differently to faces of different sexes as well, and I don’t think it’s usually seen as very sexist.

The Oxford English Dictionary cites the earliest known usage of the word “racism” in English occurred in a 1936 book by the American fascist Lawrence Dennis, ‘The Coming American Fascism’.

Racism is a ridiculous word made up by a fascist. Everyone HAS to discriminate based on race when they are dealing with someone they don’t know. If I had a choice to fly in a commercial airliner piloted by an Arab or piloted by a Chinese person I would ‘discriminate’ against the Arab based on past experience.

See EgyptAir flight 990 for one example of why I would ‘discriminate’ and commit an act of ‘racism’.

[quote]SexMachine wrote:<<<See EgyptAir flight 990 for one example of why I would ‘discriminate’ and commit an act of ‘racism’.[/quote]In my opinion that is not racism. That’s common sense. Racism would be if you disparaged Arab or semitic individuals because they’re Arab or semitic. Say if you rejected an Arab woman your son wanted to marry despite every indication of her being a decent upright person who would make a fine mate for your son and mother for your grand children. “Don’t bring that camel jockey to MY house”.

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:

[quote]SexMachine wrote:<<<See EgyptAir flight 990 for one example of why I would ‘discriminate’ and commit an act of ‘racism’.[/quote]In my opinion that is not racism. That’s common sense. Racism would be if you disparaged Arab or semitic individuals because they’re Arab or semitic. Say if you rejected an Arab woman your son wanted to marry despite every indication of her being a decent upright person who would make a fine mate for your son and mother for your grand children. “Don’t bring that camel jockey to MY house”.
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But your opinion about what’s racist and what’s not doesn’t alter the meaning of the word nor how it is generally used by people. Racism means to ‘discriminate’ based on ‘race’. If you want to come up with a new word for people who have an irrational hatred of an entire ethnic group then do so by all means.

BTW - I would advise my son that Anglo-Saxons/Celts(i.e. whites) have an average birthrate of around 1.7 children per couple and that it is his duty to do his part to keep our ethnic group extant. It would be ‘racist’ of him to marry a non-white and thus contribute to the decline of our ethnic group and the ethnic group of his prospective partner.

I’m talking about the negative vernacular that is most of the time intended when the charge of racism is hurled at someone. We have many words whose common usage has come to diverge from their strict etymology.

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
I’m talking about the negative vernacular that is most of the time intended when the charge of racism is hurled at someone. We have many words whose common usage has come to diverge from their strict etymology.[/quote]

There are loads of people who would call me a racist for my decision to fly Air China as opposed to EgyptAir. In fact, pretty much everyone on the left would.

But your second point is correct. An annoying case in point: the word ‘problematic’ used to just mean ‘uncertain’. Due to people who didn’t know what it meant using it to convey the idea of something ‘containing problems’, most revised dictionaries now record both meanings.