Just. Don't. Suck (Part 1)

I just looked at this program. Doesn’t look too bad at all. I actually like a lot of stuff that he puts out. Seems to be reasonable for most people.

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It always catches my attention if you talk about performance and physique. The sad reality is that I already know this stuff; I just don’t put it to good use.

@robstein, I’ll tag you here because I really do have some questions. I’m struggling to accept high volume training. I feel like I had a pretty good session today and I’ll do another one on Friday that hits the same muscles.

I see @jackolee doing way more work than me. Is it necessary? Is the volume the key or is it fatigue? I prefer doing things like 1.5 reps to failure for two or three sets instead of 5 x 10.

I kind of follow CT’s Best Damn principles where you do a couple of progressively heavier sets to get to your working weight and then you go all out for one set. The mindset is similar to the PR set of 5/3/1 but you do rest/pause, myo reps, slow eccentrics, etc to increase TUT.

My main goal is to continue losing weight (5-7 more lbs). My secondary goal (which will become my primary once I reach 215 lbs) is to add size to my chest and shoulders.

Here’s today’s session. I’m doing a pull/push/lower split and only hitting legs directly once a week.

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I simply try to keep it stupid simple. 20-25 sets per muscle group per week. Push it as hard as I can. I find my joints are happier with higher reps rather than heavier weight.

I very well might be going about it the wrong way, but have never really followed a specific training plan. I mix up exercises when I get bored but other than that 4-5 exercises per muscle group twice a week. Then just blast legs once a week as hard as I can stand it and limp around for a day or two lol.

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I’ve always been a text book guy in addition to actual gym experience. I know the rep ranges for different training goals (power, strength, hypertrophy) and the total volume per week suggested by research (60-120 reps for big muscles, 30-60 for isolation exercises).

With that knowledge, I know that 60 reps per session twice a week is supposed to be enough; however, I see bodybuilders doing way more than that. I also see CT write stuff that contradicts high volume training.

I don’t know which one is right! Sadly, I can’t say which method has worked for me because I’ve tried a ton of stuff and haven’t really grown since I was in my early 20s. That was a time where I just ate garbage and trained hard.

I was actually just looking back at old pictures and I was definitely bigger. I wasn’t lean but my arms, chest, and shoulders looked bigger in a shirt compared to now.

The sad part of looking back at photos over the years is that I don’t really look like I lift. I almost look thin. Maybe it’s a wardrobe thing; I might need clothes that fit better. Unfortunately, that would mean having everything I buy tailored.

The everlasting conundrum. What’s “right” is what is best suited to get you accomplishing your goals as quickly as possible.

SO, as you’re tagging me here (thanks for the tag!) I’m sure by now you know my first question will be, what is your goal?

Knowing that’s one of your goals, you’ll need to train in a way that’ll allow you to increase muscle mass in those areas, which is a lot more than compound heavy pressing. You’ll need a variety of chest exercises, focusing more towards isolation than you probably have. Doing unilateral cable work is an outstanding, and painful way to build your chest. Shoulders, you better get used to doing some higher volume and hitting all heads of the delt in a variety of ways.

General principles for growth is enough TUT and a variety of rep ranges in your workout. 24 working sets per session is a good upper limit, unless you’re assisted in which case, go nuts.

Absolutely. I’ve never counted reps in a training session, but if I think about it, somewhere between 120-160, 5 days a week.

What specifically is it you’re struggling with?

Talk more about what you really want out of your training, and we’ll take it from there!

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I’m struggling with necessity? Is it necessary to do four shoulder exercises with three sets of each?

I actually just finished reading the articles you posted in the other log and I’m about to look at the workout.

For years I’ve made sure to hit my back and legs harder than my chest and shoulders (at least I think I have). I didn’t want to be another dope that hit the mirror muscles and ended up looking silly with bad posture and chicken legs.

Well, I guess the joke’s on me because my delts and pecs don’t exactly pop from under my shirt.

I’m going to check out the workout you posted to see how it differs from my various approaches from the past.

I can honestly say I’ve never done a split that only trained each muscle once per week. There are so many people saying it’s obit effective for enhanced guys!

But, hey, the definition of insanity is doing the same thing and expecting different results. What have I got to lose?

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You took the wet words out of my mouth

3.6.19

Woke at 220.2 lbs. That’s three days in a row at 220 so I think it’s an official weight!

I have PT in an hour. I’m going to ask for him to evaluate my hip but also ask him to start treating me for IT band syndrome. Aleve continues to be the best answer right now. It’s the difference between limping and being pain free on the stairs.

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Three days at 220 huh… that means 219’s gonna pole it’s head up here real soon. With a goal of 215 you almostcthere man! Keep after it. Hope PT goes well today and they can give some stuff to do at home to offer relief.

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If your goal is to make your shoulders bigger and evenly developed, then yes it is.

x2 on the above then!

Truly, I have no idea where this comes from. IMO the only difference between training for enhanced vs. natty is volume, there’s only so much volume you can handle naturally before you reach the point of diminishing returns, again about 24 working sets but maybe more depending on the individual. Some of my workouts are 16-20 working sets, in and out in 45min. When I was doing full body routines my workouts lasted over 2 hours and I still performed well because I had a full day off in between sessions. Only way to know what your optimal volume really is, is time and experimentation. Will probably take a year or more to really know.

As I mentioned before - go to ANY natural bodybuilding show, and everyone on stage will tell you they do a form of standard bodybuilding splits. Look at WNBF world championships and tell me it’s not “working” for those competitors. While there’s always more progress to be made, I’ve been using some form of split routine exclusively for the past 4 years and have made damn good progress. Split routines work for everyone if you execute them properly!

Looking forward to hearing your thoughts on the programs I posted and your progress!

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Do you think that when training specifically for gaining mass (assuming that the individual is meeting their calories / macro needs) that lower rep ranges and heavier loads are necessary? After my competition I’m going to focus on gaining mass, and have failed in the past. I’ve gotton stronger, put on size, only to be back at the same weight again. I want to get it right this go around. What kind of a macro breakdown would you recommend for growth?

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#franticallytakingnotes

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Great question. Growth comes from a combination of proper training and nutrition. People sometimes ask, “what’s the percentage? training to nutrition?” I think it’s 100% of both!

Training - Lower reps (I classify as 5 reps, I don’t ever go below that personally as I feel it’s just begging for injury over time), are helpful for sure and will help improve strength. You work on strength so that you can increase the weight on your mid and higher rep exercises and keep growing. So if you’re able to do lateral shoulder raises with 25lb dumbbells for 15 reps, you want to get stronger so eventually so you can 15 reps with 30lbs, etc.

The vast majority of my training is spent in the 8-12 range, up to 15-20 for certain muscle groups, like shoulders or arms. I go largely by feel for the day, sometimes incorporating 5-6 reps of something, but not always.

Be sure to take pictures to gauge progress as well. My 3rd and 4th shows I came in 8 pounds lighter than my 1st and 2nd shows, but looked way bigger and more proportional. If you lose 5lbs of fat and gain 5lbs of muscle, your weight won’t change but you’ll sure look different!

We’ll start with the king - total calories. IMO to gain muscle with minimal fat (I swear if I hear “clean bulk” one more time I’m gonna pull out the 3 hairs I have left) takes a 10-20% surplus. If you’ve got a naturally fast metabolism, you can get away with the higher end of that spectrum. I usually go 10-15% surplus when trying to gain. Doesn’t take a huge amount of extra calories, and the leaner you are, the easier it is to keep putting on muscle. One of my clients, we’ve been working together 6 months, he started already at around 9-10% body fat, and still is, but he’s gained 12 pounds. We’ve been very meticulous on his nutrition, and training.

Macros - Also largely depends on the individual. I use to think I needed low carbs, only to find after much experimentation that I get leaner and feel way better with more carbs! I can comfortably maintain 9-10% body fat on 180g-200g carbs a day.

My “starting point” recommendation would be:
Protein - 1g per pound of bodyweight.
Carbs - 1g per pound of bodyweight.
Fats - Fill the rest of your cals with good quality fats.

From there, I’d recommend leaving protein as is, and see how you respond. You may find upping carbs even more and lowering fats is where you want to be. For me, I feel and perform great, and can maintain the conditioning I want at these macros:

Protein - 160g
Carbs - 200g
Fats - 50g

Puts me at about 1900 cals a day right now and slowly leaning out more for summer. On a gaining phase, I’d leave protein and fats where they are, and make up the difference in quality carbs.

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Thank you for the detailed response. I appreciate it. 9 more days of prep and then it’s time to eat!

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I think it’s a “being well over 6 foot” thing. Don’t beat yourself up so much man

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@robstein I’ll follow along here as well, you know your stuff.
So put all your gold in here or the other log you replied to yesterday.
Much appreciate your contribution on these forums.

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@mortdk thank you very much, I really appreciate that. Always happy to offer anything I can, these forums and T-Nation have had such a significant role in my life. Anything we can do to help each other, I’m all in!

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Thank you for all of your free advice! I’m in the middle of detailing my plan based on the workout you shared in @isdatnutty’s log. For those of you that missed it, check it out!

I’m at the gym now. These new rest periods are looooong. I’ll be back later with an update from PT.

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Physical Therapy

Physical therapy was good. I think I learned something. Time will tell. It turn out I’ve been doing my hip exercises a bit wrong and it’s allowed my TFL to do the work instead of the desired muscles. In this case, the target muscle is the glute medius. It turns out that mine is gone. I have a large divot/crater/dimple in my butt cheek where it’s supposed to be. It’s completely dormant right now. I need to roll forward more when I’m on myside so that my TFL can’t kick in and do the work. For a side lying hip abduction move, I actually have to extend my hip and abduct. If I don’t do the extension then my TFL takes over and my leg comes forward.

I’m happy to have learned something, but frustrated that my attempts to get better have actually made me worse. They also showed me a glute bridge variation that I like way better than the old fashioned bridge. I do a bridge and hold it. I pick up my foot so all of my weight shifts to one leg. I just hold that position and alternate feet. It feels much more effective than just moving up and down in terms of hitting my glutes.

The plan moving forward is to do PT twice a week for four to six weeks. My only homework is to do the reverse clams and lying hip abduction correctly as well as the bridge work and some hip flexor stretching. I think this will help with the weakness and dysfunction in my hip, but it won’t cure everything. I can’t deny that I need this work even if it doesn’t cure everything. I’ll pursue this first and then decide what I need to do about my hip pain. I have some severe pinching/pain when my femur is internally rotated and flexed.

My limitations for now are to avoid going to 90 degrees of hip flexion. I can basically do half squats, lunges, etc. I can do rack pulls as long as my IT band pain allows it. Today I couldn’t do hack squats because of my knee and hip pain. I could do glute, hamstring, and calf work with both legs but I only worked the right leg on hack squats and RFESS.


Leg Day

WARM UP

HACK SQUAT MACHINE (r leg only)
180 x 10 (both legs, figured out this hurts)
90 x 6 x 5 sets (2-3 minutes rest)

RFESS (r leg only)
60 x 8 x 4 sets (1 minute rest)

LYING LEG CURL
140 x 8 x 4 sets (1 minute rest)

SEATED LEG CURL
115 x 15 x 3 sets (45 sec rest)

STANDING CALF MACHINE
250 x 10 x 4 sets (1 minute rest)

SEATED CALF RAISE
45 x 15 x 3 sets (45 sec rest)

My new training split isn’t a whole lot different from what I’ve been doing. I chose to go with the four day per week Tried and True Bodybuilding Template. I chose the four day program because it only has me work out on two work days compared to three on the five day plan.

Monday will be Shoulders/Tri’s/Abs, Tuesday or Wednesday is Legs, Thursday is Chest/Bi’s, and Friday or Saturday is Back/Abs. The template is laid out for Mon, Tues, Thurs, Fri but I might do it Mon, Wed, Thurs, Sat.

It’s going to take some adjusting on my part because this is forcing me to rest longer than I prefer. I’ve gotten pretty accustomed to setting my timer for 45 seconds and getting after it when it beeps. I’m supposed to rest for 2-5 minutes on the heavy sets, 1-2 minutes on the moderate sets (8-12 rep range), and 30-60 seconds on the lighter stuff (12+ reps). I’m going to rest for 2-3 minutes on heavy stuff, 60 seconds on the moderate stuff, and 45 seconds on the lighter stuff. The articles I read about this program reminded me that rest is there for a purpose and it’s not always time to go just because you feel recovered. The body still has work to do to prepare for the next set. I’m looking forward to this set up, and I know I’ll need to commit to it for a long time.

My only problem with this program is my injuries. As of now I’m scheduled to go see my shoulder doc on April 6th. We’re basically going to discuss my ongoing problems with my biceps tendon and schedule surgery. I’m hoping that PT can right the ship in regards to my hip and let me know if I need to have that bone removed or not. The down side of that procedure is that it can’t be removed until it’s done growing. If it’s removed prior to that point then it will grow back. There’s still a chance it could grow back again. I’m optimistic that mine wouldn’t because it’s a result of surgery. The chronic problems seem to develop on their own or after a severe spinal injury.

All in all today was a good day. My body sucks but I’m still happy. I hope you all had a good one as well!

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