Good points.
I just struggle with the whole male patriarchy and toxic masculinity, but I want to be dominated concept. TBH, I’m a momma’s boy. I follow women upstairs to catch their fall, lead them downstairs to protect them from falling, walk on the side of traffic, open doors for them, then they wanna get dragged by Stanley.
As Churchill said, “it is a riddle, wrapped in a mystery, inside an enigma.”
EDIT: I think the all time best seller is the bible. Weird times for sure.
The word novel is key there. Not sure religious texts fall under novel. Although atheists would put them there lol.
You are correct sir, and will notice that I did not use the term novel or fiction, lol, just left it at “all time best seller.”
Another conundrum - what genre is the bible? I think Religious Text fits best.
Some want bad boys, but none want the responsibilities of dealing with the consequences of their poor decisions—on their own!
You play, you pay!
I’ve long thought that “bad boys” falsely convey the qualities that good women looking for good relationships desire in men: confidence; ego strength (which was described by Angry Chicken as “having a strong frame”); and a sexually dominant nature. Genuine bad boys are insecure. They can’t any longer give a shit what people think of them because it would be too painful, and that mimics confidence and belief in oneself. Sexual dominance just is what it is. Being with an asshole or bully is what makes it dangerous or demeaning.
A scene that’s really stood out to me (is seared into my mind, actually) is the Dr. Melfi parking garage rape scene in The Sopranos. I hear and see a lot of horrible things through work, but this honestly felt traumatizing to me and my heart rate went right back up when I found this vid and watched part of it. Not sure if I can embed this and if so, how (mods?) so I’ll leave a couple of options. It’s only a minute and a half long:
NSFW: Employee of the Month -rape attempt / Watch online
In contrast, I recall vividly my first experience of “bodice ripper” romance novels. I was 17 and moving into an apartment. My roommate said something about getting a bookcase out of what was to be my room and I said don’t bother, I’m a huge reader. But friends, I was not yet a well-rounded reader. I was a library books girl, and always had been. Those smut novels, tho! They were like stumbling onto the best candy ever after a lifetime of healthy meals.
But the beautiful young woman who stows away on a ship because some debauched elderly earl is trying to force her into marriage and then it turns out to be a pirate ship, of all things, with a handsome-but-blackhearted pirate captain, etc, has NOTHING to do with what happens in that video or real life, regardless of any “misunderstandings” that may have the pirate “callously taking” an at-first-terrified-but-soon-smitten (and orgasming) young woman.
A Streetcar Named Desire seems to blur the lines. I didn’t find Stanley desirable, but I saw it as an adult. Would someone who hasn’t experienced violence find it stimulating? I guess so!
I have mixed feelings about the current social-political environment, as I suppose anyone capable of nuanced thought would. Some of what we’re seeing is positive change and some of it is a modern-day witch hunt. I don’t know any women who haven’t felt as if they were dealing with predatory and frightening males at one time or another. I used to think it happened only to relatively attractive girls/women, but not so. I think it may be even worse for overweight or very ugly girls because the angry guys target them as being “grateful” for the attention and become enraged when they are not.
For this, as with many things, I blame the thousands of 24/7 “news” outlets, which have to either find or make up enough content to fill their airtime or pages or what have you.
Real quick/not to interrupt, but the forum doesn’t recognize embedded videos from some sites, so I took the liberty of plugging in the same clip (extended version) from Youtube, which the forum automatically embeds.
I also tossed an NSFW mention for anyone reading from their cubicle since Cutscenes appears to be pretty much a porn site.
No worries, back on track.
I had no idea! SORRY.
It came up in a google search for “melfi rape scene”…not my usual hangout…lol
It just occurred, my god, people watch that as PORN?? WTF WTF WTF.
Wow, just wow.
What a thoughtful and well written response. I feel more equipped now to deal with society - not being sarcastic.
TBH, rape scenes are always disturbing to me, and the play for Streetcar was much more disturbing than the movie since the movie basically skipped over it.
Or maybe I am just a reader - I always like the written better than the visual.
I think the Melfi rape was so disturbing because we identified with her so well - she was such a great juxtaposition to Tony’s lack of humanity.
With respect to bodice rippers, I read a Nora Roberts novel as prep to write my own (published under a pen name) and was surprised how much I got into it. It was so poorly written, but the characters were compelling. I had an editor tell me there are aspects of fiction - writing, characters, and story. She said that if you had two of the three, you had a good novel, but that she would follow a good character anywhere.
You might appreciate Gothic novels, specifically The Monk and The Italian. Read them in that order if you are inclined. The first was written by MG Lewis, who Stephen King called the Sid Vicious of Gothic literature. The latter was a feminine response to the first. They both explore the difference between terror and horror, and there is a long litany of argument about that, but I do not suspect you are interested or inclined.
I would quote you on socio-political environment, but you covered it in depth - got nothing to add.
Thanks for responding. You are so smart.
I disagree. I think it’s that it shows the utter lack of concern for her humanity, the absolute disregard for her as a person alike to one’s mother or sister or neighbor, that real rape is built upon. I don’t think it would have mattered one bit to me if I’d never watched the show, that clip would be extremely stressful to me in any context. It was very well done in that regard.
And for the record, I park illegally every day because I won’t park in the nearby parking garage I’m meant to park in.
Thank you for the compliment!
I think that was what was so disturbing - that she had humanity and was so violated. In contrast to Tony, who lacked humanity.
I think we are saying the same thing, just 180 degrees.
You’re a gansgsta!
She really is!
Did you ever check the local laws and the postings in the lot you use to see if you were in danger of getting your car impounded? I know the discussion was had, but it’s been a while back.
Oh, and referencing back to the Beta Orbiting thread, does me inquiring about your well-being in this matter constitute white-knighting? 
Tony is irrelevant to my reaction, a video of an unknown woman that showed what that one does would elicit the same response. I wonder if the context matters more for you because you’re male. You’re relating to the story whereas I’m imagining myself in her place, which is very easy to do. I suspect that would be the case for most women. Nothing to do with her decency; it’s all about her relative lack of strength and therefore overwhelming vulnerability. It’s terrifying to watch.
I looked closely at the signs, but they seemed more focused on stealing shopping carts, which is not currently within the scope of my criminal operations, than parking for longer than three hours. We’ve continued to park there without consequence, which is encouraging as the winter, with the snow piles and increased holiday traffic to the shopping center, should be their main concern. Sometimes I park facing the opposite direction, which is probably keeping them off balance.
You’re just a shill for the betas and their female overlords!
Aw, shit. As a woman, you are obviously correct. As a screenwriter (my MFA), I am correct.
Of course, this begs the question, which is more important, and I think we both know the answer to that.