T Nation

The Cost of Illegal Aliens

Hope these 14 reasons are forwarded over and over again until they are read by the majority of Americans. Then they will have something to yell at their U.S. Congress members.

14 Reasons to Deport Illegal Aliens…

  1. $11 Billion to $22 billion is spent on welfare to illegal aliens each year. http://tinyurl.com/zob77

  2. $2.2 Billion dollars a year is spent on food assistance programs such as food stamps, WIC, and free school lunches for illegal aliens. http://www.cis.org/articles/2004/fiscalexec.html

  3. $2.5 Billion dollars a year is spent on Medicaid for illegal aliens. http://www.cis.org/articles/2004/fiscalexec.html

  4. $12 Billion dollars a year is spent on primary and secondary school education for children here illegally and they cannot speak a word of English! http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.0.html

  5. $17 Billion dollars a year is spent for education for the American-born children of illegal aliens, known as anchor babies. http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html

  6. $3 Million Dollars a DAY is spent to incarcerate illegal aliens. http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html

  7. 30% percent of all Federal Prison inmates are illegal aliens. http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html

  8. $90 Billion Dollars a year is spent on illegal aliens for Welfare & social services by the American taxpayers. http://premium.cnn.com/TRANSCIPTS/0610/29/ldt.01.html

  9. $200 Billion Dollars a year in suppressed American wages are caused by the illegal aliens. http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html

  10. The illegal aliens in the United States have a crime rate that’s two and a half times that of white non-illegal aliens. In particular, their children, are going to make a huge additional crime problem in the United States http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0606/12/ldt.01.html

  11. During the year of 2005 there were 4 to 10 MILLION illegal aliens that crossed our Southern Border also, as many as 19,500 illegal aliens from Terrorist Countries. Millions of pounds of drugs, cocaine, meth., heroine and marijuana, crossed into the U. S. from the Southern border. Homeland Security Report: http://tinyurl.com/t9sht

  12. The National Policy Institute, “estimated that the total cost of mass deportation would be between $206 and $230 billion or an average cost of between $41 and $46 billion annually over a five year period.” http://www.nationalpolicyinstitute.org/pdf/deportation.pdf

  13. In 2006 illegal aliens sent home $45 BILLION in remittances back to their countries of origin. http://www.rense.com/general75/niht.htm

  14. “The Dark Side of Illegal Immigration: Nearly One Million Sex Crimes Committed by Illegal Immigrants in the United States”. http://www.drdsk.com/articleshtml

This was from an email that I received. The words are not my own. It is a good topic for discussion.

Let’s not forget the dirty, lowest-income jobs they steal from honest Americans.

To some points I would reply that people can obviously accept national-socialism more than pure socialism.

To rob American rich to help poor Americans, yay, but to help poor Mexicans is obviously ridiculous.

The cost of drug smuggling.

There is a cost? These people go to great lenghts to supply the stuff you so desperately demand, raise the GNP, common welfare, satisfy their customers under very difficult conditions and this is what they get?

A bad rep?

[quote]unbending wrote:
Let’s not forget the dirty, lowest-income jobs they steal from honest Americans.[/quote]

I hope you where serious about that line. When ICE raided a sweatshop in Fall River Ma the next day there was a line of Americans wanting those jobs. When I was out of work I would have scrubbed toilets for 7 an hour I just couldn’t find the jobs. It’s not that American’s don’t want to do the jobs it’s just 9 times out of 10 we won’t put up with the bs.

[quote]orion wrote:
To some points I would reply that people can obviously accept national-socialism more than pure socialism.

To rob American rich to help poor Americans, yay, but to help poor Mexicans is obviously ridiculous.

The cost of drug smuggling.

There is a cost? These people go to great lenghts to supply the stuff you so desperately demand, raise the GNP, common welfare, satisfy their customers under very difficult conditions and this is what they get?

A bad rep?

[/quote]

Should I start pontificating about some important Austrian political issue?

You obviously have no idea what you’re talking about, so why talk? If nothing else, the children of illegal immigrants have poisoned our schools in the south and brought down entire generations with their influence. The jobs they take could be filled by prison labor. Chain gangs, much? Much better for America to have low-level offenders under watch picking fruit than some folks who will just hurt America. We have no obligation, moral or otherwise, to help poor Mexicans. We have enough poor Americans as it is, why help some people we have no obligation towards when we haven’t even helped out American poor?

[quote]spittle8 wrote:
orion wrote:
To some points I would reply that people can obviously accept national-socialism more than pure socialism.

To rob American rich to help poor Americans, yay, but to help poor Mexicans is obviously ridiculous.

The cost of drug smuggling.

There is a cost? These people go to great lenghts to supply the stuff you so desperately demand, raise the GNP, common welfare, satisfy their customers under very difficult conditions and this is what they get?

A bad rep?

Should I start pontificating about some important Austrian political issue?

You obviously have no idea what you’re talking about, so why talk? If nothing else, the children of illegal immigrants have poisoned our schools in the south and brought down entire generations with their influence. The jobs they take could be filled by prison labor. Chain gangs, much? Much better for America to have low-level offenders under watch picking fruit than some folks who will just hurt America. We have no obligation, moral or otherwise, to help poor Mexicans. We have enough poor Americans as it is, why help some people we have no obligation towards when we haven’t even helped out American poor?[/quote]

So you think Americans have a greater obligation to help Americans than Mexicans, you are for slave labour for people caught with weed, you think that Mexican children could actually spoil a socialist school system that quadrupled its spending per child without getting better results and yet you want to lecture me on Austrian economics?

Please, go ahead!

Plus, spoiling whole generations with their influence?

Initiative, hard work, tight families, a healthy distrust towards government and stupid rules?

They are keepin the American dream alive!

Out of curiosity Orion, what are your nation’s immigration rules like?

Orion, how do you feel about racism in your country? Do you share racist views? Just curious.

[quote]spittle8 wrote:
If nothing else, the children of illegal immigrants have poisoned our schools in the south and brought down entire generations with their influence.
[/quote]

Can you elaborate on that?

[quote]
We have no obligation, moral or otherwise, to help poor Mexicans. We have enough poor Americans as it is, why help some people we have no obligation towards when we haven’t even helped out American poor?[/quote]

What value system do you live by that you only have a moral obligation to help those in need if they are American? Seriously, I’m curious. Are you religious at all? If so, which one?

[quote]Sloth wrote:
Out of curiosity Orion, what are your nation’s immigration rules like?[/quote]

Very, very strict.

On the other hand we are a small country, not next to, but practically surrounded by former Eastern Block countries and since they are all EU members our immigration laws do not apply to them.

So we kind of liked to keep them out but sort of can`t.

Probably good for us.

[quote]Big_Boss wrote:
Orion, how do you feel about racism in your country? Do you share racist views? Just curious.[/quote]

I would say that there is very little racism for lack of different “races”, racism probably mostly occurs on a theoretical level.

We do have a longstanding tradition of anti-semitism and general mockery of people who live to the south east of us.

If I shared racist views would I actually think they were racist?

[quote]orion wrote:
Big_Boss wrote:
Orion, how do you feel about racism in your country? Do you share racist views? Just curious.

I would say that there is very little racism for lack of different “races”, racism probably mostly occurs on a theoretical level.

We do have a longstanding tradition of anti-semitism and general mockery of people who live to the south east of us.

If I shared racist views would I actually think they were racist? [/quote]

Of course not, bad wording on my part. Just curious if their was a parallel in how people feel about an large influx of “illegal” immigrants in your country as compared to ours.

As not only as American…but as an American of African/Indian descent, do you think I would receive the least of racism or biased stereotyping in your country? These are just thoughts…nothing to make argument.

[quote]orion wrote:
Should I start pontificating about some important Austrian political issue?

You obviously have no idea what you’re talking about, so why talk? If nothing else, the children of illegal immigrants have poisoned our schools in the south and brought down entire generations with their influence. The jobs they take could be filled by prison labor. Chain gangs, much? Much better for America to have low-level offenders under watch picking fruit than some folks who will just hurt America. We have no obligation, moral or otherwise, to help poor Mexicans. We have enough poor Americans as it is, why help some people we have no obligation towards when we haven’t even helped out American poor?

So you think Americans have a greater obligation to help Americans than Mexicans, you are for slave labour for people caught with weed, you think that Mexican children could actually spoil a socialist school system that quadrupled its spending per child without getting better results and yet you want to lecture me on Austrian economics?

Please, go ahead!

Plus, spoiling whole generations with their influence?

Initiative, hard work, tight families, a healthy distrust towards government and stupid rules?

They are keepin the American dream alive!

[/quote]

OF COURSE American governance has more obligations towards its own citizens. What are you even saying?

If I broke the law, I wouldn’t be complaining about having to pick fruit and making a couple bucks an hour towards cigs, or some valuable prison comodity. Big deal. Can’t take a little work? Then don’t commit the crimes. Maybe a little hard labor will truly REHABILITATE prisoners!

I don’t think, I know. I’ve read enough on California schools, and I’m from Texas, so I know how bad it is there. I remember when I enrolled in high-school, I had to bend over backwards to prove I was a resident, while, at the same time, an illegal, who admitted he had “just arrived yesterday” and was not a citizen, and spoke not a lick of English, was in classes that day.

They form gangs and ruin schools. They create a culture of shit that permeates all and poisons our youngest generation. They got my best friend into drugs it now appears. Why are you even contesting the argument? Have you even read anything on this, much less experienced any of it?

My friend told me how Mexican kids would run through the halls with Mexican flags, chanting in Spanish, and when he got the balls to run with an American flag, he was almost expelled, not to mention the threats of violence. Good thing he can handle 5 guys at a time.

I never said anyting about Austrian economics. However, I imagine that, after a little mild searching on Wikipedia, I’d be more prepared to argue Austrian economics than you are to argue American immigration policies.

"Initiative, hard work, tight families, a healthy distrust towards government and stupid rules?

They are keepin the American dream alive!"

That is just infuriating. You don’t know how disgusting those words are to me. How would you feel if I expunged upon the merits of Austrian neo-Nazis, and how they were the TRUE Austrians? That’s only a bit more disgusting than what you just said.

You exhibit stunning ignorance, combined with the terrible trait of someone who thinks they can arbitrate an opinion on matters they know nothing of. I was that way a couple years back, at 14, but you grow out of it.

Tight families? The sons become criminals, the girls skanks and young Mothers, and they hit their kids. Hard work? Out in the fields, maybe, but the guys cutting grass are NOT hard workers, nor are the folks in the suburbs and big cities. They’re more like parasites than hard workers. Criminals have initiative. These ARE criminals.

A healthy distrust towards government? There’s a difference between trusting government and invading a foreign nation and flaunting the law of the land. They don’t work with the government. Trust? All that matters to them is how the government treats them. If there’s a push for anti-illegal immigrant legislation, they riot. I was there in Dallas last time that happened. They only care about themselves.

You really shouldn’t be pontificating on this issue. I won’t argue the merits of the E.U., and you shouldn’t argue American immigration policies or our culture, what is American, and the measure of a group that you know absolutely NOTHING about.

Is it possible to have a discussion on immigration without immediately calling everyone with whom you disagree a racist?

On a purely economic level, it’s about the cost of the labor input - thus cheap labor is good for the consumer. However, it’s not just like widgets: widgets don’t consume education, health-care and other services. And as far as it goes, while there is competition among producers of widgets, for some reason - probably because in this case the widget is specifically the labor of people in a community, not some good that is shipped from overseas - it’s different when you’re discussing labor.

And there are external costs to the host communities from importing low-skilled laborers. See this article from George Borjas of Harvard:

[i]For a Few Dollars Less
By GEORGE J. BORJAS
April 18, 2006

What happens when immigrants enter the labor market? The 1964 edition of Paul Samuelson’s influential introductory economics textbook gives the common-sense answer: “By keeping labor supply down, immigration policy tends to keep wages high. Let us underline this basic principle: Limitation of the supply of any grade of labor relative to all other productive factors can be expected to raise its wage rate; an increase in supply will, other things being equal, tend to depress wage rates.” Mr. Samuelson wrote this just before the 1965 policy shift that sparked the resurgence of immigration, so he emphasized that restrictions “keep wages high.” Today we are concerned with the mirror-image implication: As immigration increases the size of a skill group (such as low-educated workers), the wage paid to that group should fall.

Despite the intuition behind Mr. Samuelson’s conclusion, economists have found it surprisingly difficult to document that immigration does, in fact, lower the wage of competing workers. In 1997, the National Academy of Sciences concluded that “the weight of the empirical evidence suggests that the impact of immigration on the wages of competing native workers is small.”

Recent research has finally begun to demolish the peculiar (yet influential) notion that an influx of more than 16 million foreign-born workers, which increased the size of the workforce by nearly 15%, had little impact on wages. In part, the problem has been that economists were looking for the wage effect in all the wrong places.

Immigrants cluster in a small number of cities. A third live in three metropolitan areas (New York, Los Angeles and Chicago). In the past, the stereotypical study exploited this clustering by correlating wages and immigration across cities. A negative correlation, indicating that wages are lower in cities penetrated by immigrants, would suggest that immigrants reduce the wage of competing workers. In fact, the estimated correlations bunched around zero, creating the impression that immigrants had little impact.

This inference is not correct for two reasons. First, immigrants are not randomly distributed across cities. If, as seems sensible, high-wage areas attract immigrants, there would be a spurious positive correlation between immigration and wages. This positive correlation could easily swamp any negative wage effect that immigrants might have had.

Natives also respond to immigration. Employers in Michigan, for example, see that Southern California cities flooded by low-skill immigrants pay lower wages to laborers. The employers will want to relocate to those cities to increase their profits. The flow of jobs to the immigrant-hit areas cushions the adverse effect of immigration on the Southern California wage, while slightly worsening conditions in Michigan. Similarly, laborers living in California, who now face stiffer competition, might leave the state to search for better opportunities. These flows of jobs and workers diffuse the impact of immigration across the national economy and tend to equalize economic conditions across localities.

Because local labor markets adjust to immigration, I have argued that the impact of immigration is best measured at the national level. In fact, by examining national wage trends for narrowly defined skill groups for the last 40 years, the wage effects of immigration become quite visible. These trends suggest that a 10% increase in the size of a skill group (for example, a 10% increase in the number of workers who are high school graduates and are around 30 years old) reduces the wage of that group by 3% to 4%.

It turns out that this wage response is roughly what one would have expected to find if one looked at the vast academic literature that estimates adjustments in labor demand (a literature that typically has little to do with immigration). In short, the national wage effects replicate what we think we know about labor demand in the U.S. labor market.

Although immigrants affect the wage of competing workers, they have little impact on the wage of other skill groups. A 10% increase in the number of workers who are young high school dropouts, for example, raises the wage of college graduates by only half of 1%. High-skill workers have little to gain, at least in the labor market, from the immigration of low-skill workers.

My Harvard colleague Lawrence Katz and I recently examined the impact of the 1980-2000 immigrant influx (and particularly Mexican-origin immigration) for U.S. wages. The results are that, in the short run – holding all other things equal – immigration lowered the wage of native workers, particularly of those workers with the least education. The wage fell by 3% for the average worker and by 8% for high school dropouts.

The “all other things equal” assumption is not sensible from a long-run perspective. Over time, employers will certainly make capital investments to take advantage of the cheaper labor. This adjustment implies that, in the long run, the average worker is not affected by immigration, but the wage of high school dropouts still fell by 5%.

These effects imply sizable reductions in annual earnings for low-skill workers. In 2000, the typical high school dropout earned $25,000, so that immigration reduced his earnings by $1,200, even after all capital adjustments take place. Mr. Katz and I also examined how much was due to Mexican immigration. We calculated what the wage effects would have been had there been no Mexican immigration between 1980 and 2000. We found that Mexican immigration, which is predominantly low-skill, accounts for all of the adverse impact of immigration on low-skill natives.

National wage trends confirm the common-sense notion that immigration has labor market consequences: A larger pool of competing workers lowers relative wages. This does not imply that immigration is a net loss for the economy. After all, the wage losses suffered by workers show up as higher profits to employers and, eventually, as lower prices to consumers. Immigration policy is just another redistribution program. In the short run, it transfers wealth from one group (workers) to another (employers). Whether or not such transfers are desirable is one of the central questions in the immigration debate.

Mr. Borjas is the Robert W. Scrivner Professor of Economics and Social Policy at the Kennedy School of Government at Harvard.[/i]

This is all a matter of debate and argument amongst economists, but the debate shouldn’t consist of calling your opponents racist out of the box.

[quote]orion wrote:
Big_Boss wrote:
Orion, how do you feel about racism in your country? Do you share racist views? Just curious.

I would say that there is very little racism for lack of different “races”, racism probably mostly occurs on a theoretical level.

We do have a longstanding tradition of anti-semitism and general mockery of people who live to the south east of us.

If I shared racist views would I actually think they were racist? [/quote]

What do you think about gypsies? Do you have any gypsy freinds? Would you go in to business with a gypsie, would you have them work for you?

My only thought is that there is no need for mass deportation.

If you cut off the sources of money, immigrants will go home.

[quote]emdawgz1 wrote:
My only thought is that there is no need for mass deportation.

If you cut off the sources of money, immigrants will go home.[/quote]

No one is talking about mass deportations, if we fine heavily the places that hire illegal aliens then the aliens will go home

[quote]Big_Boss wrote:
orion wrote:
Big_Boss wrote:
Orion, how do you feel about racism in your country? Do you share racist views? Just curious.

I would say that there is very little racism for lack of different “races”, racism probably mostly occurs on a theoretical level.

We do have a longstanding tradition of anti-semitism and general mockery of people who live to the south east of us.

If I shared racist views would I actually think they were racist?

Of course not, bad wording on my part. Just curious if their was a parallel in how people feel about an large influx of “illegal” immigrants in your country as compared to ours.

As not only as American…but as an American of African/Indian descent, do you think I would receive the least of racism or biased stereotyping in your country? These are just thoughts…nothing to make argument.[/quote]

As an American I doubt that you would run into trouble.

You could run into a few idiots in larger cities but I never heard of violence against tourist.

If you were an African illegal alien things would be different, the way we treat illegal aliens are a disgrace.

So if you run into the police in Austria make sure you have your passport, then there should not be any problems.

How people feel about massive immigration? they same we Americans do, they also want the social security system to survive and they hardly can have both.

Of course our politicians tell them that we can.

[quote]pat36 wrote:
orion wrote:
Big_Boss wrote:
Orion, how do you feel about racism in your country? Do you share racist views? Just curious.

I would say that there is very little racism for lack of different “races”, racism probably mostly occurs on a theoretical level.

We do have a longstanding tradition of anti-semitism and general mockery of people who live to the south east of us.

If I shared racist views would I actually think they were racist?

What do you think about gypsies? Do you have any gypsy freinds? Would you go in to business with a gypsie, would you have them work for you?[/quote]

Are you aware how many gipsies there are in Austria?

[quote]orion wrote:
Are you aware how many gipsies there are in Austria?

[/quote]
No, but I imagine that it would add to the culture (rather than detract from it) if there were a significant proportion…?