T Nation

The Body Weight Factor

[quote]Chris Colucci wrote:
I do believe that “wanting people to step aside when I walk in” is an immature goal, and I do believe that goal is not synonymous with “big enough to make people notice.” We disagree on that and that’s fine.

I’m out.[/quote]

I think “MOST” would agree with that.

@bulkncut

-what is the time scale between those 2 pics?
-what is your BW in both?
-how much strength did you gain?

good job.

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]usmccds423 wrote:

My biggest hurdle became consistency an issue I think many intermediate lifters face. From 18-22, while in the military, I went from 135 to 170, back down to 153, and then back up to about 180. I had a ton of time and lifted from 11:00 - 13:00 5 days a week. When I got out and reality hit my training suffered. Began working at a desk, half hour lunch, night classes. Ended up at about 225 and not a good 225. All my lifts stalled and so did any progress. It really wasn’t until recently (26 now) that I’ve re-prioritized training. I invested in a home gym (no excuse anymore) and am starting to see some good progress. I’m now down to about 208 and have hit several PRs this month including 402 X 1 deadlift last Tuesday.

Videos and pics are in my hub or in my indigo log

[/quote]

That right there is why I mentioned focusing a newb’s intent on his gym consistency first and foremost even before huge changes are made with diet…because that alone will help carry them through a life time of ups and downs…not “I think I am eating perfectly at all times” which can actually cause so much analysis that progress is haulted in the long term
[/quote]

Key phrase: Life time

The iron game is a marathon not a sprint, imo.

[quote]yolo84 wrote:
@bulkncut

-what is the time scale between those 2 pics?
-what is your BW in both?
-how much strength did you gain?

good job.
[/quote]

Along with that, bulk, understand that on the course of reaching your overall goal, there are going to be times where you are not in “ideal” condition. Obviously this is not the end goal but a means to an end. If one were to literally diet every time they went a little too far, they wouldn’t be gaining much. It becomes a yo-yo track of ups and downs and overall stagnation.

This is about short term goal reaching leading to the ultimate goal.

You seem to be doing fine.

[quote]usmccds423 wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]usmccds423 wrote:

My biggest hurdle became consistency an issue I think many intermediate lifters face. From 18-22, while in the military, I went from 135 to 170, back down to 153, and then back up to about 180. I had a ton of time and lifted from 11:00 - 13:00 5 days a week. When I got out and reality hit my training suffered. Began working at a desk, half hour lunch, night classes. Ended up at about 225 and not a good 225. All my lifts stalled and so did any progress. It really wasn’t until recently (26 now) that I’ve re-prioritized training. I invested in a home gym (no excuse anymore) and am starting to see some good progress. I’m now down to about 208 and have hit several PRs this month including 402 X 1 deadlift last Tuesday.

Videos and pics are in my hub or in my indigo log

[/quote]

That right there is why I mentioned focusing a newb’s intent on his gym consistency first and foremost even before huge changes are made with diet…because that alone will help carry them through a life time of ups and downs…not “I think I am eating perfectly at all times” which can actually cause so much analysis that progress is haulted in the long term
[/quote]

Key phrase: Life time

The iron game is a marathon not a sprint, imo. [/quote]

…and that doesn’t mean I think a newb should NEVER change their diet.

It means that the most important aspect that separates the “I got bigs” from the “I train off and on and never dids” is CONSISTENCY.

I was in the military also and I know many people who got out and got fat as fuck…or guys who used to lift when they played football but life got in the way and now they weigh 300lbs of lard.

That consistency can take care of a lot of error in other areas.

I think they should learn that first then make changes based off of results assuming they are not literally eating cookies all day.

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]usmccds423 wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]usmccds423 wrote:

My biggest hurdle became consistency an issue I think many intermediate lifters face. From 18-22, while in the military, I went from 135 to 170, back down to 153, and then back up to about 180. I had a ton of time and lifted from 11:00 - 13:00 5 days a week. When I got out and reality hit my training suffered. Began working at a desk, half hour lunch, night classes. Ended up at about 225 and not a good 225. All my lifts stalled and so did any progress. It really wasn’t until recently (26 now) that I’ve re-prioritized training. I invested in a home gym (no excuse anymore) and am starting to see some good progress. I’m now down to about 208 and have hit several PRs this month including 402 X 1 deadlift last Tuesday.

Videos and pics are in my hub or in my indigo log

[/quote]

That right there is why I mentioned focusing a newb’s intent on his gym consistency first and foremost even before huge changes are made with diet…because that alone will help carry them through a life time of ups and downs…not “I think I am eating perfectly at all times” which can actually cause so much analysis that progress is haulted in the long term
[/quote]

Key phrase: Life time

The iron game is a marathon not a sprint, imo. [/quote]

…and that doesn’t mean I think a newb should NEVER change their diet.

It means that the most important aspect that separates the “I got bigs” from the “I train off and on and never dids” is CONSISTENCY.

I was in the military also and I know many people who got out and got fat as fuck…or guys who used to lift when they played football but life got in the way and now they weigh 300lbs of lard.

That consistency can take care of a lot of error in other areas.

I think they should learn that first then make changes based off of results assuming they are not literally eating cookies all day.[/quote]

Consistency is a given for anyone above average. I would prefer to discuss what seperates the great from above average. As in what the world class powerlifter/strongman/bodybuilder (gasp!) does that the above average gym rat doesn’t. Anyone can go to the gym consistently and seperate themselves from fat people that eat cookies all day.

[quote]super saiyan wrote:
most… many… YOU… most… genetics… progress… most… big… many… size… obese… most… BEST POST… biologist… LOL… education… progress… WHY?.. not me… most[/quote]

GOAT post

[quote]yolo84 wrote:
@bulkncut

-what is the time scale between those 2 pics?
-what is your BW in both?
-how much strength did you gain?

good job.
[/quote]

1 1/2 years,
139-213ish(if that’s the one from my log it should say, newer ones up in other thread at 223)
First pic was before I started lifting but I guess I could still put up some numbers. When I started benching my max was like 115, Deadlift was like 185, squat was like 115. Now my bench is 285, Deadlift 405, squat I haven’t done in 7 months cause of a pretty nasty surgery but was 250 for a triple day before surgery. My Deadlift was 345 at that point for reference.

[quote]Maiden3.16 wrote:

Consistency is a given for anyone above average. I would prefer to discuss what seperates the great from above average. As in what the world class powerlifter/strongman/bodybuilder (gasp!) does that the above average gym rat doesn’t. Anyone can go to the gym consistently and seperate themselves from fat people that eat cookies all day. [/quote]

Anyone can’t. Some people work 12 hour shifts or longer. Some people have school and job concerns that make it harder to do…and more than most, many people underestimate how big those later life issues will be and just how dedicated they need to be for their training to survive it.

That consistency alone is what holds many people back.

If there were one thing I would credit for making more huge people than not…it is straight up consistent regular gym attendance where it literally becomes a part of normal daily life and not “just something done as a hobby”.

That is what will keep them training through pregnancies and graduations.

[quote]bulkNcut wrote:

[quote]yolo84 wrote:
@bulkncut

-what is the time scale between those 2 pics?
-what is your BW in both?
-how much strength did you gain?

good job.
[/quote]

1 1/2 years,
139-213ish(if that’s the one from my log it should say, newer ones up in other thread at 223)
First pic was before I started lifting but I guess I could still put up some numbers. When I started benching my max was like 115, Deadlift was like 185, squat was like 115. Now my bench is 285, Deadlift 405, squat I haven’t done in 7 months cause of a pretty nasty surgery but was 250 for a triple day before surgery. My Deadlift was 345 at that point for reference. [/quote]

Seriously, keep that up.

You did that in less than two years even with surgery?

No, anyone laughing at that progress needs to have pics of their own somewhere.

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]bulkNcut wrote:

[quote]yolo84 wrote:
@bulkncut

-what is the time scale between those 2 pics?
-what is your BW in both?
-how much strength did you gain?

good job.
[/quote]

1 1/2 years,
139-213ish(if that’s the one from my log it should say, newer ones up in other thread at 223)
First pic was before I started lifting but I guess I could still put up some numbers. When I started benching my max was like 115, Deadlift was like 185, squat was like 115. Now my bench is 285, Deadlift 405, squat I haven’t done in 7 months cause of a pretty nasty surgery but was 250 for a triple day before surgery. My Deadlift was 345 at that point for reference. [/quote]

No, anyone laughing at that progress needs to have pics of their own somewhere.[/quote]

Who was laughing at his progress?

The guy is doing great.

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]yolo84 wrote:
@bulkncut

-what is the time scale between those 2 pics?
-what is your BW in both?
-how much strength did you gain?

good job.
[/quote]

Along with that, bulk, understand that on the course of reaching your overall goal, there are going to be times where you are not in “ideal” condition. Obviously this is not the end goal but a means to an end. If one were to literally diet every time they went a little too far, they wouldn’t be gaining much. It becomes a yo-yo track of ups and downs and overall stagnation.

This is about short term goal reaching leading to the ultimate goal.

You seem to be doing fine.[/quote]

Thanks. That was one of the things that used to bother me a lot was people thought I was stupid and didnt know how to train cause I didn’t have a six pack. I get the appeal of being lean, but people didnt understand that it was a means to an end. They would call me far and compare me to guys with abs in the gym that weighed like a buck fifty who didnt Deadlift or squat or press cause “it’s bad for your back” and said I was the one who didn’t know what to do. Haha rant over.

Also things aren’t going to well unfortunately as I have a back injury that is preventing me from doing the lifts I just mentioned (ironic) that has been 12 weeks and won’t go away. If anyone has input it’s in a thread called lower back strain in injuries and rehab. I’d love help

[quote]Maiden3.16 wrote:

Consistency is a given for anyone above average. I would prefer to discuss what seperates the great from above average. As in what the world class powerlifter/strongman/bodybuilder (gasp!) does that the above average gym rat doesn’t. Anyone can go to the gym consistently and seperate themselves from fat people that eat cookies all day. [/quote]

But that’s not what this forum is about. It’s about the average lifter growing as a lifter. How can we really discuss this anyway?

“Well I read Ronnie does this in Menâ??s Health so that must be the secret,” do yu see what I’m saying? It’s all here say unless the pros or elite are posting themselves. Which is they are it likely would be in their respective forum. For example Stu, a well above average possibly elite bodybuilder (I don’t know much about the sport), posts most of his advice in his BB forum threads. That makes sense, so if you want to see what he is doing to set himself apart that’s where the discussion will be.

Most of us are and will always be average/slightly above average. So discussing how the pros separate themselves is not really helpful when half the people here can’t properly deadlift 300 pounds.

[quote]bulkNcut wrote:

Thanks. That was one of the things that used to bother me a lot was people thought I was stupid and didnt know how to train cause I didn’t have a six pack. I get the appeal of being lean, but people didnt understand that it was a means to an end. They would call me far and compare me to guys with abs in the gym that weighed like a buck fifty who didnt Deadlift or squat or press cause “it’s bad for your back” and said I was the one who didn’t know what to do. Haha rant over. Also things aren’t going to well unfortunately as I have a back injury that is preventing me from doing the lifts I just mentioned (ironic) that has been 12 weeks and won’t go away. If anyone has input it’s in a thread called lower back strain in injuries and rehab. I’d love help
[/quote]

I went through some of that (hell, mostly here and NOT the gym) but in the end, the guy who made the most progress is who made the best choice.

You actually have arms most would consider “big” now even though you are nowhere near an end goal and we all understand that you plan to eventually carry even more muscle.
That is why it isn’t always best to post beginner progress here…or at least, understand most of the “advice” you get is coming from people who do not have the guts to put themselves out there for judgment.

I’m not hating on those that are lean and strong with some respectable size, like many of you probably are. I’m just venting about those weak guys in the gym that bench and hit their abs and arms then call it a day and still find a way to tell you how to do things.

[quote]usmccds423 wrote:

[quote]Maiden3.16 wrote:

Consistency is a given for anyone above average. I would prefer to discuss what seperates the great from above average. As in what the world class powerlifter/strongman/bodybuilder (gasp!) does that the above average gym rat doesn’t. Anyone can go to the gym consistently and seperate themselves from fat people that eat cookies all day. [/quote]

But that’s not what this forum is about. It’s about the average lifter growing as a lifter. How can we really discuss this anyway?

“Well I read Ronnie does this in Menâ??s Health so that must be the secret,” do yu see what I’m saying? It’s all here say unless the pros or elite are posting themselves. Which is they are it likely would be in their respective forum. For example Stu, a well above average possibly elite bodybuilder (I don’t know much about the sport), posts most of his advice in his BB forum threads. That makes sense, so if you want to see what he is doing to set himself apart that’s where the discussion will be.

Most of us are and will always be average/slightly above average. So discussing how the pros separate themselves is not really helpful when half the people here can’t properly deadlift 300 pounds.
[/quote]

Not only that, we have seen in the Indigo forum just how most of the posters here are actually doing.

It is why I started the thread this way. Good post.

[quote]bulkNcut wrote:
I’m not hating on those that are lean and strong with some respectable size, like many of you probably are. I’m just venting about those weak guys in the gym that bench and hit their abs and arms then call it a day and still find a way to tell you how to do things. [/quote]

Dude, I am betting there are many people just like this here…like the guy who called you out on your progress.

His pics are nowhere but he has much “opinion” to give.

I am not hating on those who want to be lean and strong either.

@bulkncut

superb job for first 2 years weight training

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]BlueCollarTr8n wrote:

[quote]usmccds423 wrote:

[quote]Stronghold wrote:
Not to rain on your parade too much, but those average numbers in my experience for most young (late teens-early 20’s) guys in their first year or 2 of training regardless of whether they gained 30+ (you didn’t specify whether or not you were still dieting) lbs of fat to go with it or not.
[/quote]

I always love reading posts like this. These numbers are not average. They are not elite, but average, I don’t think so. Most 18-22 year olds are deadlifting in the 3’s, maybe squating in the 3’s, and likely benching in the mid 2’s. Just because in your experience 5/4/3 D/S/B is average doesn’t actually make it average.

What is even the point of your post, to point out how much better the average lifter is than the guy you addressed? [/quote]

Agreed! I was disappointed to see this from a member I generally repsect.
If you train at a college gym where the athletes train maybe…but not average in commercial gyms, not average in most private gyms. [/quote]

Agreed. I am not here to shit on anyone else’s progress…but it sure seems that is what most of these other people are here for.

I created this thread to discuss the topic I presented.

if you don’t like that topic or think it has been discussed too much, why would you post here just to say that?

No, I am not going to debate with 5-10 people all at the same time just because some of you seem to ONLY try to literally shit on anything I post lately.

Some of you are becoming straight up assholes shitting on other people’s progress.

That is not what I am here for.

To the people who thanked me, you are welcome. Post more and help change these boards from this current tripe.[/quote]

Aren’t you the guy who said once that if you werent able to bench 405 as a natural within 3 or so years of training, you weren’t cut out for lifting weights?

My point was that his progress, while good, doesn’t prove the superiority of any method because its totally within the realm of possibility for kids his age with a few years of dedicated training. FFS, I even stated as much that I wasn’t shitting on his progress. I outright said it in the first sentence of my post.

We’re talking about a slightly less than 1.5x bw bench, less than 2x bw squat, and 2.5x bw deadlift.

Those numbers are nowhere near extraordinary enough to add an additional 15% of your bodyweight in fat to achieve.

Professor X… It appears as though you are a Sick Mutha Fucka: