The Benefits of Back Squatting

Bigger Stronger Leaner Powerlifting & Strength Sports
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[quote]lordstorm88 wrote:
edit: btw about the whole “using the bounce”, there are various opinions on it. It will definitely make you lift more weight if you do it correctly, but more importantly some say its not going to work your legs as much as not using it. Others say the opposite. I think you should alternate between the two.

If you are serious about ol. weightlifting, you will need to learn the bounce and do it with the cleans. However know that for most people that takes a lot of time to learn to use it properly with cleans, but I would imagine doing squats and using it with them would be the first step.[/quote]

I’d NEVER advocate bouncing in a squat. Thats not good advice and it will destine the OP to RUINED KNEES the more they do it.

Squat = strength exercise, do it right to get f0cking strong in your legs and to make sure your trunk is strong enough to not crumple in the receieve and recover positionis.

Bouncing in the Snatch and the Cleans help you lift more, but after 20-30yrs of doing this your knees will probably battered to some degree mate.

I would practice using the bounce during the OLifts only to save your knees.

Koing

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I found this a while back and it seemed to make sense to me:

http://www.dynamic-eleiko.com/sportivny/library/farticles007.html

I’m still not convinced that I’d get better at cleaning and jerking and snatching if I back squatted.

I wonder if you both mean slightly different things by ‘catching the bounce’. I’ve seen people refer to it as dynamically using the tension generated in your hamstrings when you get to the bottom of the stretch reflex (what lordstorm seems to be thinking of) and I’ve seen people refer to it as when your hamstrings physically smash into your calves (what koing seems to be thinking of - can mess up your knees). I’m trying to get the hang of the former (I’d end up with my butt on the ground before the latter).

My front squat is only 40kg max for a single :frowning: Pretty shit, I know. Been stuck on 30kg 5x5 for a while now and not sure what to do to bring it up. Blah. I know the weakest part is when the quads take over from the hamstrings as the main movers on the way up. My quads are weak. Also keeping good tension on the way down (I have found that I can relax totally under 30kg and then gather things up and get out of the hole - so I suspect I’ve got more in me once I get the movement down a bit better - especially if I can use the tension in my hamstrings dynamically to help me power past the quad sticking point). Sorry no vids… Just keep plugging away, I guess.

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I did mean the first thing. Though in olympic lifting usually when you say catch the bounce you mean the bounce of the barbell. When you catch it from a clean, if the barbell is flexible it will bend when you get at the bottom of the squat then it will try to become “straight” again. The more weight on the bar, the more flexible it is, and the harder you hit the bottom position the more it will bend and then get straight again and while it does that its easier to get up. I don’t know how much this can mess up your knees if you tried it… obviously not with maximum weights and you wouldn’t just like… drop from the start position into the bottom… but my guess is you could try it with lighter weights. or maybe not, I’d listen to koing personally, he has much more experience than I do

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Oh yeah, I see what you mean. Forgot about that sense of it…

I’m certainly not good enough / fast enough for that, yet.

I wonder if the knee thing depends on your stance (on whether your hamstrings and calves contact - like they do with some lifters with shorter legs and narrower stance). I don’t know anything about it though.

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it makes sense that the knees would be in trouble with the bounce. My assumption is that in the bounce your body is forced down so hard that in a sense your quads are getting stretched so hard and fast that the knee tendons will also get hurt from it a bit. This is far from scientific but its how I think of it and kind of makes sense to me. Its kind of like loading extremely high weights in a deadlift from racks just for your grip. Even if somehow your back and legs were able to handle it, your arms would be getting pulled down hard. Now imagine raising that bar a bit and letting it fall, it would drag down your whole arm pretty hard and your shoulders would be in pretty big trouble.

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I’ve heard mixed things about knee pain. Read somewhere that olympic lifters don’t have troubles with their knees (cited in support of ATG squats). I’ve also heard (anecdotally from olympic lifters) that their knees hurt after years of lifting. I have been wondering whether it is about hamstring / calf contact or something else, though. Can’t wait to be able to catch the bounce with the bouncy women’s bar :slight_smile: But won’t be in a hurry, I guess…

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heavy squats has enormous benefit which is already mentioned by lot of people here.

in regards of back squat helping in doing clean and snatches… yes it definately helps

think about it , with heavy back squats you have trained those quads , gluteus and hamstring with high load to produce maximum force. they can handle heavy loads.

This strength is transfered to do heavy cleans and snatched.

when we receive the bar overhead for snatch or clean receive position, your lower body needs to have the strength to stand up with the weights and also to handle it.

ATG back squats has a big role to play in my program.

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Back squatting is good for lower back, but leg strength that it can provide is useless because the midsection is always a weak point for weightlifter.

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[quote]bro1989 wrote:
Hello everybody, this is my first post on the T-Nation forums.

I would like to discuss Full olympic style back squats with you and the question whether they indeed trigger an increase in total body power and growth in every muscle groups (also the ones the back squat does not stimulate directly such as the biceps for example).

I am from Germany, and in Germany this phenomenon is called “Verbreitungseffekt,” which means that the ATG Squat uses more than two thirds of the body’s muscle mass and therefore causes the entire body to grow. Not only through the release of growth hormone and testosterone, but due to the fact that whenever more than 60% of the whole body’s muscles are fully activated, all others are stimulated just as well, to a lesser degree but still.

If one were to do nothing but olympic style back squats, would the entire body really get developed?

In The Poliquin Principles, Charles states that he does believe the squat increases TOTAL body power, i.e. strength in the entire body with all its areas and muscles.

Thank you!![/quote]

Bro 1989,

I have lifted since the early '70’s and coached olympic lifters and other athletes since the early '80’s. I have to disagree with Mr. Poliquin. Back squatting, in my observation, is the most important of the slower strength movements and certainly does increase total body strength, probably for the reasons you state above.

I would not suggest that one only do back squats alone, however, for better development. Nor would I suggest any other weightlifting exercise be used alone. Any squatting is a slower movement and would not optimize potential force output like, say, a clean and jerk. This is why training programs that only emphasize the bigger, slower lifts (squats, dead lifts, bench press) are outmoded and are being replaced by those that mix the slower lifts with the much faster olympic-style lifts.

If you consider “better development” to mean “better athletic development”, you must put the emphasis on the faster lifts. Without back squats, however, all olympic style lifts will be limited.

CoachMc