The Andrew Tate Case

Has anyone else been following this? I have been watching commentary on this case made by this lawyer Bruce Rivers. There are a few other videos about Tate made by him not shown here. He has interesting commentary on other cases as well.

Not super informed on the topic of his arrest; aware of Mr. Tate, his positions, and why people hate him though.

Anytime sex gets brought up in any legal setting, it’s weird. Take the least sexiest environment possible (a courtroom filled with a bunch of monotonous “conversation” held by predominantly old dudes) and try to sexualize it… it always seems weird.

Out of context, “strangling” sounds like assault. In context, it could have been asked for and it’s a kink for quite a few people. Of course, “strangle” sounds like it has intent to kill, but in the context of rough sex - this is 1) not the case and 2) almost guarenteed to happen (in the non-murdery way). Sorry for going NSFW, I’m just being real. The person speaking in this video clearly only has sex in missionary, if he even gets laid at all, so I’m sure he doesn’t understand. His response in the first video was very… square…

He’s been accused of much of this before, come to think of it. I believe one of the allegations blew over as ‘roleplay’… again something that does not come off well in any court setting, regardless of consent/willingness. He’s also been accused of running a sex ring or something like that before - and I do believe that was dismissed as well.

To what extent do we consider this “rape”? Woman goes over to a multi-millionaire’s house for sex. Rich dude is known for being rough in bed, this does not dissuade her. She says (in retrospect) that she stopped wanting it halfway through, but said nothing… would be very difficult to differentiate between roleplay and actual refusal in the context of rape roleplay (which this sounds like (needs context!)). She then proceeds to GO BACK to do this stuff with him again; I think calling that ‘rape’ may be a mischaracterization, if not buyer’s-remorse falsehood.

The man does make it difficult to defend him with how much content he has for sure. We’re also viewing this through a western lense, which even further removes most of us from the context which is needed here. Eastern European culture is VERY different than our own; that does not make what he’s accused of ‘right’ but ethics is determined by cultural norms.

I don’t want to come off dismissive of rape allegations, but it’s always fishy when one person makes a claim - then a whole group of people start making claims. These occurrences seem to not happen often to folks without wealth for some reason.

The question is, do we think he’s going to get a fair trial? I think it would be very hard to do this; he better hope his jury is more men than women.

DISCLAIMER
I’m not condoning anything he’s accused of, whether innocent or guilty. These are just observations on an interesting case.

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I doubt he was arrested based on accusations alone. I don’t know how much evidence the police have but I would assume they had enough to arrest and hold him. This doesn’t make him guilty of course. Regardless, pride comes before a fall. This seems like an example of the Dunning-Kruger effect.

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In the post #MeToo era, the burden of proof lies upon the accused. But there are more charges than just this, and I’m quite unfamiliar with the standards of law outside the US. He is a prolific content creator/internet personality - I’m sure there is enough there to argue a sexual assault case or two.

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I would like to see examples of that.

The stripper who accused 4 members of Duke Lacrosse team (that all spent like 10 years in jail before she admitted she lied)?

This case

Alan Dershowitz (who was accused in 2015 and not cleared until Nov. 2022)

Justice Brett Kavanaugh

I could go on, but these are the first ones that come to mind and I’m sure it isn’t necessary for me to. I know you like to be a contrarian and all that, but let’s be objective here. In every other corner of law, the burden of proof lies upon the accuser; in sexual assault/rape cases, this standard is flipped.

A woman goes to the police and accuses a specific man of raping her. She has DNA evidence with no alibi, but tells a compelling and believable story. The man is brought in for questioning and says it was consensual, with no alibi. Who wins? You’re welcome to play this one out.

another Disclaimer:
I think rape is dispicable and believe the proper punishment is castration or death. That being said, I think there also needs to be punishment for false accusers. Everyone needs some skin in the game (no pun intended).

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I agree with this. I also think the person falsely accusing someone else of such a heinous crime should receive the punishment for that crime considering such a punishment would involve destroying (lengthy prison sentence) or ending an innocent person’s life.

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There have been several cases of celebrities and other famous people accused of rape a decade or more after sexual relations, with no evidence. This is outrageous!

Is there a way to prove rape occurs on private property without video or audio recording anyway? I don’t think so.

He acknowledged that some people have all sorts of naughty play but warned from his experience as a lawyer that as people go further and further into depravity, the likelihood of twisted and bad outcomes increases. And I agree with that.

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I don’t think any of them were convicted, as the case was dismissed, and it was a case of prosecutorial misconduct.

I don’t see how any of these cases demonstrate the burden of proof being on the defendant.

Ask William Kennedy Smith.

Being accused of something is not outrageous; it’s a normal occurrence. The thing about this specific circumstance is that we know Hollywood is a weird, twisted place that has its own rules about morality. Does anyone think that what Roman Polanski did was an aberration? And people defended him then and now even when the facts of the case are known and not in dispute.

Then you have Ted Nugent and Steven Tyler who we know for a fact had parents sign over guardianship of their underage daughters in order to take them across state lines legally… for sex.

Why do we find accusations of perversion hard to believe when they originate in the land of the perverse?

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I was mistaken on the duke lacrosse team, got my wires crossed somewhere.

I’ve already provided an example of 2 men who were released after 26 years in prison. There are exceptions on both sides, which is inherently an issue in terms of legal proceedings.

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People believe all kinds of things.

Thats why we (in general) need proof to convict.

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Correct. Hence I said decade or more layer with no evidence.

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Related story.

From the article:

“The accusations against me made by individuals I met years, even decades, ago are categorically false. These stories could’ve been from 30 years ago or 30 days ago — no always means no — that is a line I did not cross. The encounters were consensual. It’s difficult not to question the timing of these stories coming out. I don’t know for certain why they are surfacing now, but I do know this: I did not assault these women,” Noth said in a statement to CNN.

But no criminal charges have been filed.

Is that the extent which these accusations can ruin someone’s life?

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We were talking about the legal system.

Right, to which multiple cases have already been exampled. So why do you keep playing the “yeah but…” card?

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This is the biggest issue. There is almost zero risk to making a false allegation. Criminal charges against the accuser are rarely pursued, and punishments are minimal.

No… the police force that arrested tate was the equivalent of the Romanian FBI

The warrants they had to get approved by the courts to sieze his cash, cars, apply a 30 day detention order on Tate and his brother required more evidence than a “he did this” by some anonymous tipper…

So many people want to defend Tate… instead of blaming #metoo or whatever… how about wait until the case is wrapped up before we make any definitive statements or conclusions… I think Tate is a manipulative piece of shit who runs a pyramid scheme and preys on vulnerable young men to financially support himself

But I’m not going to comment on whether he’s trafficking women in public until he is definitively found guilty. I have a hunch… but my anecdote or hunch means jack shit in the grand scheme of things.

Aside from the roleplay thing… there are a few videos you can find on dark corners of the internet that I won’t link of the guy straight up beating the shit out of women (in non sexual encounters).

In one instance bringing the woman to tears

I’m convinced the guy is a piece of shit… even if he isn’t a sexual predator… his whole vibe reeks “psycho” to me

Either that or he has really bad CTE… which can provoke aggression, psychopathic tendancies etc.

Romania has awful policies on rape and human trafficking. That’s why it is so common for those involved to do their business in Romania

To actually get caught IN Romania, you’d have to be into some fairly deep shit and LE actually couldn’t ignore you anymore.

It is suspect that he fled to Romania… the one country in Europe where human trafficking is fairly easy to get away with… in response to UK LE starting up investigations on both Tate brothers over… you guessed it… investigations into rape and human trafficking.

Say what you want about wokeness and #metoo… Romania is NOT America… the dynamic there isn’t remotely similar.

Romanian Intelligence Service (RIS)… equivalent is FBI in USA won’t hahazardly break into your house, detain you for 30 days and seize all of your assets for no good reason.

… chances are there’s a reason.

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