T Nation

Testosterone and Nothing Else


#1

I'm 53 and had a vasectomy last year, so I'm not concerned about fertility. Supposing I took only testosterone (to keep the program simple and inexpensive), what effects can I expect over time?

By the way, I'm living in Japan and have found a legitimate testosterone ointment that's sold WITHOUT a prescription. Hard to believe, but I guarantee you it's true.


#2

There is a good chance that it could work well at first, but also likely that your estrogen levels will climb and undo all of your feelings of well been. That can happen even if you have good anobolic and androgenic physical responses.


#3

Okay, then, three questions:
1. is it a bad idea to do testosterone only?
2. what should I do if my estrogen levels climb?
3. do you know of any case histories of guys who've done testosterone only?


#4

Transdermals generally allow yield moderate levels of Test nowhere near what one could inject unless you're bathing in the gels. Depending on your goals a mild increase in estorgen should be welcomed with open arms. Different people have different ideas of what is too much estrogen. Certainly growing tits is too much. Others can debate stomach bloat and water retention all they want.
It is monumentally rare for a transdermal user to need a product for estrogen control.
Many people do gear cycles of straight Test and at doses quite a bit higher than what you'd be recommended to take with your ointment.
Test is the classic mass builder and strength enhancer.


#5

Thanks for your answers. I have two more questions.

1.) Supposing I start out, before using the transdermal, at a T level of 200ng/dl (real low, I know). Assuming I roughly double the recommended dose of the transdermal, what T levels would you guess I might reach after 3 months?

2.) As for guys who inject T for muscle building, what T levels do they typically start out at, and what T levels are they shooting for with the injections?


#6

Question number one is almost impossible to answer since you did not tell us what the recommended dose of the gel is (or else I just didn't pay attention), plus efficacy varies widely from person to person.

As for your second question - 97.4% of the folks that are taking exogenous 'T' have no clue what their T levels are, and base their results off what they see in the mirror, or in their lift totals. I know that's not exactly the smartest way to go about it - but that's the way it's done.


#7

Okay, the recommended first month dose is 6mg of ointment a day, to be cut in half the second month, but I'm going to do 8mg a day for the first month, then maybe cut back to 4mg a day.

This stuff is not Androgel. It's a Japanese product that's probably better absorbed than Androgel because you spread the ointment on your sac, which absorbs 40 times more efficiently than regular skin. How much actually makes it into your body, I don't know.

Here's what I can tell you, though. According to the manufacturer's scientific-looking tests (probably trustworthy), when you spread it on your nuts at 9AM, your test levels will go from about 300 to 600 over the next 3-4 hours. Check out the graph here:

And, other info is here, but good luck with the Japanese:

http://www.daito-p.co.jp/gm.htm

Well, if these dudes aren't getting T levels checked before taking T, that means they sure aren't getting PSA levels checked either, which means they're playing with fire.


#8

What good does getting the T levels checked before start do for you? Unless you undergo constant monitoring, all the test will tell you is what your T levels are in the beginning.

You seem to be mistaking TRT for recreational use. I'm not saying it isn't dangerous - but judging recreational users with the criteria of TRT patients is a bit misplaced.


#9

This post was flagged by the community and is temporarily hidden.


#10

Those peaks and valleys mimic (roughly) what goes on with the T levels of a guy in his prime (around 25-30 years old). Natural T levels vary widely throughout the day, so I wouldn't say it was a "recipe for disaster" at all.

Compared to an injection, the administration of T into your bloodstream is more even throughout the month. With injections, the amount going into your bloodstream goes down slowly from the time you get the injection until just before your next injection. That's not really ideal.


#11

If you get nocturnal and morning wood, then loose morning wood and libido, that is the E levels getting too high.

Long term low levels of T between injections can be bad. But short term might not be so bad. The available T receptors get loaded and the cells' reponse processes take hours/days.

What can you take do deal with that. Arimidex/anastrozole, but hard to know what you will be able to get your hands on there.


#12

This is a good thread about test and Anti-E.


#13

Okay, so where's the link?


#14

[quote]Amadon wrote:

And, other info is here, but good luck with the Japanese:

http://www.daito-p.co.jp/gm.htm
[quote]
Here is their English homepage.

http://www.daito-p.co.jp/index_e.htm


#15

Who told you this? Read around. Standard practice is to inject before t-levels drop.

If you want to put transdermal test on your nutsack - go ahead.

Injection frequency is not at all like you describe. Look around here - you will see post after post of recommendations for injecting at a frequency that will prevent unstable test levels.

On a related topic - I just saw a "King of the Hill" episode where the docter prescribed a scrotal patch - made me think of this thread.


#16

Here's who told me this:

www.steroid.com/Transdermal-Testosterone.php

And also, Dr. Eugene Shippen, a foremost expert on this topic, favors transdermal testosterone because it much more closely mimics natural testosterone levels.

Since I'm in Japan and can get it cheap, without a prescription, it's definitely the way to go. I'm just wondering about nut shrinkage.

Okay, so how frequently do they inject?


#17

That is ester dependent. Transdermals are not the optimal delivery system, nor does it provide the most stable t-levels. If that were true, the big guys would not be injecting anything at all.

Once again - you have confused TRT with recreational use. You are in a recreational steroid forum trying to tell us that your new find is the best. Maybe for you it is - but not for the vast majority of the members that frequent this particular forum.


#18

Let me try again:

http://www.T-Nation.com/readTopic.do?id=1399735

They talk about HRT and the need for an AI with HRT.

It seems the consensus to be that most docs will not give AI with HRT, and an AI is almost necessary with HRT.....btw(by the wqay) hrt=hormone replacement therapy. At the age of 56 I speculate any synthetic test intake would be considered HRT.

I recommend you read the entire thread, there is some good infor there for you.

In fact, I am going to bump the thread I think it is so good :slight_smile:


#19


your link is bogus here and just brings me to the steroid.com master page.

My friend, there are numerous posts on that forum per hour, I would not follow anyone of them as the gospel. Injections is the way to go, regardless of accessability and price in Japan Land.

Seriously man, 1 doctor versus an entire network of educated users? Are you really certain this is the way to go based on what this one dude that wants you to purchase his product is telling you?

Honestly, the length of this thread and the educating you that has taken place in it is exasperating, however; I digress, and will say to you that with a little research you can get test cheap no matter where you are, even cheaper when you are outside the US. Have you not looked around?

Do you really not know this? You going to shoot 1,500 MG of test into your ass 1 time per week? How ignorant are you?

Or are you someone that has done some research and knows that a more reasonable injection is 250-500 CC per injection divided into 2 injections per week is much more reasonable?

No, from reading what has been written, and advised, and your responses, you know dick little about juice and have no reason touching it, even at your age with the giuse of TRT/HRT in Jappan as an OTC drug.

My recommendation to you is to get all the Test Gel you can get, and rub it all over your nutsack daily......then...maybe.....just maybe.....you will not be able to reproduce......ever again. Read this god dam post again you loser.

READ AND UNDERSTAND THE GOD DAM RESPONSES OF THE EDUCATED PEOPLE THAT ARE TRYING TO HELP YOU!

You just don't get it do you???

I have a name for people like you, it is called a FUCKING TOOL.


#20

Wow, you are one hostile SOB.