T Nation

Testosterone And HGH

Does anyone know if Test And HGH work well together? I am currently on androgel by my doctor. I have read test cyp is better than gel and cheaper.

MVP my HMO covers the cost of Androgel and i only pay 30 bucks for 2 pumps which last about 1 mont to a month and a half. Would test cyp be more effective and cheaper? Also would it be wise to use HGH as well? I have to drop about anywhere from 50 to 60 lbs by 5 may. Does anyone know of anything that can get me around those numbers?

[quote]ArmyWarVet wrote:
Does anyone know if Test And HGH work well together? I am currently on androgel by my doctor. I have read test cyp is better than gel and cheaper.

MVP my HMO covers the cost of Androgel and i only pay 30 bucks for 2 pumps which last about 1 mont to a month and a half. Would test cyp be more effective and cheaper? Also would it be wise to use HGH as well? I have to drop about anywhere from 50 to 60 lbs by 5 may. Does anyone know of anything that can get me around those numbers?[/quote]
Go to the 35 and older category. Every other post discusses this. HGH is expensive from what little I know.
Jumpstart with the V-diet (lose 20lbs in 4weeks to jumpstart) or do something like T-dawg I’ve read your other posts and it seems like you are about to dabble into T3 and clen, I would assume that would help, short of gastric bypass surgery.

What is this V-Diet?

50-60 POUNDS? In 2 months?? That isn’t healthy, dogg! You gotta be seriously out of shape bad, all I can recommend is running a lot- but be prepared to lose muscle and have bags of loose skin.

[quote]ArmyWarVet wrote:
What is this V-Diet? [/quote]
OMFG HOW COULD YOU NOT KNOW THE GREATNESS OF TEH V-DIET??!!??!!??

No just kidding. It seems that I can’t read a day on this board without hearing about it. Just do a search for velocity diet (Chris Shugart is the author) and the 20 something threads about it. Basic premise is that in 4 weeks you drink protein shakes , take fish oil, Surge (1 serving per training session), and you end up losing ~20 lbs depending on how fat you are. Its important to get your training straight too. Also you could try the Get Shredded Diet which might work more long term for you its also low calorie and the fat flies. Read the threads about Dave Tate by Berardi

[quote]H-Train wrote:
50-60 POUNDS? In 2 months?? That isn’t healthy, dogg! You gotta be seriously out of shape bad, all I can recommend is running a lot- but be prepared to lose muscle and have bags of loose skin.[/quote]

Completely correct. I just realized he has only one month. Assuming he did the V-diet (its so darn simple) what protocol of T3 and/or clen is recommended?

Army: I think we need some stats pronto

Maybe I should shed light on this a little more. I am 5 feet 8 inches tall and weigh in about 230. I have had a hard time maintaining my weight ever since I left Benninng in 2002.

I used to weigh 165 pounds sudo lean and athletic. I then made the mistake of going Admin 42A later on down the road and went soft and I mean soft (Mid Section and all) I always have to get taped becuase I dont meet the max weight which for me is 182 pounds.

i only have myself to blame for this and I have put it off too long where 1. Am am going to Afghanistan. And 2.I ETS in August but I have to re-up to support my family. And 3. I want to be part of our WMD-CST team which would get me promoted to E-6.

[quote]ArmyWarVet wrote:
Maybe I should shed light on this a little more. I am 5 feet 8 inches tall and weigh in about 230. I have had a hard time maintaining my weight ever since I left Benninng in 2002.

I used to weigh 165 pounds sudo lean and athletic. I then made the mistake of going Admin 42A later on down the road and went soft and I mean soft (Mid Section and all) I always have to get taped becuase I dont meet the max weight which for me is 182 pounds.

i only have myself to blame for this and I have put it off too long where 1. Am am going to Afghanistan. And 2.I ETS in August but I have to re-up to support my family. And 3. I want to be part of our WMD-CST team which would get me promoted to E-6. [/quote]

As ones T levels decrease, at some point E levels will increase. The balance of these determine if you get mid section or female fat patterns. With more fat, more T is converted to E… see the trap there?

T alone will cause significant reapportionment of body fat and net fat loss. So will HGH. IGF-1 can have the same effects. Combined, T with one of those, will be synergistic and generally, the result is thought to be the sum of the parts. You will need cardio to speed the process along. But you also need to avoid gaining too much muscle mass from a weight point of view. Over training, high reps with lower resistance would be in the right direction. There is also a HGH fraction, part of the molecule, that can be obtained. it is specific to the release of lipids from the fat cells. In theory, that should promote fat loss while avoiding a lot of muscle mass gain. But you probably need some increase in muscle mass. Muscle mass burns calories 24x7.

If you go down this road, you are facing a hard time limit that implies a sudden stop. So that would mean no PCT to recover from any HPTA shutdown from testosterone.

If you do any of this and your appetite increases, do not eat carbs or fats.

[quote]ArmyWarVet wrote:
Maybe I should shed light on this a little more. I am 5 feet 8 inches tall and weigh in about 230. I have had a hard time maintaining my weight ever since I left Benninng in 2002.

I used to weigh 165 pounds sudo lean and athletic. I then made the mistake of going Admin 42A later on down the road and went soft and I mean soft (Mid Section and all) I always have to get taped becuase I dont meet the max weight which for me is 182 pounds.

i only have myself to blame for this and I have put it off too long where 1. Am am going to Afghanistan. And 2.I ETS in August but I have to re-up to support my family. And 3. I want to be part of our WMD-CST team which would get me promoted to E-6. [/quote]

I would stay away from the clen if you are 50-60ibs. to heavy. Also might not be the best thing to take in an area with high mountains. Don’t believe it’s known for helping aerobic athletes.

You really need to cut and the two diets mentioned will both work. My two cents is that the HGH will take way to long to help you. The test sounds like it’s not for you either, your pct will really hurt you if you can’t do it.

Do a good cut diet and take Hot-Rox Extreme. Add in a lot of cardio. 2X per day for 30mins. at least. You don’t have enough time for either of the two compounds you mentioned to be of much use.

Stay safe.

[quote]hedo wrote:
ArmyWarVet wrote:
Maybe I should shed light on this a little more. I am 5 feet 8 inches tall and weigh in about 230. I have had a hard time maintaining my weight ever since I left Benninng in 2002.

I used to weigh 165 pounds sudo lean and athletic. I then made the mistake of going Admin 42A later on down the road and went soft and I mean soft (Mid Section and all) I always have to get taped becuase I dont meet the max weight which for me is 182 pounds.

i only have myself to blame for this and I have put it off too long where 1. Am am going to Afghanistan. And 2.I ETS in August but I have to re-up to support my family. And 3. I want to be part of our WMD-CST team which would get me promoted to E-6.

I would stay away from the clen if you are 50-60ibs. to heavy. Also might not be the best thing to take in an area with high mountains. Don’t believe it’s known for helping aerobic athletes.

You really need to cut and the two diets mentioned will both work. My two cents is that the HGH will take way to long to help you. The test sounds like it’s not for you either, your pct will really hurt you if you can’t do it.

Do a good cut diet and take HOT-ROX Extreme. Add in a lot of cardio. 2X per day for 30mins. at least. You don’t have enough time for either of the two compounds you mentioned to be of much use.

Stay safe.

[/quote]

I think I am going to go balls out with the velocity diet. It seem very promising granted I can stick to it but I really have no choice. I would like to share with you what supplements I have ready and available. I have a brand new 5LB tub of EAS Whey protein which has 24 Grams of protein per scoop. I also have cold milled flax seed its kind of ground but not entirely. Also 100 gel caps of Flax Borage and Fish oil pills. Steel Cut Irish Oatmeal And Hydroxycut Hardcore and GNC Mega Man Sport Multivitamin. While on the V-Diet should I increase my water intake? Also should I Stop the prescribed Androgel?

[quote]ArmyWarVet wrote:
hedo wrote:
ArmyWarVet wrote:
Maybe I should shed light on this a little more. I am 5 feet 8 inches tall and weigh in about 230. I have had a hard time maintaining my weight ever since I left Benninng in 2002.

I used to weigh 165 pounds sudo lean and athletic. I then made the mistake of going Admin 42A later on down the road and went soft and I mean soft (Mid Section and all) I always have to get taped becuase I dont meet the max weight which for me is 182 pounds.

i only have myself to blame for this and I have put it off too long where 1. Am am going to Afghanistan. And 2.I ETS in August but I have to re-up to support my family. And 3. I want to be part of our WMD-CST team which would get me promoted to E-6.

I would stay away from the clen if you are 50-60ibs. to heavy. Also might not be the best thing to take in an area with high mountains. Don’t believe it’s known for helping aerobic athletes.

You really need to cut and the two diets mentioned will both work. My two cents is that the HGH will take way to long to help you. The test sounds like it’s not for you either, your pct will really hurt you if you can’t do it.

Do a good cut diet and take HOT-ROX Extreme. Add in a lot of cardio. 2X per day for 30mins. at least. You don’t have enough time for either of the two compounds you mentioned to be of much use.

Stay safe.

I think I am going to go balls out with the velocity diet. It seem very promising granted I can stick to it but I really have no choice. I would like to share with you what supplements I have ready and available. I have a brand new 5LB tub of EAS Whey protein which has 24 Grams of protein per scoop. I also have cold milled flax seed its kind of ground but not entirely. Also 100 gel caps of Flax Borage and Fish oil pills. Steel Cut Irish Oatmeal And Hydroxycut Hardcore and GNC Mega Man Sport Multivitamin. While on the V-Diet should I increase my water intake? Also should I Stop the prescribed Androgel?[/quote]

  1. You must use a micellar casein + whey protein mix, otherwise this won’t work
  2. This takes a lot of discipline
  3. Follow Shugarts outline as exactly as possible
  4. Do not stop the Androgel but take an aromatase inhibitor additionally
  5. Use fish oil not flax
  6. Repeat 1 & 2

[quote]themonthofjun wrote:
ArmyWarVet wrote:
hedo wrote:
ArmyWarVet wrote:
Maybe I should shed light on this a little more. I am 5 feet 8 inches tall and weigh in about 230. I have had a hard time maintaining my weight ever since I left Benninng in 2002.

I used to weigh 165 pounds sudo lean and athletic. I then made the mistake of going Admin 42A later on down the road and went soft and I mean soft (Mid Section and all) I always have to get taped becuase I dont meet the max weight which for me is 182 pounds.

i only have myself to blame for this and I have put it off too long where 1. Am am going to Afghanistan. And 2.I ETS in August but I have to re-up to support my family. And 3. I want to be part of our WMD-CST team which would get me promoted to E-6.

I would stay away from the clen if you are 50-60ibs. to heavy. Also might not be the best thing to take in an area with high mountains. Don’t believe it’s known for helping aerobic athletes.

You really need to cut and the two diets mentioned will both work. My two cents is that the HGH will take way to long to help you. The test sounds like it’s not for you either, your pct will really hurt you if you can’t do it.

Do a good cut diet and take HOT-ROX Extreme. Add in a lot of cardio. 2X per day for 30mins. at least. You don’t have enough time for either of the two compounds you mentioned to be of much use.

Stay safe.

I think I am going to go balls out with the velocity diet. It seem very promising granted I can stick to it but I really have no choice. I would like to share with you what supplements I have ready and available. I have a brand new 5LB tub of EAS Whey protein which has 24 Grams of protein per scoop. I also have cold milled flax seed its kind of ground but not entirely. Also 100 gel caps of Flax Borage and Fish oil pills. Steel Cut Irish Oatmeal And Hydroxycut Hardcore and GNC Mega Man Sport Multivitamin. While on the V-Diet should I increase my water intake? Also should I Stop the prescribed Androgel?

  1. You must use a micellar casein + whey protein mix, otherwise this won’t work
  2. This takes a lot of discipline
  3. Follow Shugarts outline as exactly as possible
  4. Do not stop the Androgel but take an aromatase inhibitor additionally
  5. Use fish oil not flax
  6. Repeat 1 & 2
    [/quote]

Would Animal Stack 2 count as a Anti Aromatase inhibitor? It has Calcium D-Glucarate and Diindolymethane b-sisterol, saw palmetto extract, pygeum africanum. These are a few ingredients that read Anti Aromatase Inhibitor on the Supplements facts.

[quote]ArmyWarVet wrote:
themonthofjun wrote:
ArmyWarVet wrote:
hedo wrote:
ArmyWarVet wrote:
Maybe I should shed light on this a little more. I am 5 feet 8 inches tall and weigh in about 230. I have had a hard time maintaining my weight ever since I left Benninng in 2002.

I used to weigh 165 pounds sudo lean and athletic. I then made the mistake of going Admin 42A later on down the road and went soft and I mean soft (Mid Section and all) I always have to get taped becuase I dont meet the max weight which for me is 182 pounds.

i only have myself to blame for this and I have put it off too long where 1. Am am going to Afghanistan. And 2.I ETS in August but I have to re-up to support my family. And 3. I want to be part of our WMD-CST team which would get me promoted to E-6.

I would stay away from the clen if you are 50-60ibs. to heavy. Also might not be the best thing to take in an area with high mountains. Don’t believe it’s known for helping aerobic athletes.

You really need to cut and the two diets mentioned will both work. My two cents is that the HGH will take way to long to help you. The test sounds like it’s not for you either, your pct will really hurt you if you can’t do it.

Do a good cut diet and take HOT-ROX Extreme. Add in a lot of cardio. 2X per day for 30mins. at least. You don’t have enough time for either of the two compounds you mentioned to be of much use.

Stay safe.

I think I am going to go balls out with the velocity diet. It seem very promising granted I can stick to it but I really have no choice. I would like to share with you what supplements I have ready and available. I have a brand new 5LB tub of EAS Whey protein which has 24 Grams of protein per scoop. I also have cold milled flax seed its kind of ground but not entirely. Also 100 gel caps of Flax Borage and Fish oil pills. Steel Cut Irish Oatmeal And Hydroxycut Hardcore and GNC Mega Man Sport Multivitamin. While on the V-Diet should I increase my water intake? Also should I Stop the prescribed Androgel?

  1. You must use a micellar casein + whey protein mix, otherwise this won’t work
  2. This takes a lot of discipline
  3. Follow Shugarts outline as exactly as possible
  4. Do not stop the Androgel but take an aromatase inhibitor additionally
  5. Use fish oil not flax
  6. Repeat 1 & 2

Would Animal Stack 2 count as a Anti Aromatase inhibitor? It has Calcium D-Glucarate and Diindolymethane b-sisterol, saw palmetto extract, pygeum africanum. These are a few ingredients that read Anti Aromatase Inhibitor on the Supplements facts.[/quote]

Stick with the real thing. Arimidex will work better. It’s widely available.
I think you will see a lot of fat loss on the V-diet. Follow the advice above and don’t forget the HOT-ROX. It’s a good fat burner along with cardio.

How hard is it to aquire armidex? Would my doctor precribe it to me? By the way if I cant get this Armidex stuff would 6-OXO work?

[quote]ArmyWarVet wrote:
How hard is it to aquire armidex? Would my doctor precribe it to me? By the way if I cant get this Armidex stuff would 6-OXO work?[/quote]

You could get it from your doc or online as a research chemical. (oxyandrolone)…for your research.

I have not tried 6-oxo.