T Nation

Test E / D-Bol cycle

Hi guys,

Haven’t posted here in a while, but at the moment I managed to get my hands on some Testosterone Enanthate and a few D-Bol. I am starting cycle probably on January 1, and this is what it’ll look like:

Test E - 450mg/week (8 weeks)
D-Bol - 30mg/day (5 weeks)

Just wondering if I should split up my Test E and run it for longer, at a lower dose (like 400mg). The oil is already divided into syringes, but I could take a fraction out of each one to load up another extra at the lower dose.

Also, what are the risks/benefits of taking 400mg vs. 450mg of Test E?

if your a first timer, then yes lower it to 400 and extend it to 10 weeks. as far as side effects of test e, a very simple search will give you an extensive list. as far as which sides you will feel, this is a very personal thing as it effects different people differently. do you have anti e’s and pct goodies as well?

Dezz

Well, I’m not quite a first timer, having done a mild Sust+D-Bol stack (250mg/week +20mg/day) and an Anadrol+Winstrol (50mg + 30mg/day) stack this year. I resembled a broomstick at the start of '06 and was only 60kg (132lb). I gained 20kg from those 2 cycles, plus heavy lifting and eating. So I’m 80+ kg, or 176lb.

Now I’m just looking to break through into the next level of size, and go from a solid normal build to something more “SWOLE” and large! So this will be my first Test cycle at dosages over 400mg/week.

Thanks for the response, and I’ll take your advice into account.

[quote]Dezz wrote:
do you have anti e’s and pct goodies as well?

[/quote]

Oh yeah, forgot to mention that I’ve got a supply of Clomid, which I will be taking 50mg/day post-cycle.

[quote]JohnnyBlaze wrote:
Well, I’m not quite a first timer, having done a mild Sust+D-Bol stack (250mg/week +20mg/day) and an Anadrol+Winstrol (50mg + 30mg/day) stack this year. I resembled a broomstick at the start of '06 and was only 60kg (132lb). I gained 20kg from those 2 cycles, plus heavy lifting and eating. So I’m 80+ kg, or 176lb.

Now I’m just looking to break through into the next level of size, and go from a solid normal build to something more “SWOLE” and large! So this will be my first Test cycle at dosages over 400mg/week.

Thanks for the response, and I’ll take your advice into account.

[/quote]

then yes you could make excellent gains on even 400mg of test for 10 weeks w/ the dbol kickstart. i will warn you tho, such a combination can
result in excessive puffiness. low dose nolva or adex would combat this. another thing to consider would be a frontload, for example

w1)800mg Test
w2-8)400mg T
Week 9-10) 200mg T

or

w1-10)400mgT

And personally I always like to have something fast acting for the 2-3 week period after your last shot waiting for test clearance. Winny, Anavar, or a cheap alternative, tbol could be considered here.

DezZ

I would bump up the clomid higher than 50mg/d for the first few weeks along with nolvadex (20-40mg/d)…have 400iu HCG every 5 days during your cycle to help you recover a bit quicker…

[quote]JohnnyBlaze wrote:
Well, I’m not quite a first timer, having done a mild Sust+D-Bol stack (250mg/week +20mg/day) and an Anadrol+Winstrol (50mg + 30mg/day) stack this year. I resembled a broomstick at the start of '06 and was only 60kg (132lb). I gained 20kg from those 2 cycles, plus heavy lifting and eating. So I’m 80+ kg, or 176lb.

Now I’m just looking to break through into the next level of size, and go from a solid normal build to something more “SWOLE” and large! So this will be my first Test cycle at dosages over 400mg/week.

Thanks for the response, and I’ll take your advice into account.

[/quote]

I definitely recommend running either more than 400mg of TestE per W and/or running longer than 8 weeks; preferably both. 500-600mg a week for 11-12 weeks. I like the month of DBol as a kickstart. Another great idea is to run proviron at 25mg ED or 50mg EOD. Proviron ang long ester T’s is like Peanut Butter and Jelly.

Opinions vary regarding using AI and AntiE’s during a cycle; myself I’ve tended to not lean towards using them as I don’t get another negative sides and appreciate the water gain myself.

However, it is wise to have all those products on hand for day 1 of the cycle.
IMO, nolvadex is better than clomid if you need something during the cycle itself. PCT-wise its a coin flip, although my coin usually chooses nolva. Some people swear by HCG as well.

For the truly SWOLE look you could add some deca to your cycle for what IMO is the ultimate cycle: Test/Deca/DBol. But that’s probably a different thread. As are the opinions people will give you on Deca

[quote]sapasion wrote:

Opinions vary regarding using AI and AntiE’s during a cycle; myself I’ve tended to not lean towards using them as I don’t get another negative sides and appreciate the water gain myself.

[/quote]

I’m able to obtain an emergency supply of Nolva or Arimidex, just in case I start experiencing signs of gyno. I’ve never had that side effect before, and still have a full head of hair. Hopefully things will stay this way. So I’ll go without during cycle, and only get some if it ever becomes necessary.

I too appreciate the water gain, and it gives a good psychological boost to see the weight going up on the scales.

[quote]JohnnyBlaze wrote:
sapasion wrote:

Opinions vary regarding using AI and AntiE’s during a cycle; myself I’ve tended to not lean towards using them as I don’t get another negative sides and appreciate the water gain myself.

I’m able to obtain an emergency supply of Nolva or Arimidex, just in case I start experiencing signs of gyno. I’ve never had that side effect before, and still have a full head of hair. Hopefully things will stay this way. So I’ll go without during cycle, and only get some if it ever becomes necessary.

I too appreciate the water gain, and it gives a good psychological boost to see the weight going up on the scales.

[/quote]

My thoughts exactly.
Have you decided to lengthen the duration of your TestE; or increase the dosage strengthen; or both?

[quote]sapasion wrote:
Have you decided to lengthen the duration of your TestE; or increase the dosage strengthen; or both? [/quote]

Hmmm, yes, that’s the choice I am faced with. But I have some time to think about it as I am not starting the cycle until Jan 1. I don’t think I’ll do both though; just one or the other.

These are just the things to be taken into consideration:

The oil is already loaded into syringes, so it’ll take a bit of fiddling to divide the doses up and load up a couple of extra ones. I think it will be pretty imprecise. Some doses may be slightly above or below 400mg. It would just be simpler to stick 'em in at 450mg.

However, from the feedback I’ve been getting, a longer duration at slightly lower dose would be more beneficial than a shorter duration at higher dose, when it comes to Test E (it seems that the reverse is true with orals). I’m just wondering what the threshold dosage is for side effects etc.

Also I’m curious, because I haven’t come across this idea before, but is Clomid only used for PCT, or can it be used the same way as Nolvadex during cycle in case symptoms of gyno arise? I have 20 squares of PaperClo 50mg and my usual PCT has been to only use 10 of those, which has been sufficient as I have done short, relatively mild cycles. Would a longer duration of PCT be necessary for the cycle described in this post, though?

I would say and I think most agree nolva is the better of the two for peri-cycle treatment. A-dex is superior to both of course and its wise to have some on stand-by, in case of nipplely issues