T Nation

Test/Deca/Winny Cycle: My 1st Cycle


#1

Wk 1:
300 mg Deca/400mg Test C/Proviron 50mg tab

Wk 2:
350 mg Deca/400mg Test C/Proviron 50mg tab

Wk 3:
400 mg Deca/400mg Test C/Proviron 50mg tab

Wk 4:
400 mg Deca/400mg Test C/Proviron 50mg tab

Wk 5:
400 mg Deca/400mg Test C/Winstrol 350mg/Proviron 50mg tab

Wk 6:
400 mg Deca/400mg Test C/Winstrol 350mg/Proviron 50mg tab

Wk 7:
350 mg Deca/400mg Test C/Winstrol 350mg/Proviron 50mg tab

Wk 8:
300 mg Deca/400mg Test C/Winstrol 350mg/Proviron 50mg tab/HCG 3000 IU

Wk 9:
HCG 3000 IU/50mg Nolvadex

Wk 10:
HCG 1500 IU/50mg Nolvadex

Wk 11:
HCG 1500 IU/50mg Nolvadex

Wk 12 and 13:
Nolvadex 25mg
END OF CYCLE!

Well, decided to join in! Im 32, 5'9", 225lbs, 25% BF. Wanted something to help me get lean and not HUGE so after doing some reading, put this little cycle together. Was thinking of doin EQ instead of Deca but eod pinning being my first cycle didnt actually drive me crazy. Although I liked the vasculary it gives and not needing test like deca does, maybe for later, plus I read it really needs 12 weeks to see good results.

Also, would u guys recommemnd nolva all thru this cycle or just fine at the end like I have it with the proviron being suffice as an anti-estrogenic? All help will be appreciated.


#2

Before you start getting slammed, please read the stickies. Not all the info is exactly what we preach atm, but it is a little more updated than your plan.

A few things to get you started... Keep your first cycle SIMPLE and SHORT. Also, ester length is going to affect when you start PCT (and cyp hangs around for awhile hint hint), and finally, it's far better to use hCG on cycle, twice a week at 250IU / per, than it is to use high doses post-cycle.


#3

read somewhere that HCG is really good after using test, to only use for a total of 4 shots in 3 weeks after test. So should I stop the cyp a week or 2 earlier? at whatpoint would u recommend the HCG to be put into play?


#4

Please take the previous advice and do some reading on this site.

Your questions are only making you sound more unprepared than you may actually be.

Asking questions that can easily be answered by reading Stickied posts and old forum posts start to become annoying because it looks like you don't want to do any research of your own. We get questions like yours all of the time and it becomes annoying very quickly when people continue to ask questions instead of doing what was suggested in the first reply; reading.

If you continue to ask questions looking to be spoonfed information on how to fix your poorly conceived cycle members will lose interest in replying.


#5

Come back with a revamped plan after doing a little reading (stickies and such) and we'll be happy to chime in. Right now your plan is way off.

Blatant errors:

1) PCT started way too early after cycle of long esters (deca = very long ester Cyp = quite long ester)
2) No mention of AI use which is needed
3) Confusion over whether to use Nolva during cycle or only after (best not to use during unless gyno flares up which is highly unlikely if correctly using an AI).
4) hCG is not recommended post cycle, but in the doses whotookmyname suggested during cycle.
5) Also, these are not the most leaning compounds although with proper diet they could work.


#6

guys, thanks!!!! been reading the stickys and see some of my mistakes....the HCG dosing I posted on this proposal I saw on a Big Cat article. Will keep reading but lookin to just go test-p and winny being a newb and wanting something not too long....


#7

The trouble is - and at one time Big Cat had some decent knowledge - many articles on the net have been there some time, so as protocols change and improve - an article is still a snapshot of a time when it was different, making the information gleaned from it redundant or sub-optimal.

Articles by their very nature seem very good sources of info - the dont discuss, they instruct.. how could they be wrong? And in many cases if they are wrong - they weren't always.

JMO


#8

Consider losing the fat before your cycle. Diet until 10% body fat, then start the cycle. This way, you can make great gains while you're on, and the muscle will be visible. If you go on cycle before dieting, either 1) you'll restrict calories while on cycle, and you won't make great gains, though you'll protect your existing muscle, 2) you won't restrict calories well, you'll gain a lot of muscle, but you'll still have >20% fat.


#9

Exactly - i recently observed an aquaintance who ran his first two cycles of Test at ~500mg/wk, AI etc..
He has a BF of approximately (by eye) 20% or so.. and truthfully, he looks no different after wards than before - he loved the cycle, so he sees something i know, but no fucker else does.. simply as his fat hides any improvement he made.

Over time of course his body composition will keep improving and he will be a big and ripped guy, capable of being successful in bodybuilding (if he had the drive needed - which he doesnt).

The point is, that losing the fat first is a good idea - even if you want to be on cycle to do that, do that first. Diet to a good shape.

Big fat guys do dislike being fat, but once they drop the fat often they have the ability to be massive. As a naturally slim person, fat isnt a problem, but i will never be an enormous guy, although i am more muscular than many of course.

Brook