Test Cyp .3 E4D, Low Libido

Yah well you aren’t his patient. Hes on a forum board under a nickname. Let the guy live his life as he see’s fit. You can stick to the doctors who you hold up on a pedestal. I appreciate him just being himself and speaking the truth. Hes not here trying to gain business. Hes only here to help men realize the truth. What he has learned over the years and why he believes in his methods.

He came on here and attacked me. Not the other way around.

Get your facts right.

2 Likes

HAHA And you are a F angel from heaven. Got it.

Lol at the Yeti dude. Why is it that all these people promoting e2 to run rampant Ever can Keep a discussion to save their lives? They all behave like women, why?

Oh, i do know why.

Lol so dossa recommends this guy? Jeez.

My E is running high and without control and I dont act like a woman. I mean, arguing online is not a female or male trait. Its simply a group of passionate people who think they’re right. Some dudes can handle it and some can’t same goes for T, some are sensitive to it too. I have a high tolerance for many things and T along with E can climb if with no negative side effects. If you believe that you need an AI use it, but don’t assume that its necessary from the get go. @dbossa is a good source and although he’s a hotblooded passionate Italian like my mechanic, he’s able to fix issues with guys by simplifying it. The E conversation is a complex one, and its the great divider amongst us. But the middle is here, we can all agree that we all need it. Some need less, some need more.

1 Like

Both bossa and yeti mean well. They just need to be a little more open minded imo. And no need for the immature comments (yetis)

I didn’t know you were still here. Just the thread for you. Come on over and help the weak guys…

Oh and this one too.

I’d invite serious discussion and debate in a scientific fashion without all the logical fallacies (straw man, ad hominem, etc, etc).

Deja vu. I am still waiting to get an education on blood viscosity. Hang in there :slight_smile:

Only because I was tagged.

Yeti is Dr Keith Nichols, not me. I have nothing to do with the guy. I sure as hell am not pretending to be him, nor vice versa, I assure you, as can he.

I’m going to clarify something for all of you because there is so much bickering here and I can’t believe this is still an issue.

For those of you who claim (equel, I’m talking to you) that estradiol has nothing to do with libido, you are so off the mark from what reality demonstrates it is staggering to say the least. The very action of aromatase is massively responsible for libido and erection strength. If you think it is not, you can be my guest and block it until you’re blue in the face, but I’ve demonstrated this thousands of times at this point with guys messaging me from all over the world and there is nothing anyone can do to convince me that my gigantic mountain of evidence is somehow all wrong. You might as well try to convince me that the world is flat (please, let’s not go there).

I need all of you to ask yourselves why I would purposely advocate for something that doesn’t work. Why would I do this? What possible reason would I have? When I can demonstrate something to work thousands of times, I have all the evidence in the world that I need. Our Facebook group has over 5000 members in it with the vast majority either completely off their AI or weaning off. Every single physician in that group USED to prescribe AI to their patients and have since stopped after getting further caught up with the literature. At this point we are talking about tens of thousands of men with no AI and doing great. This is OLD NEWS for most of us yet the rest of you are still here, still with symptoms, still using an AI, and wondering why you don’t feel your best. I can’t grasp this… I really can’t. I have emails and messages in my FB inbox from guys who blasted me for over a year on the subject and now come back to say, “Holy shit… you were right. I finally tried it your way, because nothing else worked, and now I feel great. Thank you.”

I WANT YOU GUYS TO FEEL GOOD AND NOT FEEL LIKE SHIT.

I don’t know how else to explain this. When I started TRT I was miserable as fuck because I was doing it all wrong. Same as pre-TRT. I wouldn’t wish that on my worst enemy. I want to help people as much as I can with what little free time I actually have. I have nothing to sell you. I have no money to make here. I do this because it is a passion of mine. It is ALL done in my free time. I have not made a nickel on TRT other than ONE guy who wanted to pay me to talk to him for an hour by phone. That’s it. Steven Devos never paid me for any of the YouTube views and not because he didn’t want to but because, frankly, I don’t need the money and neither does he so I told him he can keep it. So for those of you claiming YouTube view money, when YouTube brings in a few hundred bucks a month at best is nonsense. I give you guys information that I can demonstrate literally for free.

Now, for those of you who keep harping on the BLANKET STATEMENTS:

Are there exceptions?? YES. Absolutely there are. Why don’t I say that? Because every one of you fools will immediately claim that you are an exception because you haven’t been able to figure out your ideal protocol or your issues have something to do an issue outside of TRT and, believe it or not, there are MANY factors here.

What is an exception? First, I want you to take a guess as to how many men have contacted me and sent me their labs because of those damn YouTube videos I’ve done. Add a zero to that number. No bullshit. How many exceptions have I seen? TWO. You read that right. TWO. What were they?

  1. A guy with total T of 750ng/dL with a sensitive E2 of 260 pg/mL. Any of you with newbie level TRT skills can quickly see something is really, really off. No, he isn’t obese, not by a long shot. This man has an underlying condition that is preventing his body from properly metabolizing estrogens. Guess what? His liver function was beyond shit. We got that worked out and problem solved. No AI required. How about that?

  2. A guy with a total T of 1600 ng/dL with a sensitive E2 of 18 pg/mL. No AI. You can probably also see that’s REALLY weird. This man had an aromatase deficiency. His body simply would not produce enough aromatase to create an adequate level of estradiol to achieve a healthy ratio with his total T. What needed to be done? He needed to supplement with estradiol. No bullshit. Now his estradiol is 65 pg/mL and he feels like a new man. I know one doctor who has seen two cases like this. In each case he prescribed estradiol.

When there is an exception, it is an EXCEPTIONAL exception (pun intended). It is something that is completely and utterly out of the ordinary. 99.999% of men will never see anything like this while on TRT. Even in these crazy situations we STILL don’t need to use an AI as the AI would simply mask the underlying condition causing the issue in the first place. You’d feel better, at the expense of your health, and just wind up being the lazy ass who can’t figure out what the ACTUAL problem is. This is the equivalent of taking an Advil 6 times a day because it’s the only thing that makes your headache go away and claiming you NEED the Advil. No, you don’t. The Advil is going to ruin you over time. Why don’t you figure out why you have the headache to begin with?? People are lazy and stupid, that’s why.

Go on the TRT and Hormone Optimization YouTube channel and look at the video I did regarding how I fixed my gyno. Gyno I had for 15 years PRIOR to TRT due to E2 at 11 pg/mL with deficient T. Once I raised T, and E2 raised with it, gyno started to disappear. My E2 is now well over 60 and my chest looks amazing right now… even better than it did in that video. Look at how ‘high e2’ transformed my chest so I can actually take my shirt off now and not be embarrassed. Or… could it have been caused due to an androgen deficiency perhaps?? If I inject twice a week, levels get unstable and it starts to swell up again. EOD shots and it’s non-existent. That’s what my body needs. Meanwhile, weekly dose is identical and E2 labs are identical no matter how I do it. So it isn’t the god damned E2.

Can a guy have such a severe clinical over-aromatization issue that he would benefit from an AI if the underlying condition cannot be found? Perhaps, and even if so, temporarily until the actual solution is found. But, again, every idiot with access to YouTube will immediately claim they are that guy. By telling men they do NOT need one, I get hundreds a month messaging me to tell me that was the key to their protocol. In every single god damn case it was one of these issues:

  1. Taking an AI
  2. Not taking enough T
  3. Not administering frequently enough to feel stable
  4. In some ‘minor’ cases they were simply taking too much T

Watch the video called ‘Find your ideal dose’ on the same channel.

No, I’m not a magician. No, I don’t have ALL the answers. No, I’m not fully up to speed with every single other underlying condition that prevents a guy on TRT from feeling his best. No, I’m not a doctor and have not been to medical school. I’ve seen liver dysfunction, meds that they never told me about, alcohol/drug consumption that they never told me about, changing their protocol every day, vitamin and mineral deficiencies, too low carb intake, over trained, stressed, not enough sleep, poor thyroid function, etc. etc. etc. TRT doesn’t fix any of this. TRT is ONE component of MANY yet when your shitty protocol fails you blame it because you can’t see outside the tiny god damn box you’re living in, most of the time. I’m trying to help men open their eyes here.

YOU WANT TO HAVE SUFFICIENT ESTRADIOL. You have NO CLUE what estradiol will do to benefit your health. You don’t want to purposely spike estradiol as you will throw off the balance the body is trying to maintain so don’t tell me, “Then why don’t we just inject estradiol every day then if it’s so good for us??” like I get all the time. Estradiol, literally 99.999% of the time is something you don’t even need to be concerned with. No, you’re not the damn exception. No, you don’t need to start taking an AI when your free T levels are way up there and your E2 is at 60, or 70, or 80, or more. It’s a NON ISSUE. It’s your protocol that is off. Period.

Every single guy out there who doesn’t feel his best claims “It must be the E2”. It must be?? It can’t be anything else?? SPOILER ALERT: It’s virtually NEVER the damn E2 and it’s virtually ALWAYS something else. As soon as they get that through their heads they can actually begin to start to investigate what the ACTUAL problem is and THAT is when they begin to improve.
Then you’ve got the guys who are feeling amazing but afraid of the numbers. “My free T is over the range and my E2 is 40 points over the range but I feel amazing. Should I be worried??” I mean, Jesus Christ, the guy is lean and has muscle tone, looks and feels amazing, but sees a number and freaks out. Stop comparing your damn labs to the sick population we have before us otherwise you will be forced to lower your dose, year after year, as the serum T levels of the population continue to decline, and trust me they will continue. You want your free T at a bare minimum of 25 and let that E2 get to whatever the hell it needs to get to because the combo of those two is AMAZING. You don’t jack up one and not the other. We actually HAVE literature that demonstrates that a high ratio is bad for you (high total/free with low e2). Hematocrit is another. No symptoms? Feel fantastic? No high blood pressure? Literally nothing out of the ordinary? Stop worrying about it. If you feel better when you donate, go donate. Keep an eye on ferritin etc. if you do.

Stop fearing testosterone and estradiol. Stop it. Stop it! Look at the bigger picture and ensure every single factor at play is being addressed and you WILL feel better. Look me up on Facebook or every Instagram. I’m 46… I eat super clean, don’t smoke, don’t drink, free T is over 40, don’t give a rat’s ass about estradiol or anything else, I train EVERY day, I load up on vitamins and minerals, take fish oil, and I feel better than I’ve ever felt in my entire life. My wife is 36, has the body of a 22 year old, trains EVERY DAY, and she has a hard time keeping up with me. We address health on ALL fronts and not just hormones.

Stop bickering about the nonsense and the tiny details. It’s such a waste of time. Just say to yourself, if whatever you’ve done so far hasn’t worked you NEED TO TRY SOMETHING ELSE.

Step one: stop worrying about god damned estrogen.

2 Likes

@roscoe88 can you contact me outside this place? FB or email?

And now I lost the very little respect I had left for Keith, behaving this way - as Yeti - being a doctor, what the fuck is wrong with docs in the US, all so fucking unprofessional, you are all little kids at heart, pathetic.

Keith, get your estrogen under control, your e2 rage is off the fucking chart.

1 Like

And the reason people arent listening to you is the fact you are behaving like a PMS woman in most of your posts. You are basically proving the very point of too much estrogen being bad for you, making you an emotional mess - by acting like an emotional mess.

Stop the fucking capital letters, stop arguing like ure a girl, start being objective and for gods sake stop the “LITERALLY NOOO BLALBA NOO LITERALLY LITERALLY NOOOO!!!”

Jesus.

Jesus christ, a wall of text.

“that estradiol has nothing to do with libido”

No, no one stated it has “nothing to do with libido” - what was said was: “estrogen is RESPONSIBLE for libido” aswell as “estrogen is WHAT CAUSES LIBIDO”, which are both, incorrect.

And no, your “mountain of evidence” doesnt say anything, as you are biased, there are “mountains of evidence” - ancedotes, disproving your estrogen-theory all over the boards.

This is painfully obvious for anyone who have done large doses of testosterone, shooting their estrogen to the moon, totally killing their libido and erectile strenght - all having it come back when lowering their estrogen.

So no, fail, again,

There you go. Your argument is large doses of testosterone. Guys on cycles, as you have done repeatedly. I said guys on TRT, not cycles. Funny thing about guys doing high dose test cycles as they are RARELY doing just test and instead incorporating numerous other compounds that convert to synthetic estrogens. When they do that, all bets are off. It is a poor comparison to make.

You claim that I am biased yet have provided nothing in return regarding evidence. I also asked what possible reason would I have to BE biased? You didn’t provide a reason.

Please go through all the studies in the attached link, written by other people that I have no association with, and then please demonstrate to the class where all these researchers have gone wrong and how their studies are flawed. Ensure you provide clinical evidence that directly contradicts their findings. Ensure they are in vivo (not in vitro) studies done in humans (not rats or mice). I will await a very detailed, clinical explanation from you.

Here is a mountain of evidence. Please provide your evidence.

https://drive.google.com/drive/mobile/folders/1Ml3jnxdxpBTc3kKIIpW3KT5CqrwIdjuG?usp=sharing

I would suggest starting with “Estradiol as a Male Hormone” to save yourself some time.

You can also join my Facebook group and have over 5000 men and physicians laugh their asses off at what you just said.

You’re still here, after all this time, and still clearly miserable yet still harping on the same stuff sounding frustrated as all hell. You’re incapable of opening your mind to other ideas. This explains a lot. The rest of us have moved on. I’ll keep helping people. You can keep visiting this place saying how stupid everyone is without a shred of understanding on the subject.

If you are still under the delusion that estrogen is not directly responsible for libido, crash your estrogen and let me know how much libido you have.

2 Likes

Regarding HCT, drink more water. Try this… double your water intake and watch your HCT drop. Its that simple. Plasma needs H2O to be plasma, so just add water to make it less viscous.

I’m pretty sure I read every post and I didn’t see anywhere what the strength of the test he was using. All I saw was .3 E4D :^ /

I’m taking 200 mg/ml

You k ow what’s interesting, is that viagra or cialis always works better when I’ve downed a few big glasses of water.

Maybe it’s the blood that is less viscous and flowing better ? Maybe that’s a stretch.

This comment was for me? If so, thanks for taking the time to provide your thoughts. In my particular case your recommendation would cause me to drink ~ 256 fl. oz (2 gal) of water daily. This is infeasible practically speaking and would not be a good plan. My urine specific gravity, color indicate proper hydration. Root cause of my erythrocytosis is androgen sensitivity. Dose response of my Hct to Testosterone dose is very nonlinear. Appreciate the input the though. After you’ve properly hydrated yourself, you can’t drink your way out of elevated Hct (well you could but that raises a whole new set of problems where the cure is worse than the disease so to speak).