T Nation

Test and Deca Cycle


#1

Hi guys,
Well i started my second cycle just over a month ago. It was Test and Mast, i choose this for my summer of playing my sport. Just my luck i injured my back in the very first game. I suffered with it for a while but i stopped my cycle after about 4 weeks and i've put my left over gear away.

So now i've decided to plan my next cycle for the winter. My friend has recently completed his first cycle of test end dbol so we were talking and we decided to go for a test and deca cycle and train together this winter!

Our local source has suggested Sustanon, deca and dbol.
These are his doses (not mine):
Sustanon 250mg E3D
Deca 200mg E5D
W1-6 Dbol 50mg ED
(He also suggests E3D for prop and E5D for Enthanate)

We are both researching at the moment, but i find it helps to talk to experienced people. Lets just say there is not many anabolics users around rural ireland and those that do defo keep quiet about it!

I have no problem with EOD injections so i'm wondering about Sustanon or prop, but frontloading enatanate should be the same because i'll need to run it for 10 weeks with the deca, correct?

So here's what i'm thinking:
W1-10 Test E 250mg E3D (frontloaded)
W1-8 Deca 200-300mg /week - probably inject same day as test.
Dbol - i was considering getting some for preworkout or maybe for W1-6.

Am i correct running The Test 2 weeks longer than the deca?

Is 8 weeks enough for deca? Can you frontload deca?

I have plenty of adex left over but my friend didn't bother with it last time.

Pct - standard nolva 40-40-20-20

Current stats
Age 23
Weight 94kg
Height 5' 11'
bodyfat has dropped over summer, can see good 6pack, maybe 10 or 11%

Any imput would be great guys.


#2

anyone?


#3

Yes you can and should frontload deca.
Use Adex @ 0.5mg ED. give or take
I am not a fan of Deca. Maybe you can swap it for Boldenone.

week 1-10 test e 583mg/week
week 1-9 EQ 400mg/week OR 200-300mg deca
Week 1-3 Dbol 20mg/day
Week 10-12 Dbol 20mg/day
PCT 13-16 nolva
Week 1-12 HCG 250iu EOD optional but recommended

I'd like to inject long ester drugs into lean areas with good blood flow . It will prevent too much oil get suck into surrounding fat tissue. It's just my theory. I am sentitive to dbol, to take it pre-training during a cycle would make estrogen management a bit tricky.

Alternative cycle with simalr result

Week 1-8 Test e 583mg/week 250mg E3D
Week 1-5 Tren A 210mg/week 30mg daily
Week 6-10 Dro P 350mg/week 50mg daily
PCT 11-14 nolva

a shorter cycle

Week 1-6 Test P 100mg/day
Week 1-6 Tren A 50mg/day
Week 1-6 Dros P 50mg/day

IMO, if you are using AAS at a very advanced level or HRT, and use blast-cruise style cycling, then running long ester nandrolone is fine. It is a very good anabolic steroid. BUt for the average guy that do 2 medium length cycle per year, it is best to avoid deca. Boldneone on the other hand is no where near as supressive as nandrolone, but due to its long ester, it is not very "time effective".
Test/tren/dbol is a very potent stack, but IME tren+dbol seriously compromise endurance. So I would rather go with test/tren/dros, or test/dbo/dros.


#4

I disagree that for those who don't need to recover should use deca - it's negative sexual effects are just as troublesome during the cycle as when trying to recover.. but i feel i'm splitting hairs.

OP: There is no reason why you wouldn't choose sust for a longer (10wk) cycle.. opting for enanth instead. In fact, suistanon has some longer esters in that enanth - with isocap very similar.. a carbon or two shorter IIRC, and with decanoate longer..

IMO, the Sust would suit Nandrolone Deca more due to the longer duration action.

You frontload the sust, enanth and deca - depending on what you choose.


#5

Thanks for the input guys, thats giving me a lot to think about!
Personally i like the idea of a shorter cycle, so i will defo consider the prop and tren ace.
Is it essential to inject both of those every day or wouldn't EOD be ok?

I'm actually considering playing football this winter and i have read that tren has a negative effect on endurance. I've read EQ lessens this, so now i'm going to look up these two cycles Test/tren and test/tren/EQ, but winter football has no importance to me except for a bit of fun and fresh air!

I better look up the prices of these too!:slightly_smiling:

Personally i'd like to run prop with tren to make injections easier.


#6

As mephistopheles stated drastanolone prop (masteron proprionate), tends to offset the cardio sapping tendency of tren. It is also a short ester so the three (prop, tren ace & mast prop) could be injected together. Daily is best. Ironjoe also asserted that strongly on a past thread.

Short esters do tend to make for a more expensive cycle unless you are hooked up like a lot of the senior members of this forum. That is because 10ml vials tend to cost the same or more than long ester ones whereas they have lower concentrations. The short esters tend to be concentrated at around 100mg/ml while the longer esters are up around 200 or 250mg/ml. mg for mg short esters are more expensive.

Good luck.......


#7

DH, its good to hear from you again!

Yes i noticed that about the prices when i was looking at some online sources.

My local source charged me 85euro per 10ml 100mg/ml vial of mast E.
I'll just have to get a few different prices and see from there!

Yes i'm reading a few tren logs at the moment,
Injecting ED seems like a lot of pins! I normally just use glutes and quads, but i guess i'll have to start shoulders eventually!


#8

FYI guys, my guy i meet this year, the only source i know in ireland (a very big guy) told me he's in the middle of a prop and tren ace cycle. he said its unreal stuff. but he told me he's injecting them E3D!!

Sound guy but i'll take my advise from this site!

Anyway what i'm thinking is prop and tren,

maybe mephistopheles suggestion of
Week 1-6 Test P 100mg/day
Week 1-6 Tren A 50mg/day

Or if i hear something good about EOD injections of tren ace, maybe
W1-8 Prop 150mg EOD
W1-8 Tren ace 75mg EOD

Both would be with a standard nolva 40/40/20/20 pct
Adex would be taken at same time as injections so maybe 0.5 ED or 1.0 EOD

This isn't a final decision i'm just thinking out loud, i still have to do more research on both tren and deca and also on EQ and caber.

My buddy is sticking with the deca so it could be intesesting to start at the same time, train together and log results!


#9

If you decide to go with Test prop/tren/masteron stack, you can drop back the Test to 70mg, tren to 40mg daily. Prop@ 100mg, require a bit more estrogen control. Where tp/ta/dp stack would be a little tighter, more androgenic. But i think MPB risk is going to be high.

TP 100 + TA 50 ED for lean mass
TA 70 + TA 40 + DP 50 for super lean mass, maybe a tad too androgenic for some people.

Brook, I feel that supressed libido will be benificial to training. When i am going through high volume/high intensity/peaking phases with PED, the last thing i need is distraction, women and sex. I'd rather meditate and watch training videos instead. That's why i keep my estrogen in the high-normal range to keep libido down.
But,yeah, for those that want to fuck around (pun intended), don't use deca.


#10

Well considering i'm recently single after 2 years, i plan on sowing many wild oats this winter!!

I'm having trouble searching the forum, i'm living in the uk now and i'm in a universaty now and it has this site blocked. I'm on it using a proxy but i cant use the search function or send a private message!


#11

Update:
I have Decided to go with TP/TA/DP for 8 weeks.
W1-8 Test Prop 70mgED
W1-8 Tren Ace 40mgED
W1-8 Mast Prop 50mgED

My buddy has decided to stick with the Test and Deca. He has no internet access and his only source of information is an old school gym rat! So i will be researching his cycle too but he will have the final decision.
W1-10 Test E 500mg/week
W1-7/8 Deca 300mg/week

I have been researching non stop but still have a few questions for you guys.

Cabergoline:
I have been researching this and will recommend my friend to run it at 0.5mg 2x week during the deca cycle. Starting at week 1 and running until week 10.
Do you need to run adex/letro with caber?

Tren cycle, would it be advisable to run caber at the same dosages with the tren? Is it needed, and if not will it hurt to run it if it is not 'needed'?

I have been reading about cabergoline all day and one thing that kept popping up and really interested me was its effect on the male sex drive. I would love to run it if it increased my sex drive. Here is one link i found about caber and sex:

http://www.cabergoline.org/

Hcg:
My friend is not in the position to run hcg as he lives with family and cannot store it in the family fridge. I know hcg is recommended by some for a deca cycle, but is it needed for my tren cycle? I wasn't going to run it, but i have some left over from an earlier cycle so i might run it anyway, or else save it for a future cycle.


#12

HCG is not something that is recommended for deca cycles nor tren.. it is recommended for suppression.

So it will assist recovery and also make a cycle more enjoyable sexually and gains wise too IME - but is not a necessity.

Adex is not needed for caber (?) but it is needed for Test. (you should not need caber for tren - although seeing as estrogen increases prolactin anyway - it never hurts in any cycle)


#13

I meant does running caber stop the need to run adex also? I dont know much about caber and dont know does it act an an AI also.


#14

Caber is not an AI.
Caber works on prolactin issues.
Adex, aromasin, letro (AI) works on estrogen issues.
They are not interchangeable.