T Nation

T3 Stack


#1

hi i want use t3 boost my fat loss i know that t3 without aas **ed up muscles so my question is coz i dnt want use aas right now can i stack t3 with hcg for not lost muscles or sarm like ostarine or something light(from roids)


#2

Yes, definitely it can be stacked with HCG.

If comparing at dosing giving same anabolic effect, I don’t think SARMs are “lighter” than anabolic steroids.

On thyroid questions, a fair bit is here (you can start halfway down the article, at Thyroid Hormone Products): https://www.T-Nation.com/diet-fat-loss/what-you-dont-know-about-your-thyroid

The earlier part is diet etc which you could skip over if desired.


#3

thank u, but how much hcg for 75mg t3 for not have problems with muscle loss


#4

HCG and T3 really should be thought of separately.

T3 at up to 50 mcg/day generally is not a real issue for muscle loss.

HCG may boost testosterone substantially above where your present value is, unless your present value is at the very high end of normal, in which case the boost might be small, but the need also small. This could give you an edge over the T3 alone. Good example amounts are 250 IU every other day, or 500 IU three times a week.

If your T3 is an UG product then while it might have been dosed honestly and correctly at the time of manufacture, what people receive is often underdoses. Many of them on board and post about using 100 mcg T3/day, or even 150. But this will not be the actual amount they are using, and if you dose with such actual amounts you will be going too high. At 100 mcg/day genuine product, you’d have substantial muscle loss regardless of HCG and very substantially elevated hear rate as well.

Even 75 mcg/day T3 is substantially catabolic and raised heart rate quite a bit, for example 10 beats a minute or more, and doesn’t give that huge a fat loss advantage over 50 mcg/day, especially as training tends to be impaired.


#5

Do all users exp increased hr? Because im on 63.5mcg daily along with other things and havent experienced increased hr. But im doing over an hr of cardio a dayy. Its abbott t3 so i assume its the real deal


#6

#7

At 62.5 mcg you’re just edging (so to speak) past 50 mcg, so it’s quite possible that effect on heart rate is unnoticeable or not occurring.


#8

[quote]Bill Roberts wrote:
At 62.5 mcg you’re just edging (so to speak) past 50 mcg, so it’s quite possible that effect on heart rate is unnoticeable or not occurring.[/quote]

Ok thanks bill. And what is 50mcg, is that a normal replacement dose?


#9

In bodybuilding use, 50 mcg/day typically gives slightly supraphysiological levels; for medical use T3 is rarely used alone for thyroid replacement.


#10

[quote]Bill Roberts wrote:
In bodybuilding use, 50 mcg/day typically gives slightly supraphysiological levels; for medical use T3 is rarely used alone for thyroid replacement.[/quote]

Ahh ok gotcha. Thanks


#11

[quote]eatliftsleep wrote:

[quote]Bill Roberts wrote:
At 62.5 mcg you’re just edging (so to speak) past 50 mcg, so it’s quite possible that effect on heart rate is unnoticeable or not occurring.[/quote]

Ok thanks bill. And what is 50mcg, is that a normal replacement dose?
[/quote]

i read an article that said most healthy adults have about 100 mcg of T3/T4 in their bodies at a given time. and typically, T3/T4 is at a 1:4 ratio…

that number seems kinda vague, though, and i would suspect there’s a great deal of variation.


#12

i think it’s worth noting that there was a study that showed 100 mcg of T3 increases beta-2 receptor density 60% or so in a couple weeks.

^while that might be too high of a dose for some guys, combining T3 with clen is obviously gonna accelerate fat loss and clen can minimize the catabolism from T3


#13

[quote]cycobushmaster wrote:
i think it’s worth noting that there was a study that showed 100 mcg of T3 increases beta-2 receptor density 60% or so in a couple weeks.

^while that might be too high of a dose for some guys, combining T3 with clen is obviously gonna accelerate fat loss and clen can minimize the catabolism from T3[/quote]

I had no idea clen was anabolic? Or are you saying you can stack with t3 therefore using less t3 making it less catabolic?


#14

cycobushmaster

T3 treatment produced significant losses in both lean mass (1.5 �?�± 0.3 kg) and fat mass (2.7 �?�± 0.4 kg) by 6 weeks, with similar reductions in both at 9 weeks. The high fat diet somewhat attenuated the loss of body fat. Nitrogen balance was significantly negative for the first 3 weeks of T3 treatment, but tended to return to baseline thereafter

so from research if i get it right its better if i dnt want lose a lot of muscle i will run only 50 mcg for 6 weeks?


#15

Research supports that dosage but would not be my reason. The reason is practical bodybuilding experience.

The length can be longer than that. I prefer limiting to 8 weeks but for balanced view, I’m constantly called conservative or incorrect on that. However with really extended suppression, there indeed is a tendency to recover at least at first to low normal rather than midnormal levels. Certainly there have been fast and full recoveries on for example 10 weeks, but I don’t know if that’s 100% of the time or an “often” percentage. Eight weeks seems to be 100%.


#16

[quote]amateur666 wrote:
cycobushmaster

T3 treatment produced significant losses in both lean mass (1.5 �??�?�± 0.3 kg) and fat mass (2.7 �??�?�± 0.4 kg) by 6 weeks, with similar reductions in both at 9 weeks. The high fat diet somewhat attenuated the loss of body fat. Nitrogen balance was significantly negative for the first 3 weeks of T3 treatment, but tended to return to baseline thereafter

so from research if i get it right its better if i dnt want lose a lot of muscle i will run only 50 mcg for 6 weeks?[/quote]

yeah, sorry, i forgot to type anything with that…

that study shows what one can expect with T3 only at that dose. like Bill said, a lower dose should facilitate fat loss while minimize muscle loss…


#17

[quote]eatliftsleep wrote:

[quote]cycobushmaster wrote:
i think it’s worth noting that there was a study that showed 100 mcg of T3 increases beta-2 receptor density 60% or so in a couple weeks.

^while that might be too high of a dose for some guys, combining T3 with clen is obviously gonna accelerate fat loss and clen can minimize the catabolism from T3[/quote]

I had no idea clen was anabolic? Or are you saying you can stack with t3 therefore using less t3 making it less catabolic?
[/quote]

i believe beta-2 agonists are anabolic. normally we think of them stimulating the beta-2 receptors in fat (thereby causing lipolysis), but they also stimulate the beta-2 receptors in muscle, as well…

http://physrev.physiology.org/content/88/2/729


#18

[quote]cycobushmaster wrote:

[quote]eatliftsleep wrote:

[quote]cycobushmaster wrote:
i think it’s worth noting that there was a study that showed 100 mcg of T3 increases beta-2 receptor density 60% or so in a couple weeks.

^while that might be too high of a dose for some guys, combining T3 with clen is obviously gonna accelerate fat loss and clen can minimize the catabolism from T3[/quote]

I had no idea clen was anabolic? Or are you saying you can stack with t3 therefore using less t3 making it less catabolic?
[/quote]

i believe beta-2 agonists are anabolic. normally we think of them stimulating the beta-2 receptors in fat (thereby causing lipolysis), but they also stimulate the beta-2 receptors in muscle, as well…

http://physrev.physiology.org/content/88/2/729

[/quote]

Hmm very interesting. My coach has me running a low to moderate dose of clen going on 10 weeks now. But the most common way i see people using it is a two week on two off protocol. Do you have an opinion on which way is more effective?


#19

[quote]eatliftsleep wrote:

[quote]cycobushmaster wrote:

[quote]eatliftsleep wrote:

[quote]cycobushmaster wrote:
i think it’s worth noting that there was a study that showed 100 mcg of T3 increases beta-2 receptor density 60% or so in a couple weeks.

^while that might be too high of a dose for some guys, combining T3 with clen is obviously gonna accelerate fat loss and clen can minimize the catabolism from T3[/quote]

I had no idea clen was anabolic? Or are you saying you can stack with t3 therefore using less t3 making it less catabolic?
[/quote]

i believe beta-2 agonists are anabolic. normally we think of them stimulating the beta-2 receptors in fat (thereby causing lipolysis), but they also stimulate the beta-2 receptors in muscle, as well…

http://physrev.physiology.org/content/88/2/729

[/quote]

Hmm very interesting. My coach has me running a low to moderate dose of clen going on 10 weeks now. But the most common way i see people using it is a two week on two off protocol. Do you have an opinion on which way is more effective?
[/quote]

well, the beta receptors get down regulated pretty quick. it’s debatable to how fast, but that’s the reason for the 2 on, 2 off protocol. otherwise, you could take some ketotifen at night, which should prevent this desensitization.

T3 can also help, as it increases the number of beta-2 receptors…

how much are you taking right now?


#20

[quote]cycobushmaster wrote:

[quote]eatliftsleep wrote:

[quote]cycobushmaster wrote:

[quote]eatliftsleep wrote:

[quote]cycobushmaster wrote:
i think it’s worth noting that there was a study that showed 100 mcg of T3 increases beta-2 receptor density 60% or so in a couple weeks.

^while that might be too high of a dose for some guys, combining T3 with clen is obviously gonna accelerate fat loss and clen can minimize the catabolism from T3[/quote]

I had no idea clen was anabolic? Or are you saying you can stack with t3 therefore using less t3 making it less catabolic?
[/quote]

i believe beta-2 agonists are anabolic. normally we think of them stimulating the beta-2 receptors in fat (thereby causing lipolysis), but they also stimulate the beta-2 receptors in muscle, as well…

http://physrev.physiology.org/content/88/2/729

[/quote]

Hmm very interesting. My coach has me running a low to moderate dose of clen going on 10 weeks now. But the most common way i see people using it is a two week on two off protocol. Do you have an opinion on which way is more effective?
[/quote]

well, the beta receptors get down regulated pretty quick. it’s debatable to how fast, but that’s the reason for the 2 on, 2 off protocol. otherwise, you could take some ketotifen at night, which should prevent this desensitization.

T3 can also help, as it increases the number of beta-2 receptors…

how much are you taking right now?
[/quote]

Right now we have slowly tapered up to 80mcg. Im also on 62.5mcg t3. So nothing crazy and it seems to be doing its job. Ive never really gotten the shakes or anything from the clen. Just a few headaches in the beginning. So you think taking some ketotifen will be beneficial?