T-Supplementation for Non-Healing Back Injury?

Thanks. Can u explain what you mean by feeling off? What did you take ? For how long ? How log did it take before you felt relief? What problem did you have with your back?
Thx

Thanks ! How do I find his YouTube video ? Thanks for being willing to help

It’s at the Trt & Horemone Optimization channel on youtube.

Nandrolone is know to have neurological impacts. My emotional state was impacted as well as manifesting in erectile dysfunction that took months to clear up.

Is deca available in Canada? If so, is it branded or generic/compounded

I got it UGL for my experiment… I don’t believe you can get a prescription for it.

Sorry for your pain and spine problems.
I have been and am where you are, for many many decades.
(2 spine surgeries, fusion, neuropathy, degenerative discs, etc)

Random considerations and suggestions:

  1. Stop what you are doing. Avoid flareups and let your spine rest. This is not muscle so protocols for that are out.
  2. Advice from those without your problem does not always apply.
  3. Do you have a current MRI and diagnostics from a spine surgeon, neurologist? (a must).
  4. Get with a doc, not GP, to get you into a “rehab” program with proper evaluations. Not physical therapy or gym. Your protocols are more similar to post-op spine surgery and recovery vs other.
    The rehab program will be designed and supervised around “your” spine and core condition, then monitored so you are not overdoing it. This is not the place for a “gym mentality”. If you do things wrong, you might end up with disc rupture, nerve impingement, paralysis, or spine surgery. (been there) So, medical supervision is a must.
  5. RX supervision is a must. Be careful with analgesics, pain killers, etc, to mask symptoms. Overuse of CoxxII inhibitors ie: ibup. etc. Also, RX supervision for prednisone, etc. and proper med advice a must.
  6. Lab tests and supervision, endo doc, etc, to see if your “T” levels are low, also other such as HGH, etc. “IF” your levels are extremely low, then you will have a hard time with PT recovery, healing, core tone to protect your spine, etc. So, see your doc and get tested. Do things correctly.

(I am a lot older than you with lot’s of athletic spine damage and so forth. T levels and other levels were rock bottom so now am under the care of several docs due to degenerative spine, with compromised healing and recovery and inability to sustain Rehab programs. So, now trying TRT and HGH therapies, including “T”, Sermorelin, and HGA?C, trials, not all at once. I’m back on rehab every 2 days and am feeling better than in decades. Am hopeful. But, all this under doc supervision and scheduled tests.)
8.
Emphasis: Seek the right docs for your condition. Then do things right step by step. Avoid pain and reinjury. More is not better.
Avoid docs that simply give you more meds or send you back to PT or the gym. You have to find the right guys/docs that will work with you long term.
9. The above is based on a more “worse case scenario” POV.
10. There are many ways to approach this and many individual experiences and professions. Thus, seek medical input from your docs.

Good luck.

As a physical therapist i pretty much disagree with everything in this thread. First fire your PT, to tell you to stop all activity except those three exercises is ludacris. I tell patients everyday to stay as active as you can without increasing symptoms. Sternal crunches, side planks, and bird dogs is some of the most cookie cutter crap i have heard.

The poster who said no PT and get an MRI, i am sure you mean well, but this is terrible advice. Early imaging sets up for worse outcome.
All studies into pain science show this. You stretching your back did not cause your symptoms or cause any degeneration.

You need to have a PT who will look at you globally. Look at your gait, balance, motion of the ankles, hips, lumbar and t spine. They need to check tension in your hamstrings, deep him rotators, hip flexors, it bands. They need to check your strength from abs down. They need to ask you a lot of questions. They need to prescribe exercises for your specific deficts. These may increase pain slightly and temporarily. As i said stay as active as you can.

If you need non opoid analgesics its fine temporarily. If it allows you to complete PT with less symptoms its fine. Just dont let an MD use it forever or as stand alone. Sometimes an epidural, prednisone shot or pills are required to ease inflammation. The worst thing you can do is rest completely.

That being said. Nandrolone could help increase facet joint fluid and possibly decrease symptoms. But its a huge if. Probably not worth the attempt unless a fusion is on the table

While I have no data backing this. TRT has seemed to heal my back to about 80%

My right hip socket never fully formed I have strict instructions from my doctor to not bend over 90 degrees or attempt to stretch that area because it is a physical impediment.

Before this was diagnosed, I injured my back from weightlifting. It turned out that any exercises requiring to bend past 90 degrees (ie front squats and deadlifts) caused me to slightly twist my spine and shift all the weight onto my low back. The exercises started to wear down my back until one day it gave out when I was changing the oil on my truck. My back gave out about twice a week for a few months. I stopped weighting for about a full year, and it improved to about 40%. I started TRT and my back improved to 80+% in a matter of months.

There could be many other factors to what caused the healing, but I feel that TRT did help.

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The only safe analgesic is HeRoIn (jokes)…

Thank you all for your comments.

My PT program is walking, cat-camel stretch, clam shells, all of which are done daily, and a milder version of the McGill Big-3 ever third day.

I avoid opioids unless I really need them and then only use small doses. I commonly use Tylenol and Flexaril , sometimes ibuprofen 400mg.

For the man who said TRT got you to 80%, what form of TRT did you use?

I find walking up slopes and stairs are difficult and can trigger pain flares if I go too fast. So I have to go slow. I’m flexion intolerant and have to be careful twisting. I really need to get better for many reasons. Believe me, I’m desperate.

Thanks, and zi welcome additional comments.

Kevin

I’m not much of a fan of cat camel at all. I dont use it with anyone. Are you doing modified planks or regressing bird dogs? Both? Is there any pain down your legs? If so is it both? Numbness tingling? Is pain straight across your back or on one side only? Is your therapist doing any manual therapy? If they aren’t seriously find a new PT. A good PT will be using eclectic approach using exercise, manual therapy and emphasing self efficacy while minimizing fear.

Edit. Sorry saw it was regressed. How do you tolerate the regressed exercises?

Thank you for your comments.

I do the bird dogs standing. When I was trying to do the full bird dogs in the quadruped position in April of last year it would hurt more because my muscles where we can painful. so we switch to just having me fully extending my arm in quadruped position and just barely lifting my leg off the ground. Then my physical therapist switch to just having me do the bird dogs in the standing position, and at least this way I can fully extend my leg and get some gluteus contraction. The planks I do against the wall. The curl ups are done as described by Dr. McGill

I do not push the end range of motion on the cat camel exercise, rather I play in the middle and only do about six or seven repetitions. I walk every day usually twice a day, not including the walking that I do around work. I get up out of the chair about every 30 minutes to walk somewhere between three and five minutes, so that totals about three walks per day. I go a little easier on the weekends. I forgot to mention that I also do a face poll exercise where I really try to use my rhomboids and other back muscles to pull on the elastic band.

No, right now he is not doing any manual therapy. I have a friend who is a licensed massage therapist, and he massages my back about once every three weeks.

I’ve been doing the physical therapy now for about nine months, and though I am somewhat better, I am far from normal. I do not understand why my back is not healing, and why I continue to have flares. I am not doing anything excessive in my exercise or my daily activities; I am very careful with movements. But sometimes even seemingly minor movements like twisting can trigger a flare. This is why I have been thinking about the possibility of using testosterone replacement therapy to hasten healing of the soft tissues (muscles, tendons, ligaments). I can’t go on in this debilitated condition. I have a family to support and two children about to start college. I don’t want to miss my child’s high school graduation ceremony coming up in about for five months. I need to be able to sit in a relatively unsupported chair for several hours. Everyone knows how long high school graduation ceremonies go on for. I can’t visit my age and parents will live about four hours from me because I can’t tolerate that long in the car. I find it difficult to walk up sloped roads and stairs.

The pain is usually across my back. I feel it most acutely in the deep intrinsic muscles of my back, the multifidi, the lower arrector spniae and the QLs . some days my back is relatively quiet, but still feels weak; then other days it flares up and it hurts more. When my back first went out on me in January of last year I had some radicular pain in my right leg and some in my left but this has largely faded. I occasionally feel some numbness in my right foot but this is not persistent. Small dose of a muscle relaxer usually calms my back, which makes me think that this is more of a soft tissue issue than a bony issue. My imaging does not show any fractures, avulsion’s, or other serious musculoskeletal pathology on my spine. I can sleep at night, and mostly in the morning I do not feel pain. It’s after I get up and start moving around the pain slowly sets in.

Any recommendations would be greatly appreciated.

Did they measure your hip mobility? Look at how you walk? Did they look at your thoracic spine. If you are tight in these areas your lumbar spine compensates. The fact you have some tingling in your foot indicates nerve involvement. The spasms are likely a protective reaction. You can try some nerve glides to improve nerve irritation. Other than that its rough handing out exercises without knowing your deficits is hard and a good PT does do cookie cutter. Problem with PT that are certified in something is that they cant move away from it. Mcgill stuff is obviously not going super great. Maybe some McKenzie stuff would work. Maybe some moblizations to your hips and spine. Maybe just getting up and doing stuff will help. I try to tell PT students to learn all of it but don’t lock into to any of it. You cant let yourself get down. Stress and depression actually increase pain.

Hips were checked, and were a bit right but otherwise OK I do march steps before walking to loosen up . I can add hip circles. T-spine OK with no arthritis, just get spasms along the erectors and multifidi. I did nerve flossing last year and may do it again. I keep flaring and can’t go a week without one. If I cloud keep the flares at bay, I could make progress on the big-3

So nothing for hip strength other than clams. The standing bird dog does not work your core and barely touches your glutes. Your t spine not being arthritic is not exactly what i meant. T spines are almost never arthritic. That doesn’t mean its not insanely stiff. You lumbar erectors are probably weak and trying desperately to dynamically control your spine during all movement and spasming down in the process. Its appalling how many PT forget the lumbar erectors are part of the core and need strengthening, especially in population that sits a lot.

Man i would still say find another PT. I dont understand regressing you to standing bird dog when a dead bug or posterior tilt may get you activating your core. I can only assume they are locked into their certification

Thanks. My T-spine is a bit stiff at this point, but when I was first assessed, I was told I had good ROM.
I can do a full quadruped bird dog, but my low back hurts a lot the following day, not my upper back I was doing the bird dog in the quadruped position. and just lifting my leg off the floor, which was not painful, but it does not allow for glute activation. At least the standing bird dog allows for some glute activation which I desperately need. My glutes are weak.

I agree that my lumbar erectors are Working hard and my multifidi are off-line. It’s hard to stand. People tell me I’m using my back too much when I stand.

I was doing a modification of a lying side plank wheee you lie on the floor on your side and lift both legs together. I was doing those but they hurt too, because my back is weak and sore , so we regressed to wall planks. I don’t understand why my back has not healed after all this time. Hence my consideration of TRT

When my back can handle it, we will start hip bridges.

Are you a PT or trainer? I’d like to send someone who is some videos of me standing and doing the big 3 to see if I am doing them correctly. I understand that it would not be a legal opinion, just a friendly opinion. Actually, I’d like to get as many opinions as I can on my standing.

I’ve lost a hell of a lot of muscle mass over the ost year, and I’ve gained weight.

Thank you all,

Kevin

Well you have lots to gain and little to lose if you began a low 100mg Test a week protocol. You cant be anyones patient here. So its up to you to decide whether or not you want to give it a shot, not up to a bunch of guys on the web. I chose to, and everyone else in here did to. Some against our GPs wishes. So go ahead and be the teacher, the student, and the guinea pig. We are all responsible for our health. I wish you the best. You could come out on top once you have your levels checked.

thank you. I’m getting my levels checked today.

Great, let us know what your test results are and keep it very simple. If you qualify, you can begin a new chapter in your life, and hopefully you can gain some control. That in itself can be healing. You may regain some strength and your mind may find some inner peace too. But this is not pain management. Baby steps. I began my journey as a weaker version of myself. Test has definitely enhanced me. My appearance is changing and my thoughts are healthier. Depression is gone, and with clarity comes a better life. It has been helping me connect with my body, and muscle/mind connection is now a thing for me. It takes time. I have lots to grow still. Hoping you get some relief!