T Nation

T Dosage Based on Workout?



I have a question. let's say I am on Test Prop 100mg, 1mL E3D cycle. Will I get any benefice to increase the intake before a rough work out (let's say on legs day). I mean, could I inject 1.5 or 2 mL the day before the workout, the same day of the work out or the day after the workout? Or is it just not directly related?



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BBB, you are not wrong, even if I read a lot, I still need to read more on esters.

I take note on your proposition for doing ED instead of E3D for test P. What concerns me a lot is that I have a personal trainer that I trust, and he suggested me 2 times per week for test P (he did not want me to do water retention) and I brought it to E3D by myself, so I'll have to adjust.

My cycle is like this

Start date is May 1st

Test P 100mg E3D (ethylformate)
Winstrol 50mg E2D
Equipoise 250mg 2 time per week

Proposed PCT is HCG 2,500 ui E4D (4 doses)

On top of that I have HGH 3.3 ui per day (6 days per week)

I am 39 yo, 280lbs, 24%BF

Any advice ill be greatly appreciated, it is still time to adjust.

Thanks in advance



You're making a mistake if you trust this trainer. Just because someone does something one way and it seems to work ok, doesn't mean that it's the intelligent approach. That prop/water retention explanation... well, what can I say but please do some reading here. Punch in some numbers on roidcalc (website) and look at the levels in your system with a 3 day injection scheme.

Pick up an AI to run on cycle to control bloat (and other estro-related sides), and get a SERM (nolva, torem, clomid) for PCT. Unfortunately, with your bodyfat, an AI could be quite important. Maybe the winny helps out with these sides, maybe not. Winny is kind of funny that way, but you shouldn't be relying on it in that sense. Btw, ideally you should drop 10% or so off of your current bodyfat before cycling, but it's your call obviously.

As for the use of hCG in PCT, many have done it before and many still do, but you're far, far better off using it on cycle at lower doses (250 IU e3d or so, starting a few weeks into the cycle) to prevent your testes from totally shutting down production, than you are to using it as a recovery tool after the fact.

Please read the stickies and some of the proposed cycles in various threads in this forum, and then hit us up with follow up questions.

Oops - just saw that you said start date was May 1. Well, get yourself that SERM asap.


whew ya you definitely need some adjusting... your PCT consists of just HCG...thats bad for a few reasons if using HCG it needs to be used DURING cycle not after. you have any nolva or clomid? as BBB said the prop needs to be shot EOD at LEAST if not ED enanthate could be shot E3D not Prop. are you using inject or oral winny? either way ED dosing for that also. how long is your cycle? as i have a feeling not long enough to take advantage of the EQ especially with out a frontload.


I use injectable Winny. thanks for your advice really appreciated


DITCH that trainer NOW. Shit man - kills me to hear this shit.

Prop has a half life of 2 days.. so how on earth can 2x/wk injects or even 3x/wk injects be frequent enough to keep levels near peak dosage??! They cant.

EOD is the bare minimum frequency for a propionate ester.. and it is worth noting here that the more frequently one injects the less water they will retain! Bonus eh?
PM me if you want a detailed explaination on why - i cant be fucked right now.
If you used 500mg/wk instead of 300mg plus the eq and winny, you would see more results and little extra water - as long as you inject daily (75mg/day) and use an Aromatase Inhibitor... FYI.

Winstrol NEEDS to be injected daily too.. it is esterless and rapidly absorbed.

HCG used after a cycle at that dose will further inhibit recovery and is COUNTER PRODUCTIVE TO YOUR GOAL OF FAST RECOVERY! Sad that a guy like your trainer gets business.

Wait till i get my site up and running...



I used prop as a preworkout aid, personally I wouldn't consider it the backbone of a bulker. Cyp or enanthate would be my choice E3D or EOD.


Actually Winstrol suspension, injected IM, is active for several days. There is no ester, but it takes time for the particles to dissolve.

Still, as a good dose is 50 mg/day, daily injection of 1 mL with insulin syringe is good. If for some reason one wanted very light use, that would still be every other day.


You should read the sticky in the steroids section of this forum titled "Steroid Newbie Cycle Planning". Your cycle isn't so bad it won't work at all, but with even 10 minutes of research, you could do much better.

1) higher test -- 500 mg/week is recommended,
2) if you're taking eq, I presume your cycle is at least 8 weeks long, so why not use test-e rather than test-p?
3) You need Nolvadex during PCT. HCG is optional, but Nolvadex (or Clomid) is essential. And if you use HCG, it needs be taken before PCT, not during.
4) You should be taking an AI, such as Arimidex along with your cycle. It's risky not too. You might be fine, but you easily could end up with man boobs.

Good luck.


Fair enough - and thanks Bill. I had used it in a EOD fashion based on reading that exact thing in the past (simply that it can be dosed EOD), however it has always been all but useless. I honestly have never noticed ANY strength or other benefits under 50mg/day.
This is NOT when it was used alone i might add, it was when it is stacked - it is a relatively mild drug when used in the shadow of test, deca or drol - which have always been run alongside..

Maybe i should try 50-100mg/day on its own.

I did think that oral Winstrol half life was 9 hours.. is the suspension different in its release?