T-dawg Problems and frustrations please HELP

Damnit all, it seems like every diet i try it never works for me, i need help here first ill give you back ground, im 6’0, 257.5 down from 268, i went from 31% BF to between 27-28%, im using 4ad-ec and have been for most of the six weeks at reccomended dose,MD6 as reccomended, T2 original as directed, and 11-15 grams of fish oil a day. I started consuming between 2800-3000 cals and didnt lose anything but the initial water weight, then dropped it to about 2400-2500 and still no avail, now i am at between 1700-1900 and im still losing less than a pound a week, and im out of options to do and don’t know what to do, Ive been doing this for 6 weeks roughly and have only lost 11 pounds,6-7 of which were the initial water weight lost, Ive been doing the 12 weeks to SS for these six weeks as well as cardio 3-4 times a week at High intensity, I have been following the t-Dawg 2.0 diet rules for the past 2 weeks my carbs are usually 60 on non-WO days and 100 on workout days, my protein has been roughly between 215-230 a day, my fat content has not been above 100 grams a day for the majority of these weeks (first few it was, when i was trying to adjust) Most of my fats are from fish oil and nuts, all lean proteins I have been eating no ground beef unless it is 7-8% fat. from my calculations i Have gained a little over 2.5 lbs of LBM, and i have no clue what to do now i can go any lower with my calories, i dont know what to do, evenm my cheat days aren’t a pig out fest all day, And even if they were this would not even come close to affecting my humungous calorie deficit
that I have Each day, I am getting very jealous, My GF has been losing 3-5 lbs a week on BFL and I am Thinking of switching and eating my own words(I have trashed talked it all the time ;). Because she has been having good luck with it. Also My measurements on my waist and other problem areas have not gone down more than an inch this whole time I have been using this diet. I dont Know what to do it seems like its a neverending battle and i have lost alot of steam and momentum because im so frustrated. Can anyone please help me here i really need to figure out WTF is going wrong in my program. Also for the past 1.5 weeks i have been increasing calories every third day like Chris suggests. Please help Chris preferably…

Well I’m not Chris, but as a ‘hard-loser’ I’d consider a pound of weight-loss per week to be GOOD. What you have to wonder is how much muscle your girlfriend is losing along with her fat. I definitely wouldn’t drop your calories any further, it will most likely lower your metabolism and set you up for a fat rebound.

You’re losing fat and gaining muscle at the same time (albeit slowly). Um, I don’t see a problem with this.

I didn’t quite explain everything, it seems that all I am doing is losing and regaining water weight each cheat day i Have,i gain water weight and then lose it then i am back at the same weight I was before, my weight rarely changes by a half pound each week and i just consider this scale discrepencie cause the damn thing gives me a different reading each time, so i dont know , This rate is just too slow in My opinion, .5 pound a week just isn’t cutting it, cause I have forty more to go and im not gonna take 80 weeks to lose this weight, givin don’t you all think that 4 pounds in six weeks is a little too slow, 2 a week i would be happy or even 1.5 a week i would be happy, im going off of 4-ad-ec today cause i ran out, im not sure i gained any muscle thats just by my calculations. you all can workout my numbers and see how much muscle gain that is. But .5 lb a week is too slow when im trying to lose 40 pounds, just too long, and considering my severe calorie restriction i should have lost alot more than that a week in my opinion.

Have you checked your insulin sensativity via the tests in Eating massive? You may be the type of person who would do best on a diet like don’t diet.

Are you sure you’re following the T-dawg diet to a T? Writing down all your meals? Doing cardio a couple times a week (3-5)? Stop the cheat days. Reward yourself with a cheat day every time you lose 5% bodyfat or something, just don’t do it every week. You can have ONE meal, ONE day a week, where you “cheat”, but make it a “strict cheat”. Remember, everytime you go off your diet, you’re only hurting yourself. Good luck.

Well I do use a cheat day but if u read my post, with this calori deficit having a huge cheat day won’t make any difference, IM consuming about 1900 cals a day and My metabolic rate including all activities is between 4500 and 4800, so if you do the math even if i consume 5000 cals on my cheat day that will still be a little over 2 lbs of fat loss a week but it doesn’t appear that way, BTW knuckledragger could you direct me to that acrticle i could not find it with the search engine.


Strength Training, Bodybuilding & Online Supplement Store - T NATION should have a link to that article.


You might want to try uping your carb level, normally this level should be twice your protien intake level. I am getting ready for a contest in Nov. I’m at 8% targeting 3.4-4%, comp weight. I am 6’3" 233 and intake 4500 cal/day, 600g of carbs/day. With that I do cardo every day, my BF is melting off. My point is that your body might be using more complex forms for energy, ie. protien and not the ideal form, carbs. The fact that you are still gaining LBM is a good sign, your not over training, but you might want to try slowly adding some carbs to your deit and see what effect is has.


Chris could you give me your take on this, i need an opinion from the author himself.C


This Progam Will GUARANTEE to bust you past any plateau: Eliminate All protein Powders Instead Pre and Post workout 10g BCAA, and 10g L glutamine, Drop Protein to 1 g per lb of LBM, Total calories 8 per lb of lbm, Metldown training I @ 4 days a week with 30 min Low intensity Teadmill after, and on off days Fat to fire agility Drills before eating in the AM. Take MD6 4 -6 a day with Green TEA, Use Powerdrive T2PRO 3* a day, and low dose Mag 10 or Androsol,or 4ad and ZMA, Multi vitamin, extra pottasium postworkout as well, between meals snack on Beverly Internationals Mass Aminos, or Liver Pills 10-20 a day. Forget about carb ups until your 8%. Or if your strength is absolutely dropping Have 2 carb Meals Postworkout 1 day a week thats it OR My Preference All YOU CAN EAT SUSHI One other thing eliminate all hormone meats, use grass fed beef, and consume buffalo at least once a day, ass well as wild Salmon (I like Trader Joes canned alaskan salmon, and omega 3 eggs. Make sure to get 2 salads a day with lemon juice, for fats Flax, and Pumkin Seeds,or Olives. Good luck there is NO option for failure on this program. Have fun getting ripped-TAPPER

You may want to eliminate all breads, cereals and pastas from diet. I would also do away with any and ALL dairy products as well…next get rid of all foods with high fructose corn sweeteners (sodas, candies, cakes, some fruit juices). In essence, you need a whole raw fruit and vegitable diet with protien from chicken, fish and beef…stay away from pork! there was a fructose article in the t-mag somewhere around here…do a search and read it. You need energy from non-insulin dependant sources (fruit and veggies)only!..and you need it in small amounts throughout the day…
Also, at your size, your just going to be bigger than most…but you can get the fat % down…I have faith in ya bud! Keep going, dont give up.

I haven’t been consuming any carbs like that my only carbs in the day are 2 salads and gatorade after my WO, i don’t understand why with my cals that low i am losing weight so slowly. Chris Shugart, could you help me out on this.


It’s difficult to address situations like this because I’m not in your shoes and don’t know all the details. Over the years I’ve ran into a handful of people who seem to be doing everything right and yet aren’t losing weight (or in your case, are making progress but very slowly.) Usually there is something the person is missing or overlooking. They are focusing on the minor details and missing something huge. For example, I worked with one person through e-mail who had this problem and after about five exchanges we finally figured it out. He was drinking soft drinks, non-diet. “Liquids count, too?” he asked. Sheesh! Another person I was helping out kept telling me how hard he trained but wasn’t making progress so we worked on his diet. I finally asked him to define hard training and he let me know he was “power walking.” Dude wasn’t even lifting weights! (This is why I never take a person for their word when they say things like “My diet and training are in check.” That could mean the Slim Fast plan and a BowFlex for all I know!) Another example is the college guy who doesn’t count his weekend beer benders as part of his diet.

Now, I know you’re not doing something as silly as that, but there could be something you’re overlooking. I think it was Berardi who said that eating reduced calories and training and yet not making progress is just against the laws of thermodynamics.

So, a few possibilities: 1) You may simply be the type of person who does better on low fat, higher carb diets. In that case, go for the “Don’t Diet” plan. See the Essential Berardi article at T-mag for tips and links. 2) You’ve dropped calories too low and your body is in “emergency mode” i.e. it thinks you’re starving so it’s hanging on to the fat. 3) You’re making crappy food choices. Again, talking to Berardi, he said most people that say his diets don’t work for them are making poor food choices when their diets are examined closely. You know, like eating Frosted Flakes and calling it a P+C meal. 4) As mentioned above, you’re missing something big in your plan. 5) You’ve written on this forum before that it’s “impossible” for you to keep a food log. Has that changed? If not, your numbers could be off.

Of course, these are just guesses.

First, I think you need to use better measurements. You seem really iffy about how much you’re losing and/or gaining. Maybe I missed it, but are you checking body fat percentage? The scale alone can be a real motivation killer sometimes since muscle gain along with the fat loss won’t show up. Be sure and read “Body Comp for Beginners” by Jason Norcross at T-mag. I would also take photos or video monthly.

The only other thing I can think of is that you have some type of medical problem. A person just does not eat below maintenance calories, exercise regularily, and not lose fat. Something is off. This is the second thread you’ve started about not being able to lose weight. Last time you were using the “Winning Formula” I think.

Honestly though, I doubt it’s a medical issue. It could be as simple as taking poor measurements and getting in too big of a hurry.

One more thing, how’s your fiber intake? This is very important, especially on a lower carb, fat loss plan. Supplement with fiber (the plain unflavored husk kind), use some probiotics, and/or eat some veggies. Celery is low carb and really keeps things running smoothly.

Maybe I’ve keyed into the something here. Good luck.

Pugs, I feel for you. I was over 235 (and this was after going vegan) with a bodyfat in the 18% range (probably higher)… But your best bet is to first of all ditch the gatorade… you don’t really need it unless you are seriously dehydrating yourself that much in the gym. Second of all, 6 weeks isn’t that long but you’ve lost some weight - yes weight loss is slow and it can be frustrating. Are you embarking on a sincere lifestyle change or is this a temporary thing?

I would do the following if I were in your shoes:

  1. Get your Caloric intake back up into the 2500-2700 range. For someone your size, you probably ought to be eating more than you are, and may be sending your metabolism funny messages right now.
  2. I assume you are already doing this, but make sure that you are dividing this 2500-2700 range into about 6 equal sized meals, or 3 bigger/3 smaller meals throughout the day - this made the hugest difference in energy for me.
  3. You may want to add a couple scoops of brewers yeast to at least one meal a day… its got a lot of good stuff in there that may be of value to you.
  4. Shift your focus. As long as you are that focused on fat-loss, chances are its going to be more and more difficult for you to lose it. Chances are most times you’ve embarked on a diet or exercise routine, you’ve been doing so with the intention of shedding some fat. I bet if you just make a sincere focus to train ‘properly’ and eat healthfully you will eventually be in the best shape of your life, less concerned with your body than ever, and experiencing much improved athletic ability (if thats something that is of interest to you).
  5. Check those fats out again. I have a sneaking suspicion that you could do well to re-evaluate the profile of your fat intake. Also, are you getting a good balance of omega-3 and 6 fatty-acids? That can be helpful to know about - when they are drastically out of balance, I find that personally I tend to manifest some bloaty symptoms.

Good luck, and remember.. you're either body for life or in it for life.

ok so many qeustions, 1) Yes chris i started using a food log back then when they reccomended it, and now i can’t live without it(Fitday is awesome), I have not been watching my fiber intake but i do make trips to the porcelain once a day sometimes twice, i could be in emergency mode, ill try to raise my cals a little, i am using BF calipers(read my very first Post) as well as the scale to judge my progress, i weight my self twice a day once in more once in the evenning, i eat a cheat day on saturdays and don’t log it but the main 'Bad things" i eat in my cheat day are a few sodas reg of course, 2 breakfast bagel sandwichs at mcdonalds in the morn, and usually half of a 12 or 16 inch pizza, but from my cals even if i went over 5000cals on my cheat day it still would not make a dent in my overall calorie deficit,i drink water most of the day,sometimes not enough but sometimes plenty(and a diet soda delicacy every now and again) I was only using the winning formula on my last time i dieted at school,i have not been using it here, the gatorade is my PW carbs source since i dont have the money for surge just yet. I eat alot of veggies a day, two subway salads a day with all the vegetables on them and double chicken on each., But I have neglected the fiber aspect but how could this hamper my weight loss if IM crapping 1-2 times a day as it is.


From my experiences this is a lot more common then people think. If you are doing everything you say you are doing and not getting results your body is just very resistant to weight loss. In Paleolithic times this would be a good thing as during famine you would survive while all the skinny hardgainers starved to death. In order to get the fat comng off I would imagine you will have to do something like tapper suggested, although I would implement a full high carb refeed day at 20% above maintenance once per week until you hit 20% bodyfat and twice a week thereafter.

I feel for ya Pugs. I’m slowly coming to the same realization myself. I had the training logs, the diet plan AND the “proper” food choices. Still no real fat loss. I’d get myself down to maybe 15% bf level, and then nothing. Cardio would only make me look more “wormy” but something happens to your brain and you convince yourself that more cardio will solve things, right?

Anyways, I’m checking out The Winning Formula article and adjusting my nutrition plan accordingly. I might be the type of person who needs to don’t diet to lean…

Any opinions on my response to your questions chris.


Sorry Pugs, I’m tapped out of ideas. I think I’d give the “Don’t Diet” program a try.