T Nation

T Booster?

[quote]hungryone wrote:
And I’ll say that I pretty tried everything under the sun to keep my T levels high (short of doing steroids however). Running an estrogen detox kept my T levels really high without much effort. The last detox I did, I lost about 5% body fat (mostly from my pecs and legs) while adding 8lbs of muscle… And that was in about a month![/quote]

That is impressive but I’m a bit skeptical. Sounds to good to be true to be honest… Was that the only thing you changed in that month? Also, how did you get those numbers?

Oh and Vit C, flax seed and green tea are also anti-estrogenic.

[quote]JLone wrote:
Well I’m boned, my diet is nothing like the recommended diet in this book.

[quote]Sample Diet Plan:

Breakfast
1 glass water
1 grapefruit 1 cup of coffee
Supplements

Morning Snack
8oz organic yogurt
1 cup organic strawberries

Lunch
Green salad and olive oil dressing
Two poached eggs
1-2 oz organic cheese
Supplements

Mid-Afternoon Snack
Peeled granny smith apple
Late Afternoon Snack
Pesticide free whey protein shake
Supplements

Dinner
Black beans and rice
Avocado and salsa
Green salad and onions
4-6 poached or boiled eggs or 8 oz wild caught fish or 2 oz cheese[/quote]
[/quote]

THAT’S the anti-estrogen diet?

Looks more like the Grow a Vagina diet.

lol

[quote]hungryone wrote:
And I’ll say that I pretty tried everything under the sun to keep my T levels high (short of doing steroids however). Running an estrogen detox kept my T levels really high without much effort. The last detox I did, I lost about 5% body fat (mostly from my pecs and legs) while adding 8lbs of muscle… And that was in about a month![/quote]

Cool story, Poliquin.

[quote]JLone wrote:

[quote]
Calcium D-Glucarate:

Calcium D-Glucarate is a form of glucuronic acid attached to a calcium salt for optimal digestion. It is a phytochemical found in a number of foods such as apples, oranges, broccoli, potatoes and brussel sprouts. Calcium D-Glucarate works by directly strongly inhibiting betaglucuronidase; this means that estrogen bound for excretion stays bound and total estrogen load is decreased. One study found that Calcium D-Glucarate was able to decrease estrogen levels by 23% alone! Furthermore, Calcium D-Glucarate has an excellent safety profile, with no side effects and has even been considered by many scientists as a better alternative for estrogen control than the prescription drug Tamoxifen. Simply put, Calcium D-Glucarate is a critical natural compound in eliminating excess estrogens and balancing overall hormone levels.

Sulforaphane:

Sulforaphane is an isothiocyanate naturally present in widely consumed vegetables, particularly in broccoli and broccoli sprouts. Sulforaphane has been shown in research to support both Phase I and Phase II detoxification. In Phase I detoxification, sulforaphane has been shown to convert the dangerous estrogen-glutathione metabolite into the safer and less toxic 4-OH estrogen metabolite, which has a greater chance of being metabolized for excretion. Furthermore, sulforaphane is a potent inducer of the Phase II detoxification enzymes further shuttling along the removal of estrogens from the body. Finally, sulforaphane has been shown in research to decrease the number of estrogen receptors located within the cells of oneâ??s body â?? meaning that for the estrogen that does remain in your body, there are less places for it to act upon! In addition to these effects, sulforaphane has also been shown to be a potent antioxidant, anti- inflammatory, able to lower blood pressure, and to have anti-allergenic and anti-cancer effects. Simply put, sulforaphane acts upon a number of different pathways and packs a powerful punch against decreasing estrogen within your body and increasing your overall health.

Diindoylmethane (DIM):

DIM is a phytochemical that naturally occurs in broccoli, cauliflower, cabbage, and brussels sprouts that is critical for estrogen balance. DIM is actually a composite of 2 molecules of Indole-3-carbinol (I3C), an estrogen fighting compound you may have heard of. However, I3C is not stable as a supplement and has even been shown to exacerbate some forms of cancer â?? while DIM has not. Thus weâ??ve included DIM for the sole purpose of balancing out two forms of estrogen: 2-OH and 16-�±OH. The 16-�±OH form of estrogen has been shown to be an aggressive form of estrogen with in the body; linked with estrogen dominance and an number of estrogen-dependant cancers, while the 2-OH form of estrogen has been shown to be rather benign. DIM selectively removes the 16-OH form of estrogen, improving the 2-OH to 16- OH ratio, a key biomarker of health. Furthermore, low levels of 16-OH estrogen have been strongly correlated with increased levels of free (bioavailable) testosterone â?? testosterone that can be used for building muscle and burning fat.[/quote]
**** OK, last one. I am just bored.****[/quote]broccoli sprouts contain up to 50x as much sulphophane (sp) as florets. Allegedly Johns Hopkins doctors recommend cancer patients eat it alongside traditional treatment.

[quote]MAF14 wrote:

[quote]hungryone wrote:
And I’ll say that I pretty tried everything under the sun to keep my T levels high (short of doing steroids however). Running an estrogen detox kept my T levels really high without much effort. The last detox I did, I lost about 5% body fat (mostly from my pecs and legs) while adding 8lbs of muscle… And that was in about a month![/quote]

That is impressive but I’m a bit skeptical. Sounds to good to be true to be honest… Was that the only thing you changed in that month? Also, how did you get those numbers?[/quote]

Yes it was the only thing I changed in that month! And if you think about it, I naturally optimized my T levels… The results aren’t absurd considering it’s like everything came together. I’m doing a low carb version of paleo diet, use fish oil, vit D, magnesium, and zinc. It seems like all I was missing was detoxing my estrogen levels so I could boost testosterone. Putting on 8lbs of muscle in a month while simultaneously burning some fat (it ended up being around 7lbs) is not unrealistic.

And the numbers were calculated by a friend of mine who is a health care practitioner. He uses a computer program and a 12 site body fat caliper testing to figure everything out.

[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:

[quote]JLone wrote:
Well I’m boned, my diet is nothing like the recommended diet in this book.

[quote]Sample Diet Plan:

Breakfast
1 glass water
1 grapefruit 1 cup of coffee
Supplements

Morning Snack
8oz organic yogurt
1 cup organic strawberries

Lunch
Green salad and olive oil dressing
Two poached eggs
1-2 oz organic cheese
Supplements

Mid-Afternoon Snack
Peeled granny smith apple
Late Afternoon Snack
Pesticide free whey protein shake
Supplements

Dinner
Black beans and rice
Avocado and salsa
Green salad and onions
4-6 poached or boiled eggs or 8 oz wild caught fish or 2 oz cheese[/quote]
[/quote]

THAT’S the anti-estrogen diet?

Looks more like the Grow a Vagina diet.

lol
[/quote]

Looks pretty good…if a non-bodybuilder asked me for a healthy diet that would make them look good, they could do a lot worse than start with this.

[quote]Proud_Virgin wrote:

[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:

[quote]JLone wrote:
Well I’m boned, my diet is nothing like the recommended diet in this book.

[quote]Sample Diet Plan:

Breakfast
1 glass water
1 grapefruit 1 cup of coffee
Supplements

Morning Snack
8oz organic yogurt
1 cup organic strawberries

Lunch
Green salad and olive oil dressing
Two poached eggs
1-2 oz organic cheese
Supplements

Mid-Afternoon Snack
Peeled granny smith apple
Late Afternoon Snack
Pesticide free whey protein shake
Supplements

Dinner
Black beans and rice
Avocado and salsa
Green salad and onions
4-6 poached or boiled eggs or 8 oz wild caught fish or 2 oz cheese[/quote]
[/quote]

THAT’S the anti-estrogen diet?

Looks more like the Grow a Vagina diet.

lol
[/quote]

Looks pretty good…if a non-bodybuilder asked me for a healthy diet that would make them look good, they could do a lot worse than start with this.[/quote]

I agree. But we’re all trying to put on mass here, aren’t we?

[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:
I agree. But we’re all trying to put on mass here, aren’t we?
[/quote]

Agreed. And for those purposes it probably wouldn’t suffice. But it is a huge improvement over the typical “cereal for breakfast, sandwich for lunch, pasta for dinner” that seems to pervade every “healthy lifestyle” diet.

It was refreshing to see, that’s all.

[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:

[quote]JLone wrote:
Well I’m boned, my diet is nothing like the recommended diet in this book.

[quote]Sample Diet Plan:

Breakfast
1 glass water
1 grapefruit 1 cup of coffee
Supplements

Morning Snack
8oz organic yogurt
1 cup organic strawberries

Lunch
Green salad and olive oil dressing
Two poached eggs
1-2 oz organic cheese
Supplements

Mid-Afternoon Snack
Peeled granny smith apple
Late Afternoon Snack
Pesticide free whey protein shake
Supplements

Dinner
Black beans and rice
Avocado and salsa
Green salad and onions
4-6 poached or boiled eggs or 8 oz wild caught fish or 2 oz cheese[/quote]
[/quote]

THAT’S the anti-estrogen diet?

Looks more like the Grow a Vagina diet.

lol
[/quote]

hahaha

[quote]hungryone wrote:

[quote]MAF14 wrote:

[quote]hungryone wrote:
And I’ll say that I pretty tried everything under the sun to keep my T levels high (short of doing steroids however). Running an estrogen detox kept my T levels really high without much effort. The last detox I did, I lost about 5% body fat (mostly from my pecs and legs) while adding 8lbs of muscle… And that was in about a month![/quote]

That is impressive but I’m a bit skeptical. Sounds to good to be true to be honest… Was that the only thing you changed in that month? Also, how did you get those numbers?[/quote]

Yes it was the only thing I changed in that month! And if you think about it, I naturally optimized my T levels… The results aren’t absurd considering it’s like everything came together. I’m doing a low carb version of paleo diet, use fish oil, vit D, magnesium, and zinc. It seems like all I was missing was detoxing my estrogen levels so I could boost testosterone. Putting on 8lbs of muscle in a month while simultaneously burning some fat (it ended up being around 7lbs) is not unrealistic.

And the numbers were calculated by a friend of mine who is a health care practitioner. He uses a computer program and a 12 site body fat caliper testing to figure everything out.[/quote]

Either you were taking anabolic hormones or you’re full of it. The idea of “detoxing estrogen” is totally ridiculous to anyone with even a semblance of understanding of the endocrine system. It’s not as though there is a pool of estrogen sitting around in your body causing havoc, it is a constant feedback loop in which testosterone aromatizes into estrogen.

Even if you had elevated E2 from some other issue and slammed it to zero with an aromatase inhibitor like letrozole, you would not see steroid-like gains unless you are a total weight lifting newb (in which case the gains would be from actually lifting weights, not the increase in T).

I wouldn’t put it past a lot of companies to slip prohormones into whatever BS supplements they are hawking these days, but if I had to bet I’d say you’re just full of it.

[quote]HoustonGuy wrote:

broccoli sprouts contain up to 50x as much sulphophane (sp) as florets. Allegedly Johns Hopkins doctors recommend cancer patients eat it alongside traditional treatment.
[/quote]
Steaming broccoli greatly enhances the sulphorophane content. From a practicality standpoint (unless a person has cancer) this is good news.

[quote]overstand wrote:
Either you were taking anabolic hormones or you’re full of it. The idea of “detoxing estrogen” is totally ridiculous to anyone with even a semblance of understanding of the endocrine system. It’s not as though there is a pool of estrogen sitting around in your body causing havoc, it is a constant feedback loop in which testosterone aromatizes into estrogen.

Even if you had elevated E2 from some other issue and slammed it to zero with an aromatase inhibitor like letrozole, you would not see steroid-like gains unless you are a total weight lifting newb (in which case the gains would be from actually lifting weights, not the increase in T).

I wouldn’t put it past a lot of companies to slip prohormones into whatever BS supplements they are hawking these days, but if I had to bet I’d say you’re just full of it.[/quote]

Wow! I don’t know which supplement company took a shit in your wheaties… But here’s the crazy thing, some of us actually eat well, work out hard, and use high quality supplements. And that’s just exactly what I did. People can get good results if they do those 3 things… No steroids need, despite what the local juice-monkey at your gym will tell you.

And take a look at some of the research out there regarding xenoestrogens… Essentially these attach to androgen receptors, lowering overall testosterone. By adequately detoxifying these chemicals you can improve not only your results but also your health. There is far too much info out there for me to post here.

Finally, I don’t know where you’re buying your supplements, but I do look for quality when I buy mine. I’d highly doubt there’d be “pro-hormones slipped” into my stuff (the first time I’ve ever heard of someone purposely doing this), especially considering since this stuff was shipped from the US to me in Canada…

[quote]BulletproofTiger wrote:

[quote]HoustonGuy wrote:

broccoli sprouts contain up to 50x as much sulphophane (sp) as florets. Allegedly Johns Hopkins doctors recommend cancer patients eat it alongside traditional treatment.
[/quote]
Steaming broccoli greatly enhances the sulphorophane content. From a practicality standpoint (unless a person has cancer) this is good news.[/quote]

This is interesting to hear! Would you happen to have a source for this information? I’d just like a little more background info is all…

[quote]overstand wrote:

[quote]hungryone wrote:

[quote]MAF14 wrote:

[quote]hungryone wrote:
And I’ll say that I pretty tried everything under the sun to keep my T levels high (short of doing steroids however). Running an estrogen detox kept my T levels really high without much effort. The last detox I did, I lost about 5% body fat (mostly from my pecs and legs) while adding 8lbs of muscle… And that was in about a month![/quote]

That is impressive but I’m a bit skeptical. Sounds to good to be true to be honest… Was that the only thing you changed in that month? Also, how did you get those numbers?[/quote]

Yes it was the only thing I changed in that month! And if you think about it, I naturally optimized my T levels… The results aren’t absurd considering it’s like everything came together. I’m doing a low carb version of paleo diet, use fish oil, vit D, magnesium, and zinc. It seems like all I was missing was detoxing my estrogen levels so I could boost testosterone. Putting on 8lbs of muscle in a month while simultaneously burning some fat (it ended up being around 7lbs) is not unrealistic.

And the numbers were calculated by a friend of mine who is a health care practitioner. He uses a computer program and a 12 site body fat caliper testing to figure everything out.[/quote]

Either you were taking anabolic hormones or you’re full of it. The idea of “detoxing estrogen” is totally ridiculous to anyone with even a semblance of understanding of the endocrine system. It’s not as though there is a pool of estrogen sitting around in your body causing havoc, it is a constant feedback loop in which testosterone aromatizes into estrogen.

Even if you had elevated E2 from some other issue and slammed it to zero with an aromatase inhibitor like letrozole, you would not see steroid-like gains unless you are a total weight lifting newb (in which case the gains would be from actually lifting weights, not the increase in T).

I wouldn’t put it past a lot of companies to slip prohormones into whatever BS supplements they are hawking these days, but if I had to bet I’d say you’re just full of it.[/quote]

It is possible for estrogen to not be cleared as efficiently as it should.

Not saying that the above diet will help, but your rant only addresses the source of estrogen, not what happens after it’s synthesized.

[quote]hungryone wrote:

Finally, I don’t know where you’re buying your supplements, but I do look for quality when I buy mine. I’d highly doubt there’d be “pro-hormones slipped” into my stuff (the first time I’ve ever heard of someone purposely doing this), especially considering since this stuff was shipped from the US to me in Canada…[/quote]

It’s happened. And will happen again.

Usually the companies that do it only do it for a limited amount of time to generate some buzz about their product then stop and rely on the testimonials to generate futher sales.

I’ve heard what they do is they’ll slip pro hormones in the first few batches of a new supplement, build hype, then remove the illegal ingredient before it’s checked.

This is what I’ve heard from someone I know that preps bodybuilders and has competed in bodybuilding. Of course it’s just hearsay.

[quote]hungryone wrote:

shipped from the US to me in Canada…[/quote]

I’m not sure how much this even matters.

I successfully received a product with yohimbine in it from a shipment sent out of the United States.

Yohimbine is illegal here.

[quote]hungryone wrote:

[quote]BulletproofTiger wrote:

[quote]HoustonGuy wrote:

broccoli sprouts contain up to 50x as much sulphophane (sp) as florets. Allegedly Johns Hopkins doctors recommend cancer patients eat it alongside traditional treatment.
[/quote]
Steaming broccoli greatly enhances the sulphorophane content. From a practicality standpoint (unless a person has cancer) this is good news.[/quote]

This is interesting to hear! Would you happen to have a source for this information? I’d just like a little more background info is all…[/quote]
You can just google it. Lightly steamed is the key. 10 minutes at 140 degrees will make it (the sulforophane) UNabsorbable. Lightly steam for 4 or 5 minutes then take out to cool. That should do the trick. Gram for gram, broccoli sprouts are still a richer source, but it’s much easier, tastier, and more practical to eat lightly steamed broccoli IMO.

[quote]therajraj wrote:

[quote]hungryone wrote:

shipped from the US to me in Canada…[/quote]

I’m not sure how much this even matters.

I successfully received a product with yohimbine in it from a shipment sent out of the United States.

Yohimbine is illegal here.[/quote]

How is Yohimbine illegal?