T Nation

Switching to a 'Bodybuilding' Style Split

Hey everyone.

I was doing a Push/pull split because I had a hip injury and I couldn’t lift legs. I should have just designed this then, but I didn’t know any better.

I’m going do one extra back day as a preventative measure to having a disproportionate push:pull ratio. Besides, back days are my favorite. I get a lot more satisfaction out of pulling movements. I’m also going to be doing one circuit from the 5 circuit diesel crew shoulder rehab protocol every workout as a prehab to potential shoulder issues.

I really want to be doing 5x5 for the presses, but i think I’m going to stick to 3x10 for now so I have to use lighter weight and concentrate on form. If my shoulders start acting up, I’ll start doing the presses on a smith. I might actually start doing them on a smith to see if they act up less on that and then work up to a barbell.

In any event, here’s the split:
Monday: Chest, Biceps, Abs
Tuesday: Back and Triceps
Wednesday: Legs, Abs
Thursday: Off
Friday: Back and Triceps
Saturday: Shoulders, Abs, Biceps
Sunday: Off

1)Chest, Biceps, Abs
-Bench Press (5x5 or 3x10 Alternate)
-Incline Bench Press (3x10 or 5x5 alternate)
-Cable Flyes (3x10)
-Barbell Curl (3x10)
-Incline DB curl (3x10)
-Concentration Curl (3x10)
-Bent knee leg raises (3xF)
-Reverse Crunch (3xF)

2)Back, Triceps
-Pullups (3xF)
-DB row (3x10)
-Lat Pulldown (3x10)
-Back extension (3x10)
-Seated Row (3x10)
-Skull Crusher (3x10)
-Tricep Pushdown (3x10)
-Lying DB Tricep extension (3x10)

3)Legs, Abs
-Squat (5x5)
-Good Morning or Hamstring Extension(3x10)
-DB Lunges (3x10)
-Standing 1 leg Calf Extension (3x10)
-Quad Extension (3x10)
-Machine Adduction/Abduction (3x10 each)
-Bent knee leg raises (3xF)
-Side bends (3x20)

4)Off

5)Shoulders and Biceps
-OHP (5x5)
-Front Barbell Shrug/Behind Back Barbell Shrug (2x10 each)
-DB Rear Delt Flyes (3x10)
-Overhead Trap Shrug (3x10)
-DB Lateral Raise (3x10)
-Barbell Curl (3x10)
-Face Pull (3x10)
-Incline DB Curl (3x10)
-Hammer Curl (3x10)

6)Back, Triceps, Abs
-Chin ups (3xF)
-Bent over Rows (5x5)
-Lat Pulldown (3x10)
-Seated Row (3x10)
-CGBP (5x5)
-Reverse Grip Tricep Pushdown (3x10)
-Seated DB Tricep extension (3x10)
-Deadlift (3x5)
-Bent knee leg raises (3xF)
-Reverse Crunch (3xF)

7)Off

You have TEN to ELEVEN exercises in your workouts.

Yeah, fail.

/me sheepishly says: 3-4 exercises per body part?

Gulp

I mean, I’m apparently a dolt and missing something. What of the following did I misinterpret?

[quote]Bricknyce wrote:

Frequency: 1 to 2 times per week per muscle group.
Body split up over 3 to 6 sessions, depending on frequency and number of muscles trainer per session.
2 to 3 muscles trained at each session.
Sets and reps: Warm up and ramp up to 1 to 2 all-out blast sets of 6 to 15 reps - depending on what you grow best from.
2 to 4 exercises per muscle group, including both compound and isolation exercises. Large muscles usually get 2 compound and 1 or 2 isolation exercises and small ones usually get 1 or 2 compound exercises and 1 or 2 isolation exercises.
[/quote]

Made some changes to the OP. I had some stuff that I was deciding between but left in by mistake.

Is that better?

Thanks.

On day 2 I don’t see a need for both DB Row and Seated Row but if you insist on doing both then perform Seated Row before Back Extensions.

On day 6 I’d put deadlifts first. Are you doing them last because of your hip injury?

Day 2: I like doing seated rows and db rows because I’m trying to prehab for shoulder issues and I think seated rows are more beneficial. I’ve been doing both for a few months, and my weights are going up in both. I’ll switch the order of seated row and back extensions.

Day 6: Partially the hip thing, and partially the fact that I’m pretty wiped up after doing a good Deadlift session. My grip is also pretty much gone after a set of deads. I could try doing them right after chinups and see how it goes. That way I’ll have warmed up a little bit too.

I think I tweaked my back a little bit last week and it’s been feeling a little funny/sore, so I’m going to try them with a strap and possibly a trap bar this week. Maybe do 3x10 with lighter weights instead of doing 3x5. I’m also going to be doing db rows instead of bent over rows till I feel confident that the soreness is gone.

Thanks for the reply ACTrain.

[quote]ridethecliche wrote:
Day 2: I like doing seated rows and db rows because I’m trying to prehab for shoulder issues and I think seated rows are more beneficial. I’ve been doing both for a few months, and my weights are going up in both. I’ll switch the order of seated row and back extensions.

Day 6: Partially the hip thing, and partially the fact that I’m pretty wiped up after doing a good Deadlift session. My grip is also pretty much gone after a set of deads. I could try doing them right after chinups and see how it goes. That way I’ll have warmed up a little bit too.

I think I tweaked my back a little bit last week and it’s been feeling a little funny/sore, so I’m going to try them with a strap and possibly a trap bar this week. Maybe do 3x10 with lighter weights instead of doing 3x5. I’m also going to be doing db rows instead of bent over rows till I feel confident that the soreness is gone.

Thanks for the reply ACTrain.[/quote]

Well since you are doing a back day twice, I don’t see a problem in doing Deadlifts first on your day 6 and having your grip a little compromised afterwards. I would lessen the amount of exercises on day 6 anyways, since it is your second back day, so the grip shouldn’t be very detrimental to the rest of your session. Just an idea.

Thanks for the thoughts. I can also just use straps if my grip is going. Deads just totally wipe me out. It’ll be interesting to see how they impact the rest of the workout.

I think I’m getting rid of the kickbacks and doing seated or lying db extensions. I might add one of those as a 3rd tricep movement on the 2nd tricep day.

If it ends up feeling like too much, I’ll drop some movements. I’m still a beginner so I’ve been seeing some pretty good gains already. I alternate the last set of accessory movements with Ab work during the rest periods so they go by fast. This isn’t helping my cause, but the push/pull split I was doing had like 12 exercises each day, sometimes even more, and I was still doing well with that.

I might sub the occasional tricep dips in for the 2 accessory tricep movements if I feel my shoulders can handle them. I’ve read too many bad things about them, so I’m thinking of staying away because I get some shoulder soreness from benching already. That’s why I’ve been doing additional RC physio stuff.

I have so much to learn. Atleast this will serve as a good starting point. So it goes.

Thanks for the help.

As far as the “bad” things you’ve heard about dips, it’s all about how your body reacts. Doubtful that you’ll destroy your shoulders by doing them. Baby steps, just try 'em. You are doing the dips on the tricep dip chair/thing right? Not on a bench?

Sometimes when I do dips I get the shoulder pain as well, but after a while your body slowly adjusts to it. As for myself, I work my triceps with skull crushers with an EZ curl bar lying on the ground. There are probably more effective ways to work the triceps, but I like being able to do these on the ground because I can go heavy and if I happen to fail I can just drop it behind me.

[quote]flipHKD_6 wrote:
As far as the “bad” things you’ve heard about dips, it’s all about how your body reacts. Doubtful that you’ll destroy your shoulders by doing them. Baby steps, just try 'em. You are doing the dips on the tricep dip chair/thing right? Not on a bench?[/quote]

Yup. On a chair thing.
Just do them so I can feel it in the triceps or am I supposed to lean a bit?

Leaning forward starts to work the chest more and the triceps less. So if you want it to be as much as a tricep workout as you can have, try not to lean.

If you have AC joint pain anything like I have (bicep tendon, possibly rotator cuff) I’d be cautious with dips. I don’t do them anymore. At least give a decent lean. Remember dips with a lean targets chest, vertical dips targets tris.

Also, all this talk of “prehab” with your shoulder using 2 rowing movements… sounds more like physical therapy is what you need seeing as how your shoulder “acts up”. I’d take care of this instead of neglecting it. If you truly are a beginner, maintaining a healthy body should be something to get used to early on.

As a matter of fact, I’d have a veteran lifter look at your technique for some of your lifts. Breezing through this thread I gather that you have a hip injury, tweaked back, and shoulder injury? This concerns me.

My hip injury is bursitis, and I’ve been seeing a doc and PT for it.

Tweaked back, I believe is caused by the bursitis making me contort in all sorts of ways. If it starts to feel worse when I do squats and deads with a belt, then I’ll stop doing them till it’s better. I’ve already ditched bent over rows in favor of one arm db rows. I might skip out on direct erector work as well. In addition, I’m going to drop my squat weight by 25% and focus on doing higher reps. If that still aggravates it, then I’ll do leg presses instead. I’m also going to be using a trap bar for deadlifts. Lighter weights for deads as well. Actually, now that I think about it, using a trap bar for squats might be a good idea as well. I wonder how that will work. I’ll have to elevate my feet a little bit to do it. Definitely going to atleast try this out.

I don’t have any shoulder issues, they just get sore for a day after certain workouts. So I started doing a 5 circuit prehab to try to avoid future issues. Haha, someone suggested I try using a trap bar for the pressing movements as well, so I can keep my hands in a more neutral position. Again, no harm in trying, so I’ll give it a go when the next press day comes along.

That being said, my left shoulder is a little sore after the dips. What do you do instead of doing dips? I’ve never felt that I get as good of a tricep involvement doing anything else. Also, are you trying to keep your arms close to your chest when doing the dips or letting them attain whatever neutral position they want?

Thanks.

I would recommend front squats with high reps they seem to be less stressful on the hips than back squats. Also try rack deadlifts in place of deadlifts if you are working back as trap bar deadlifts are more of a leg exercise.

Monday: Chest, Biceps, Abs
Tuesday: Back and Triceps
Wednesday: Legs, Abs
Thursday: Off
Friday: Shoulders and Biceps
Saturday: Back, Triceps, and Abs
Sunday: Off

If that’s my current split, is there any way I could add a second leg day?

If I get rid of my thursday off day and move everything up, then I could add in a second leg day with front squats and some accessory exercises. Would this be feasible?

I guess I’d have to try it to see if I can handle it huh?

I’d like to give this a go ahead because I really want to concentrate more on legs and back, even though everytihng needs to go up.

Bump.

Would it be a good idea to move things around to something like this?

Monday: Chest, Biceps, Abs
Tuesday: Back and Triceps
Wednesday: Legs, Abs
Thursday: Shoulders and Biceps
Friday: Chest,Back (Superset Style), and some Abs
Saturday: Legs and Tris
Sunday: Off

I’m thinking about doing this because I honestly don’t feel like I need two days of recovery a week. I’m not tired or sore or worn down. When I start getting sore and more tired than usual, I can start cutting stuff.

I’m a college student. I have plenty of access to cheap food (all you can eat cafeteria), plenty of time if I organize my day better and get on top of my work, and I recover pretty damn fast.

This way I’ll be able to hit everything twice a week with the 2nd addition having slightly less volume if necessary. Is there a better way to set this up? What do y’all think?