Sweet Chi Sau Video

Continuing on from my last post - I don’t blame people who weighed in on this thread, saying how weak Wing Chun is, and how weak that video looked.

Chi sao is an exercise, not a demonstration of combat ability.

Moving your hands as fast as possible does not generate power, and it doesn’t do damage. It just wastes energy.

OMG! In the second vid, did Fabio really rip out that guy’s heart?

[quote]haney wrote:
PGJ wrote:
I don’t know jack-squat about chi sau, but it looks stupid. I don’t understand your comment about style. All I know is that all that fancy karate stuff goes out the window in a real fight, especially when fighting someone who knows what their doing.

THe “receiver” in the video was just standing there all limp. Would that shit work against a guy who was squared up and ready to trade punches?

Looks are deceiving. its kind of funny how many “fighters” I have had come through my class and struggle with some of our low level students.

the comment about style means I have seen some horrible talent in mma, and I have seen some great talent in other styles. The guy who has the most talent not the style usually wins.

the guy wasn’t standing there limp. he was exchanging pressure, when he would over commit the other guy would sense it and then ract properly in an instant. as I said no one would walk up to someone and do chi sau in a fight. but they would use the things that they learned in chi sau in a fight.

ig you can get past the first 15 secs. on this video this is an small part of how wt is applied in a realistic situation.

and if you are a big fan of mma from back in the early days you might know who this guy is.

Granted He is a jerk, but I have trained with him before, and the guy is a natural fighter.

once again though style is not what determines a good fighter.
[/quote]

[quote]HOV wrote:
I did Wing Chun for 12 years.

The Chi Sao pictured in that vid is sloppy as hell. I’ve touched hands with people who do it like that and they’re really easy to subdue.[/quote]

I was impressed with his ability to quickly work the angles

[quote]haney wrote:
I was impressed with his ability to quickly work the angles[/quote]

  1. His Chi Sao motion is absolutely horrible. There is no bong sau, tan sau, or fook sau identifiable whatsoever. He is just flopping his hands around for a few seconds until he starts hitting. Why even pretend you’re doing chi sao if you never actually do it? They should just start from a sparring position.

  2. He does a few biu saus, lop saus, and a bunch of chain punches. The reason he can pull this off is because his opponent can’t maintain a stance, block, or counter at all. The tall lanky white kid essentially ducks and turns away every time.

Simple rolling hands or a bong sau that actually came up would go far in defending himself against such a “vicious” onslaught.

  1. This is a video of a sloppy novice poorly beating up a complete beginner. The videos you posted later of that Mexican guy were a little better, but it was still just demonstration stuff. What’s up with all the takedowns anyway? Seems like they wanted to make WC appeal to a MMA-style audience.

Anyone can make convincing fight scenes for a video. Unfortunately, the first video wasn’t even convincing. It should be titled “Skinny asian kid flails around on complete beginner”. Do you think that puts WC in a positive light?

Chi Sao is not meant to develop the ability to punch a billion times in one second. It is meant to develop your awareness of your own center of gravity, your opponent’s center of gravity, basic timing, and the ability to know when to punch. When you do punch, it’s going to be a good, solid blow directly to your opponent’s COG and it won’t need to be repeated 500 more times.

I’m not going to claim any ability to destroy MMA fighters, because I stopped practicing when MMA was just getting popular in the public eye, and in retrospect my training would not have prepared me for the ring anyway; not enough ground work or countering takedowns.

But I have been in street fights, and my ability to punch in a straight line while maintaining a solid COG has earned me some knockdowns in the “real world”. This is mainly because most people are really afraid to fight even when they start the fight; and once they get hit hard they really don’t want to get hit again. Their posture crumbles, and you can have at it.

That’s what Chi Sao got me - the ability to punch straight and strong with the right timing. A few hard punches to end the fight, not a million butterfly-soft knuckle kisses in a milisecond to soothe my opponent into a hypnotic state.

[quote]HOV wrote:
haney wrote:
I was impressed with his ability to quickly work the angles

  1. His Chi Sao motion is absolutely horrible. There is no bong sau, tan sau, or fook sau identifiable whatsoever. He is just flopping his hands around for a few seconds until he starts hitting. Why even pretend you’re doing chi sao if you never actually do it? They should just start from a sparring position.
    [/quote]

have you seen any chi sao videos that would make WC appear in a good light.
had I shown any with Lueng ting I doubt it would have made a better impression. As I said his use of angles is what I enjoyed.

you arn’t saying anything that wasn’t already on the comments page of the video I posted.

those take downs have been apart of WT for as long as I have know about it, and were popular with Emin as scene in his sorry fight with Willaim chueng. When he threw him to the ground.

I don’t think I have once said he was any good. I have defended the exercise of chi sao, and his ability to use angles, but nothing more.

[quote]
Chi Sao is not meant to develop the ability to punch a billion times in one second. It is meant to develop your awareness of your own center of gravity, your opponent’s center of gravity, basic timing, and the ability to know when to punch. When you do punch, it’s going to be a good, solid blow directly to your opponent’s COG and it won’t need to be repeated 500 more times.[/quote]

please tell me how this differs from what I said chi sao was? I said it was meant to develop reaction to different pressures. I might not have said it as clear as you, but it isn’t an incorrect description either.

neither did I.

which would go back to style doesn’t matter in the discussion.

[quote]
That’s what Chi Sao got me - the ability to punch straight and strong with the right timing. A few hard punches to end the fight, not a million butterfly-soft knuckle kisses in a milisecond to soothe my opponent into a hypnotic state.[/quote]

chain punches are not desigend to be soft.

[quote]haney wrote:
those take downs have been apart of WT for as long as I have know about it, and were popular with Emin as scene in his sorry fight with Willaim chueng. When he threw him to the ground.
[/quote]

I suppose takedowns weren’t en vogue in my school, but I can see how they would be a part of the system… there are motions in the forms that can be used for that it seems.

I met William Cheung at a tournament in 1991 when I was 16 years old. Nice guy.

I saw Emin years later at a seminar, but didn’t touch hands or anything. I like the comments on YouTube about the video. Funny.

[quote]HOV wrote:
haney wrote:
those take downs have been apart of WT for as long as I have know about it, and were popular with Emin as scene in his sorry fight with Willaim chueng. When he threw him to the ground.

I suppose takedowns weren’t en vogue in my school, but I can see how they would be a part of the system… there are motions in the forms that can be used for that it seems.
[/quote]
different instructors focus on different things.

I never met the guy but I don’t think anyone could a bigger jerk than Emin. atleast back then.

[quote]
I saw Emin years later at a seminar, but didn’t touch hands or anything. I like the comments on YouTube about the video. Funny.[/quote]

I have been to a few of his seminars, and touch hands briefly. I have known alot of the instructors in Texas when he was head of the North American section of Lueng Ting’s organization. Most people go to seminars to learn something new. Emin gave a few of them excessive bruises and kidney problems for a week.

As I said earlier he is talented though.

[quote]summa wrote:
I fought 2 brothers at the same time who kept bragging about their prowess at their Filipino martial art. I studied getting my ass kicked by gangs of indians. To make a pathetic story short, I kicked both their asses.[/quote]

Didn’t you also say in another thread how you fought 7 kids at one time, who knew how to fight AND they were hitting you with skate boards and you sent them running? You’re like the newest T-Nation superhero.