I absolutely agree. I was mistaken about some BA and prop stuff earlier. And the needle prsesure was just speculation. But esters do affect what size needle you can use. And here is the reasoning… Steroids are carbon based molecules just like all organic matter. The length and mass of the molecule are affected by the length of the ester. For example, test prop is made by adding 3 carbon atoms to the hydroxyl group @ the 17th carbon atom of the base test molecule. Therefore making it a shorter, smaller ester than say test e which has 7 additional carbon atoms. The smaller mass and length of the propionate allows you to inject through a smaller barrel such as a 25g. Where an ester like cypionate containing 8 carbon atoms does not due to.the increased volume/size of the test molecule. Also the viscosity of the solution used (ie sesame oil, veg oil, etc.) can affect needle use. And I’m not just bullshitting, this is fact. Heating can create molecular activity allowing for a smaller needle to be used.
Now, have you guys ever pinned test e or c or even nandro d through anything smaller than a 23g? On a molecular level it should be impossible due to the increased size by the addition of the long carbon chain. And then of course the longer the carbon chain, the longer the ester, which creates a longer half life blah blah blah. My point is longer estered tests cannot go through smaller gauge needles, due to the increased size of the molecule.
Bonez, have you pushed test c through a 25g?
And mokshada, I’m sorry your thread got hi jacked bro. I was just trying to brainstorm with you. Sorry if some of my info was off base. Just trying to help bro. Next time I will keep my mouth shut.
[quote]Dirts Daniels wrote:
I absolutely agree. I was mistaken about some BA and prop stuff earlier. And the needle prsesure was just speculation. But esters do affect what size needle you can use. And here is the reasoning… Steroids are carbon based molecules just like all organic matter. The length and mass of the molecule are affected by the length of the ester. For example, test prop is made by adding 3 carbon atoms to the hydroxyl group @ the 17th carbon atom of the base test molecule. Therefore making it a shorter, smaller ester than say test e which has 7 additional carbon atoms. The smaller mass and length of the propionate allows you to inject through a smaller barrel such as a 25g. Where an ester like cypionate containing 8 carbon atoms does not due to.the increased volume/size of the test molecule. Also the viscosity of the solution used (ie sesame oil, veg oil, etc.) can affect needle use. And I’m not just bullshitting, this is fact. Heating can create molecular activity allowing for a smaller needle to be used.
Now, have you guys ever pinned test e or c or even nandro d through anything smaller than a 23g? On a molecular level it should be impossible due to the increased size by the addition of the long carbon chain. And then of course the longer the carbon chain, the longer the ester, which creates a longer half life blah blah blah. My point is longer estered tests cannot go through smaller gauge needles, due to the increased size of the molecule.
Bonez, have you pushed test c through a 25g?
[/quote]
Do you not realize how fucking tiny a molecule of test e is? If you were a testosterone enanthate molecule, the hollow inside a 23g needle would look like a fucking black hole. Thousands and thousands of test enanthate molecules could span the diameter inside of a 23g needle. The size of the needle you can use has nothing to do with the size of the molecule and everything to do with the medium in which it is delivered.
Everyone I know uses 23g for oil based injectibles. I have personally drawn and injected test E and C with a 25g with no problems at all. Bonez said above he used a slin pin, which is 28-30g. You’re wrong, just stop it.
[quote]overstand wrote:
Dirt Daniels…I understand you’re trying to help, but if you aren’t 100% sure of what you are saying or if you are just speculating, you need to preface your posts by saying so. This is how broscience myths get started. This board isn’t as prolific as some others, but the quality of information is much higher and part of the reason is because the members police themselves. If somebody says something wrong or stupid, they are called out on it. Don’t take it personally.
I agree with everything Bonez has said except about quads. I stick it about 2/3 the way up the leg, on the outside of your thigh. There’s a good lacrosse ball sized area where I’ve never hit a nerve, never aspirated blood and only got a trickle of blood once or twice. I think it’s the best because you can use 2 hands and see what you’re doing. [/quote]
If my post came across that quads are a bad site I didnt mean for it to. Just not MY preference.
[quote]Dirts Daniels wrote:
I absolutely agree. I was mistaken about some BA and prop stuff earlier. And the needle prsesure was just speculation. But esters do affect what size needle you can use. And here is the reasoning… Steroids are carbon based molecules just like all organic matter. The length and mass of the molecule are affected by the length of the ester. For example, test prop is made by adding 3 carbon atoms to the hydroxyl group @ the 17th carbon atom of the base test molecule. Therefore making it a shorter, smaller ester than say test e which has 7 additional carbon atoms. The smaller mass and length of the propionate allows you to inject through a smaller barrel such as a 25g. Where an ester like cypionate containing 8 carbon atoms does not due to.the increased volume/size of the test molecule. Also the viscosity of the solution used (ie sesame oil, veg oil, etc.) can affect needle use. And I’m not just bullshitting, this is fact. Heating can create molecular activity allowing for a smaller needle to be used.
Now, have you guys ever pinned test e or c or even nandro d through anything smaller than a 23g? On a molecular level it should be impossible due to the increased size by the addition of the long carbon chain. And then of course the longer the carbon chain, the longer the ester, which creates a longer half life blah blah blah. My point is longer estered tests cannot go through smaller gauge needles, due to the increased size of the molecule.
Bonez, have you pushed test c through a 25g?
[/quote]
Youre a complete moron.
Ive used decanoate and enanthate esters through 29g (!!!) needles.
You are a fool who has no idea what he’s talking about. You read some bullshit somewhere and are now regurgitating it for some bizarre reason. It is completely clear that you have bare minimal experience. Please stop posting things unless you KNOW them to be true through persnal experience.
[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:
[quote]Dirts Daniels wrote:
And pharm grade tends to have a higher B.A. content than underground shit. Your sus prob has a high dose of prop which usually has high B.A. and is also a painful esther. \ [/quote]
Jesus christ. THis is wrong too.
Pharm grade DEFINITELY doesnt ‘tend to have’ higher BA content than UGL stuff. UGLs are notorious for using way too much alcohol because the bathtub operation is a far greater contamination risk compard to the controlled enviroment of a lab. UGLs tend to go overkill on the BA because a report of dirty gear can ruin their reputation. (Im not implying that using more BA than necessary makes a safer product)
Pharm grade test cyp is completely painless.
Second. Sustanon is not made by taking 4 separate oil based products and combining them in one vial. That could be the only way “prop usually has high BA” could make sense. The hormone powders are added to the oil then the solvents and alcohol are added. The BA content of UGL sust has nothing to do with the BA content of prop.
Furthermore, prop is usually the ester added in the smallest dose. 30mg. Compared to 60mg and 100mg of the others. Yes, many people have painful reactions to test prop (the ester it seems, regardless of preparation) but that comes at doses of 75-100mg/ml. 30mg of prop in 1ml of sustanon isnt the cause of the pain.
It’s virgin muscle pain.
You dont sound like you have much experience.
[/quote]
i have to disagree with the cyp statement. i have used pharm grade cyp, injected by myself and injected by someone with more experience. the initial injection goes fine, but a few days later i always get some slight swelling and soreness.
Im currently running sustanon 350 (50mg prop, 100mg pp, 100mg enth, 100mg dec/ml) and It flows through a 29g slin pin. Ive been shooting with the slin pin ed, .3cc. Its the oil/solvents that decide wether or not it’ll need a bigger gauge. as bonez said the ester doesnt have shit to do with it sir.