T Nation

Sust 250...Anti-E Needed?



I just started a cycle of sust 250. I'm planning on completing 10cc, first two weeks at 1cc and the remaining at 2cc.

1) How do the vets view this cycle? I am a noob and trying to get as much information as possible. I always want more info :slightly_smiling:

2) Is anti-e needed in my situation?

I pretty firmly believe I have low testosterone to begin with, two days after my first injection I feel healthier and a little but not much of an increase in sex drive (I def don't think about sex as much as the avg male my age - 22). I wake up with an E now usually I didn't before and I feel my ERECTIONS are stronger. I was never really super agressive and I still don't feel very agressive or get the super 'confidence' as explained elsewhere but my mind is quieted and I am less self consious. Also the persistent fat around my belly is melting.

ANyway I'm not sure if it even matters that I may have had low test and if that is linked to more estrogen production or anything. I would just like to know what are your opinions.

And the caps were for spice and to force a visual, cause I'm an ass like that sometimes :slightly_smiling:



Bro Im gonna have to say shame on you for starting a cycle before asking and resolving your questions, this just doesn't make any sense to me, does it to you? Also if I understand correctly, this is your cycle:

Wk 1-2: 250mg/wk
Wk 3-6: 500mg/wk

This isnt a good cycle for alot of reasons, read a couple threads and Im sure you will be able to figure out why.

However since you are obviously going to run this either way, get some anti-e's, NOW. Your gonna be suppressing your natural test, so you need to run PCT. Also, this is your first cycle so you don't have any idea how the test will effect you side effect wise, so you should plan for the worse ( get any ancilliaries you might possibly need) and hope for the best (self explanatory).
After you read this and all the other soon to come responses please spend the rest of the day taking in as much info as you can, then wake up tomorrow and repeat. Be safe dude.

On a side note, sorry about the shame on you thing, I had a coach who used to tell me that when I fucked up. Kinda harsh huh?


You need ancillaries for the second half of the cycle at least. I am of the opinion and 250 MG of test does not warrant the use of anti estrogens as it is not much higher than the normal production of a young male. I'd rethink the cycle though. I think you'd be much happier with the results running 500 MG a week through out. You best results are always in the beginning of a cycle.


It would be a huge mistake not to run an anti-E w/ sust. I defidently agree w/ the reply post, yo cycle would be pointless at the quantity that u are running. my most recent cycle was sust 250 600mg/week, Dynabolon 500mg/week
A-dex .5 mg ED,PCT- Clo 100,50,50 +Long R3 IGF-1 50mcg 5x/week. I got an ass load of water bloat half way and my nipples flared a bit so i bumped up 1mg of a-dex and it went away. i wouldnt recomend any less than 500.


Thanks for all the replies. They are very helpuful.


I realize now that I should have done more research on steroid articles. I did read wikipedia and various other sources on testosterone, as well I spoke with my close friend who has taken a few cycles of steroids before (as well has used sust). I believe I may have placed too much blind fatith in that, as he did not mention anti-e or ancilliaries.

pat and sota123,
Thanks for the comments. I would like to clarify what I am trying to achieve: I am not trying to go for straight bodybuilding. I do a lot of martial arts as well. I would like to get stronger overall. As I mentioned I believe I may have low testosterone, I have always been very active and lift weights very often. I eat right but I can't seem to push past 155 - 160 (6'0) and I notice I fatigue much easier than other males. This perplexed me as I know I excercise almost every day. So in a nutshell, I want to be healthy and strong, not a bodybuilding hulk.

With this in mind, I would like to ask you guys if my current planned cycle is sufficient for this. If not, please let me know your recommendations, as I value your input greatly.

Thanks again


'So in a nutshell, I want to be healthy and strong, not a bodybuilding hulk.'

Sorry, but pinning your a** will not turn you into a "body building hulk" overnight. It takes years of very hard work to get anywhere close to a Jay Cutler or Ronnie Physique. With an attitude like that, you will be lucky to just waste your money at the least. At the worst you could be looking at your new set of boobs in the mirror (see the post on why PCT and ancillaries are important).

I would reccommend quite a bit more research before starting a cycle. It would be a shame to see someone get hurt for lack of good information. There are plenty of highly informative vets on this board that may be willing to help.
Be safe man, Peace



I did not mean to offend with that sentence. I'm not sure what 'attitude' you are referring to. I believe wanting to be strong and healthy is a good thing, and I believe testosterone will help me with that because, as per the reasons I stated before, I feel like my natural testosterone levels are low.

Would someone be able to reference me to the PCT and anchillaries post?



Hi SnakeO,
Sorry, I didn't mean to come off like a dick.
It seems like there are many posts on this forum that contain the words "I don't wanna get too hyoouge!" while also stating that they would be interested in AAS use. I just wanted to state that AAS alone will not give you a giant physique.

If you already don't have your diet dialed in, and some serious time lifting under your belt, you will not have to worry about getting too big. AAS will simply not make this happen.

On another note, I will try to post the link for the guy with tits, who probably doesn't know what the letters PCT stand for ( the pictures are sad and hilarious at the same time).

As far as basics for PCT and general AAS use, I would suggest the newbie thread pinned to the top of this forum. Also, there is a decent discussion involving Prisoner22 and Bushido badboy (AKA bushy), about a "test taper" method that seems to be getting good reviews. If I can find the links I will try to get them out.

The only way to find out if you have low test levels would be to go to the doctor and tell him you would like to get them checked. As far as being healthy and strong overall, try to get a good diet dialed in.

You might be surprised at how much of an effect this may have on you. Try a back to basics approach on diet, sleeping and training. Not only is this necessary to reap the benefits of AAS, but you will find it better for overall energy levels.



Sorry for the double post,
I forgot something important. As others have stated in this thread, an anti-e would be beneficial while on cycle. A low dose of a-dex during your cycle would be good insurance.

There seems to be a bit of debate on this, as some prople don't use this at all, and some swear by it. I think that if you are prone to Gyno, or if you feel your nipples getting sensitive, this could be good to use.



Well, the attitude thing is the thought that you're hampering your own growth by thinking that you'll turn into the Hulk overnight if you work too hard. Short of insane doses and decades of long work with brilliant genetics, there is no way in hell you could get to Ronnie's mass.

Most of us (both naturals AND big juicers) have been sacrificing and eating and sacrificing and bleeding for years on end, sometimes decades, with the sole goal of getting bigger and we're not even close to that kind of mass.

Not that most of us want to be superheavy pros, but we know the sacrifice required to reach 'master of iron' status. Decades of work man. It's almost kind of insulting to think you can just get 'hyoooge' with a couple pin pricks and a few months. Louie Simmons has a bottle of test in his office and has been on a cycle for 28 straight years and most of us would not call him hulking. Not that I recommend that kind of AAS use mind you.

Just pointing out that the kind of ' I don't wanna get too big' attitude is self limiting and self-defeating, and insulting to others who understand the kind of pain and blood it takes to really get there. The people who think that way are the same people I surpassed a few years ago, and are STILL not making any progress because they don't want to work hard and bleed 'cuz they'll get too big.

If it were that easy, then just about every 135lb newb who lifted for a year or so would look like Arnold. And guys like me (also not a bodybuilder) who've put in 7-15 years of solid work would make Ronnie cry.

Now, I know you didn't mean it that way at all, but that's kind of how it comes off sometimes, and whether you realize it consciously or not, that is the underlying thought process you have right now. Sometimes Freud is right :). So, this is not a personal attack, it's just me explaining why you got jumped on a bit. It's a bit of a pet peeve for a lot of us.

It's really frustrating to hear that kind of phrase come from others in real life and on the internet in countless posts (while asking for us to help them), so sometimes we jump the gun after hearing it for the 100000000th time.

btw, I'm 6'1" and now at 230, and I feel like I have plenty of athletic ability. I was never really "fleet of foot" but I can still tightrope walk and rock climb. If I were to climb a lot more I'd probably bring my weight down about 20 lb or so, but you are definitely on the skinny side. Don't be afraid of putting on slabs of muscle--as long as you train athletically, you'll only improve with more muscle.


At 400/week of Sustanon 250, my E climbed to 105 in a couple of weeks. If you are using the standard formulation Sustanon, I recommend you use the half-life calculator in the link below:

You will see the optimum balance for injection is every day, EOD at the max to not roller coaster.
My point: I hope you get an AI and use it, and you dosage balance your injections.
Good luck.