T Nation

Struggling

Olympic Lifting
#1

Having a 'mare with my training at the moment. I think it’s a mixture of both mental and physical. It’s no so much that I’ve been lifting terribly (all the time anyway), its just everything is hurting all the damn time. My left knee has bursitis, that is getting better but still making me miss jerks. My right quad is really sore too.

I’ve been on The System since last July and since April 2010 I’ve added 80kg to my total 80/100-120/140 (nearly). I know squatting as much as I’m doing is going to hurt, but at the moment its irritating.

Any sage advice from more experiance lifters? I’ve watched the usual youtube vids, and I have a lifting hol in less than 3 weeks. But I’m so unenthused…

#2

deload maybe??

#3

[quote]Ed Ache wrote:
Having a 'mare with my training at the moment. I think it’s a mixture of both mental and physical. It’s no so much that I’ve been lifting terribly (all the time anyway), its just everything is hurting all the damn time. My left knee has bursitis, that is getting better but still making me miss jerks. My right quad is really sore too.

I’ve been on The System since last July and since April 2010 I’ve added 80kg to my total 80/100-120/140 (nearly). I know squatting as much as I’m doing is going to hurt, but at the moment its irritating.

Any sage advice from more experiance lifters? I’ve watched the usual youtube vids, and I have a lifting hol in less than 3 weeks. But I’m so unenthused…[/quote]

Are you sure its definitely bursitis? If not, it could be tendonosis which is common in this type of training. To get rid of that, just do some eccentric squats at the end of your workouts to deliberately piss off the tendon and promote healing (20 reps 4s down, 1s up). Also make sure you massage/foam roll your quads and suprapatellar pouch often to prevent tightness. Crossfrictional ice massage is useful on the knee as well.

As for the mental aspect, try to surround yourself with energetic training partners and minimize the stresses in your life. Maximize the recovery as much as possible. It is very common to feel unmotivated and have things feel like ‘work.’ Your body is going to resist you from going further, this is why Broz calls it the dark times. Its up to you to decide how far you want to go, but you have to fight for your goals. In your next meet, make sure you taper 2-3 weeks so that you can feel fresher and more motivated.

#4

[quote]GqArtguy wrote:

[quote]Ed Ache wrote:
Having a 'mare with my training at the moment. I think it’s a mixture of both mental and physical. It’s no so much that I’ve been lifting terribly (all the time anyway), its just everything is hurting all the damn time. My left knee has bursitis, that is getting better but still making me miss jerks. My right quad is really sore too.

I’ve been on The System since last July and since April 2010 I’ve added 80kg to my total 80/100-120/140 (nearly). I know squatting as much as I’m doing is going to hurt, but at the moment its irritating.

Any sage advice from more experiance lifters? I’ve watched the usual youtube vids, and I have a lifting hol in less than 3 weeks. But I’m so unenthused…[/quote]

Are you sure its definitely bursitis? If not, it could be tendonosis which is common in this type of training. To get rid of that, just do some eccentric squats at the end of your workouts to deliberately piss off the tendon and promote healing (20 reps 4s down, 1s up). Also make sure you massage/foam roll your quads and suprapatellar pouch often to prevent tightness. Crossfrictional ice massage is useful on the knee as well.

As for the mental aspect, try to surround yourself with energetic training partners and minimize the stresses in your life. Maximize the recovery as much as possible. It is very common to feel unmotivated and have things feel like ‘work.’ Your body is going to resist you from going further, this is why Broz calls it the dark times. Its up to you to decide how far you want to go, but you have to fight for your goals. In your next meet, make sure you taper 2-3 weeks so that you can feel fresher and more motivated. [/quote]

or that.

:slight_smile:

interesting about that prescription for tendonosis… never heard of that…

#5

[quote]alexus wrote:

[quote]GqArtguy wrote:

[quote]Ed Ache wrote:
Having a 'mare with my training at the moment. I think it’s a mixture of both mental and physical. It’s no so much that I’ve been lifting terribly (all the time anyway), its just everything is hurting all the damn time. My left knee has bursitis, that is getting better but still making me miss jerks. My right quad is really sore too.

I’ve been on The System since last July and since April 2010 I’ve added 80kg to my total 80/100-120/140 (nearly). I know squatting as much as I’m doing is going to hurt, but at the moment its irritating.

Any sage advice from more experiance lifters? I’ve watched the usual youtube vids, and I have a lifting hol in less than 3 weeks. But I’m so unenthused…[/quote]

Are you sure its definitely bursitis? If not, it could be tendonosis which is common in this type of training. To get rid of that, just do some eccentric squats at the end of your workouts to deliberately piss off the tendon and promote healing (20 reps 4s down, 1s up). Also make sure you massage/foam roll your quads and suprapatellar pouch often to prevent tightness. Crossfrictional ice massage is useful on the knee as well.

As for the mental aspect, try to surround yourself with energetic training partners and minimize the stresses in your life. Maximize the recovery as much as possible. It is very common to feel unmotivated and have things feel like ‘work.’ Your body is going to resist you from going further, this is why Broz calls it the dark times. Its up to you to decide how far you want to go, but you have to fight for your goals. In your next meet, make sure you taper 2-3 weeks so that you can feel fresher and more motivated. [/quote]

or that.

:slight_smile:

interesting about that prescription for tendonosis… never heard of that…
[/quote]

If anybody on here knows about the “dark times” it’s GqArtguy. Good advice from him.

I’m just curious, when you were talking about eccentric squats at the end of the workout, were those BW? Light weight?

#6

how does the eccentric stuff help rather than making it worse??

– genuinely curious. i heard that for biceps, too. slow negative curls to help tendonitis.

#7

[quote]GqArtguy wrote:

[quote]Ed Ache wrote:
Having a 'mare with my training at the moment. I think it’s a mixture of both mental and physical. It’s no so much that I’ve been lifting terribly (all the time anyway), its just everything is hurting all the damn time. My left knee has bursitis, that is getting better but still making me miss jerks. My right quad is really sore too.

I’ve been on The System since last July and since April 2010 I’ve added 80kg to my total 80/100-120/140 (nearly). I know squatting as much as I’m doing is going to hurt, but at the moment its irritating.

Any sage advice from more experiance lifters? I’ve watched the usual youtube vids, and I have a lifting hol in less than 3 weeks. But I’m so unenthused…[/quote]

Are you sure its definitely bursitis? If not, it could be tendonosis which is common in this type of training. To get rid of that, just do some eccentric squats at the end of your workouts to deliberately piss off the tendon and promote healing (20 reps 4s down, 1s up). Also make sure you massage/foam roll your quads and suprapatellar pouch often to prevent tightness. Crossfrictional ice massage is useful on the knee as well.

As for the mental aspect, try to surround yourself with energetic training partners and minimize the stresses in your life. Maximize the recovery as much as possible. It is very common to feel unmotivated and have things feel like ‘work.’ Your body is going to resist you from going further, this is why Broz calls it the dark times. Its up to you to decide how far you want to go, but you have to fight for your goals. In your next meet, make sure you taper 2-3 weeks so that you can feel fresher and more motivated. [/quote]

Re the bursitis. I’m fairly sure, through the gym I work at and my girlfriends family I know 5 Dr’s. A couple had a look and agree, My girlfriend has a first class degree in physio and I also have a pretty decent physio. It’s quite a specific part of my knee and if I tape my cap away from it it is a little better. I have had more physio since my last post and I have had more good days than bad. Still a drag trying to squat through it.

The mental side is the hardest for me. My club is 30miles away and due to work/petrol prices I can usualy get there twice a week. The other 10-15 sessions are at my work (a health club) or a gym near me with a platform. I’m really lucky with the situation I have, in terms of being able to train. But I do 90% of my training by myself. To top it off every single person who sees me squatting in work seems to feel the need to tell me I’ll be in a wheelchair by the time I’m 50. Or the fact I’m doing to much. Hopefully my lifting trip in a couple of weeks will fire me up.

Alexus- I’m fairly resistant to tapering outside of comps, but if thats what it takes I might end up doing it.

Thanks for the replys guys!

#8

[quote]TheJonty wrote:
I’m just curious, when you were talking about eccentric squats at the end of the workout, were those BW? Light weight?[/quote]

Yeah just BW. Nothing fancy, just piss it off to promote an inflammatory response and hence healing.

[quote]Ed Ache wrote:
Re the bursitis. I’m fairly sure, through the gym I work at and my girlfriends family I know 5 Dr’s. A couple had a look and agree, My girlfriend has a first class degree in physio and I also have a pretty decent physio. It’s quite a specific part of my knee and if I tape my cap away from it it is a little better. I have had more physio since my last post and I have had more good days than bad. Still a drag trying to squat through it.

The mental side is the hardest for me. My club is 30miles away and due to work/petrol prices I can usualy get there twice a week. The other 10-15 sessions are at my work (a health club) or a gym near me with a platform. I’m really lucky with the situation I have, in terms of being able to train. But I do 90% of my training by myself. To top it off every single person who sees me squatting in work seems to feel the need to tell me I’ll be in a wheelchair by the time I’m 50. Or the fact I’m doing to much. Hopefully my lifting trip in a couple of weeks will fire me up.

Alexus- I’m fairly resistant to tapering outside of comps, but if thats what it takes I might end up doing it.

Thanks for the replys guys![/quote]

Oftentimes for bursitis you need to rest or inject it. But if its getting better from your treating it, then just keep doing that. Jerk with the other leg if it takes off the edge from your angry knee. Again, hit up the soft tissue (look up Kelly Starrett’s mobilitywod for ideas) for the legs. Also ice religiously and strong amounts of anti-inflammatories. If the consensus is to rest until the bursitis subsides, then go for it. If it doesnt hurt to clean, then you can replace squats with cleans.

As for the mental side, see if you can find a training partner to meet you for a couple days of the week or work something out with a person/group where you guys switch off on training locations. Maybe take training vacations or camps to keep you accountable or motivated. Finally, wear some earphones so that coworkers wont complain to you about how youre working harder in a day than most people do in a week.

#9

Cheers for the words Arty, the last sentence of your post makes me feel better.

Gods of training threw me a bone yesterday (27/3/12)4 days after being bummed to hell, to help eleviate the dispare.

FS 70x5/120x1/140x1/155x1/145x2/145x2
4hours
BS 70x5/120x2/150x1/170x1/160x2/160x2
6hours
C&J 50x2,2,2/70x2/90x2/110x1/120x1/130x1/140x miss jerk/140x1 5kg PB/145xClean damn close jerk/145x Clean
Snatch pause at knee 60x2/60x2/80x2/80x2/80x2/90x1/100x1/105x1/110x1 then just snatched 115 equalled my current snatch pb.

Cant explain just how close to a 10kg pb clean and jerk I came.

#10

It really annoys me when people say no wonder you have pains, you work too hard, your there too long. When they say its ego, i can’t find the words to tell them that its not…

So I just tell them F*&^K off.

#11

I’m 50 and squat ATG, so they can stuff that in their pipe and stick it up their bum.

#12

hope you are feeling a bit better now…

i have no idea about when to back off vs when to suck it up and keep on.
pretty sure i regularly make errors both ways…

really does suck, though, how quick people are to tell you to back off. the human body is capable of so very much more than we tend to think… and i guess we have to believe that to have any hope in closer approximating that.

best wishes, anyway.

#13

[quote]alexus wrote:
really does suck, though, how quick people are to tell you to back off. the human body is capable of so very much more than we tend to think… and i guess we have to believe that to have any hope in closer approximating that.[/quote]

This is why I never ever complain about anything hurting ever. Nobody will ever understand :slight_smile: Plus saying things out loud makes them more true :wink:

#14

yeah. think that is why i do best with a program. because then i’m like ‘just do the program’. have light days when the program says to have light days and suck it up when the program says to suck it up.

saying things out loud certainly does make them true - especially for anything with a psychological component. anything to do with pain or what one can or cannot do…

i learned that athletes don’t have higher tolerance to pain than non-athletes…

but they do have the ability to bear it. does the person with fibromyalgia experience more pain upon walking than the marathon runner on running? of course not. what is the difference? the person with fibromyalgia doesn’t walk because of it whereas the marathon runner…

#15

[quote]alexus wrote:
hope you are feeling a bit better now…

i have no idea about when to back off vs when to suck it up and keep on.
pretty sure i regularly make errors both ways…

really does suck, though, how quick people are to tell you to back off. the human body is capable of so very much more than we tend to think… and i guess we have to believe that to have any hope in closer approximating that.

best wishes, anyway.[/quote]

I am. Thank you. That’s the beauty of social media now, can come to places like this and talk to like minded people. Just Sucks trying to train when you’re sore and tired, and you’ve got dozens of people telling you to rest.

Got this weekend off lifting, 2days off is the longest I’ve had since last June, so I’m feeling better already. Thanks for the concern :slight_smile:

#16

well i was feeling particular bad since the first thing out of my mouth was ‘take a deload’ :-/

fortunately places like this mean i can open my mouth fairly low risk since other people who know far more than me can be relied on to chime in and counter me when i’m wrong.

and of course other people here have been following along with your training a lot more closely than me and have a much better idea of where you might be expected to be at…

i’d never heard of the ‘dark times’ before, actually…

i just know that in my own case a couple days off and i’m usually chomping on the bit to get back into lifting… and a couple days off also seems to have a wondrous effect on cranky joints…

i’m curious about the dark times, now. maybe i’m going through some of that with my squat…

#17

actually…

i think one of the best things about these forums is that there are so many people here. and people have different ideas…

IRL sucks 'cause often you just get one. i like variety. means i get to pick and choose and try and find my own truth…

#18

[quote]alexus wrote:
actually…

i think one of the best things about these forums is that there are so many people here. and people have different ideas…

IRL sucks 'cause often you just get one. i like variety. means i get to pick and choose and try and find my own truth…[/quote]

While it can be a great thing to be able to sift through all the information (and crap) out there and figure out what you believe in and what works for you, sometimes it’s a boon to have just one coach to tell you what to do. If you actually listen to them, it forces you to have direction and focus that some would otherwise lose, likely via paralysis by analysis. And while nobody knows your body better than you, sometimes it helps to have that one person there telling you to suck it up and clean the sand out of your vagina (which is generally more effective when you tell it to men, but you get my drift).

#19

I don’t have idiots tell me what to do…people realise the first thing I do is FS :stuck_out_tongue: then I Sn heavy, CJ heavy…one set of wide grip pull ups to max then ab and back work, done, stretch down…

How you feeling now Ed? I always train with Oxman or Phil and or my Bro. Next 4 weeks will be tougher as they are off for easter break.

Koing

#20

[quote]TheJonty wrote:

[quote]alexus wrote:
actually…

i think one of the best things about these forums is that there are so many people here. and people have different ideas…

IRL sucks 'cause often you just get one. i like variety. means i get to pick and choose and try and find my own truth…[/quote]

While it can be a great thing to be able to sift through all the information (and crap) out there and figure out what you believe in and what works for you, sometimes it’s a boon to have just one coach to tell you what to do. If you actually listen to them, it forces you to have direction and focus that some would otherwise lose, likely via paralysis by analysis. And while nobody knows your body better than you, sometimes it helps to have that one person there telling you to suck it up and clean the sand out of your vagina (which is generally more effective when you tell it to men, but you get my drift).[/quote]

I’d love to just have a coach tell me what to do.

I really hate trying to figure it out on my own because I have no idea what I’m doing :stuck_out_tongue: