Gents, I need advice on PCT after 2 years of TRT. I’m 40 and have been on 35mg of test and 250IU of HCG eod. Although I feel good I want to come off and see if my natural levels which were borderline when I started will return.
I’m confident my doctor will prescribe the required meds but I’ve not sure what I need to ask for.
Can someone recommend a protocol and give me an idea of what to expect. All advice is appreciated.
Any reason why you’re coming off? I’m curious is all.
As far as the best method to come off, that’s a matter of debate. You can treat it like any other cycle and simply run a normal pct or you can run an extended version. Something like nolva 40/40/20/20/10/10 would be appropriate for this particular circumstance.
It’s hard to explain mate. I accept that TRT is for life I just to prove to myself that I can’t function well naturally. If I give a restart a chance and it doesn’t work then there’s no debate and I just keep going with TRT.
Apologies but I’ve only been on the TRT forum and don’t understand how you’ve broken down the nolva dosages. How does that work? Also do you have any experience or heard of others successfully getting back to pre TRT levels after two years in test?
For pct the breakdown is nolvadex (tamoxifen) at 40mg/d for two weeks, then 20mg/d for two weeks, then 10mg/d for two weeks. It’s longer than typical pct, but part of that is because you’re coming off after two years. Maybe a standard four week pct would work, but it’s worth the extra risk to run it out longer.
As for total recovery, the answer is “it depends”. No two people are alike in this regard, so it’s possible that you bounce back just fine or you come back very low and stay there for months and need to go back on. No way to know until you’ve done pct and waited for blood work.
You’ll want blood work at least a month after you complete pct, but pushing it out to six or even eight weeks would be better. The longer you’re off everything the better the dataset is (up to a certain point).
If i wanted any chance of recovering, I’d do a taper plus a SERM pct.
SB
I personally think that if your healthy and there is no pre existing medical conditions stopping you then you will def get back to pre TRT levels. It might take a little bit but the majority of people do recover. There seems to be this thought process where if you stay on testosterone or steroids for more then 3-4 months you will never be the same. You have people who use aas (at doss way above trt) for years then stop and recover. I’m by noeans suggesting someone do that I’m just putting it out there.
That brings me to my next point. Why did you start trt? What were your natural levels? I ask because if you are able to recover to natural levels then what? Your bsck to where you were before trt. I understand you want to see if you can get back there if “back there” wasn’t a bad spot I understand the reason for this but again that brings me back to why start trt unless you need it.
Anyways i second the idea of a taper and serm pct. Altho I’d be more inclined to suggest maybe looking into a dual sern pct of nolva and clomid.
@oz_dude This is a good point that I had not explored. SB is a very smart guy and he probably knows more about a tapering protocol than anyone else on here.
Thanks for the reply.
What meds do I need and how do I do it?
Thanks - I’ll make an appointment with my doctor and see how I go.
I started TRT after tests revealed I had normal test levels but elevated SHBG and E2 which left me with very low free T. My doc tested my levels after I presented with symptoms of fatigue, low libido, change in body comp despite training consistently and maintaining a good diet. Doc offered to start me on TRT to see if my symptoms improved. I felt great on TRT and with the improved muscle mass and libido I thought I’d just stay on - why wouldn’t I? As time went on I got a niggling feeling that I should come off and confirm that it’s was the test making me feel great and not the increased gains and libido. So here I am.
I’ve never we used gear previously so PCT, serms, taper etc are all new to me.
Do I taper off the test? Keep going with HCG?
That makes sense I understand this logic. I’m actually suprised the doc was so gun ho to start you on testosterone. Usually docs aren’t the most eager to start trt and will try other avenues first. Your particular situation sounds like you would have been a good candidate for controlling rhw estrogen and trying to lower shbg before using trt. When you come off and if you recover (I think you will) and your having the same issues as before high E2 high shbg talk to your doc about alternatives to fix these problems before going back to trt.
You stop the hcg when you introduce the serm @Singhbuilder will be able to give you a solid taper protocol it’s really simple I just can’t remember the doses off the top of my head
So here is the link to my HPTA restart log. It lists everything I used. Off the top of my head, with the taper I didnt even use hCG. It was just a combo of Nolva and Clomid. Have a read through it.
SB
You can’t fix high SHBG naturally, it’s one of those things that is set in stone once elevated, it will only increase as you age and Free T will always be affected negatively.
I disagree completely. I’m not sure where you are getting this info maybe that’s the case for you but there is an abundance of information on ways to lower shbg thru diet and supplements and likewise for raising free testosterone.
Im not promising the OP its going to work but if your testosterone levels are not bad it’s def worth a try before jumping to trt.
Crank up the HCG for at least 3 months, don’t even contemplate stopping it before then.
Thats my 2 cents.
Thanks. I’ll take a look.
ok im on the same journey as @oz_dude. Rite now I have been off testosterone for 2 weeks at least and have been doing 150i.u of HCG ED and its been 2 weeks so far I was going to run the HCG for at least one more week then Start nolvadex.
Here is something that has me puzzled. About a year and half ago I was doing HCG mono therapy and it had my TT and FT through the roof and E2 was hard to control. I was doing 500 i.u 3 times a week. Now that I’m attempting this restart and im only doing 150i.u Ed and my TT and everything else is super low. Here are my labs based off of just using HCG
If anyone could give some advice it would be really helpful and could possibly even help @oz_dude
I read your successful taper restart before this blog. Do you really feel its worth tapering off moderate TRT doses though? You’re already only on say 120mg a week. It’s not alot. Has you in normal testosterone ranges, what would be the point of the taper towards a more “successful” restart. You feel your body will start slowly producing its own test as your levels get really low from minor doses of exogenous test? I can’t see the point on low doses? Help me open my eyes if it’s obvious because I had my last shot 6 days ago and will be trying a slow/long restart very soon.
Was anyone able to look at my labs?
I see your labs but they don’t really tell anyone anything. We already know you will be hypogonadal because you have been on T for 2 years.
So lab work isn’t going to do much for us here. You need to fire up the HCG for a couple months and then get lab work while on the HCG to see if your boys are still capable of functioning.
PS 250 iu probably won’t do much for you because your leydig cells are desensitized from testosterone use, but maybe you never know. Just get lab work while on the HCG to make sure the balls are working.
For this test you really only need TT and E2. The other stuff is not important at this time.
