T Nation

Stopped T After 2 Years On, 1st Bloods Done. What’s Next?


#1

Hey there

First of all I’d like to say that I will do a more thorough blood work later on this summer. I kept this one minimal for reasons below.

Context: I’ve been injecting T non stop for 2 years. Was 27yo when I got started, turning 30 in 3 weeks (damn).
Mostly T around 150mg/wk with short anabolic cycles every other month or so, 4-6wk on 6-8wk off always. My goal was to reach 6’3 230lbs 10% fat and I came a tiny bit short of it, 225 10.5% on one of my DXAs iirc. That was close… eventually I decided that I was done with it all and it was time to hop off.

As a natural I had total T 800 ng/dl free T 1% and e2 10 pg/ml. Also high cholesterol and low insulin, so it’s rather clear my low carb diet wasn’t suiting me at all at the time, but it took me a lot of personal research lately to get a better grasp. I’ve eventually halved my LDL in the process.

I’ve done TRT for 3 of the first 4 months of 2018, and a 4 weeks trest*tbol run in March. Last injection April 2nd.

Then I ran this PCT:

  • HCG 500iu April 2,4,6,8,10,12th
  • Nolva (doses PER WEEK) 60/60/40/30/20/10/5 last quarter tab was on May 27th. I went with my conviction that SERMs are mega overdosed on forums and even on Pubmed quite often.
  • Asin 6.25mg at most 2x per week, mostly because I’ve had a blood test on TRT where T and e2 were 600/60, and a couple other bloods on trt where SHBG was low. So I figured I’d benefit from a bit of AI.

Been feeling pretty good generally besides a noticeable drop at the gym - no big deal. Libido is back to what it was pre-TRT; very low, but very functional when I’m with a girl.

Bloods drawn on June 6th so 10 days after the last 5mg of Nolva:
- Total T 346 ng/dl RANGE {264-916}
- LH 2.9 mIU/ml RANGE {1.7-8.6}
- FSH 3.4 mIU/ml RANGE {1.5-12.4}
- E2 10.8 pg/ml RANGE {7.6-42.6}

I think using clomid now might def be a good idea to support the HPTA some more? I’d guess that mid-high range LH and FSH would yield mid-range T and E2 at least. I also have torem on hand and I’m thinking of combining both doing 12.5/30mg eod or e3d.

What would you suggest?


#2

Are your sure your estrogen was that low naturally?

The e2 numbers you have thrown around are scary. I hope you aren’t keeping it that low.

When my e2 was 17 (on the same test you are using) I felt like DOG SHIT. I was artificially lowering it though. should be in a good ratio to test. As an example, im on TRT, have a TT of 1100, and my e2 is 29-30.

Low E2 will be detrimental to your recovery.

(sorry I cant comment on your PCT issue, but get the e2 thing under control)


#3

Of course 100% naturally.

I remember how I tried clomid as a monotherapy for a month prior to injecting T. 25mg eod which is probably too much in and of itself? Idk. Anyways e2 was still under 20 even with clomid.

I guess I’m used to it at this point. My buddy told me to supplement dbol lol.


#4

@alphagunner I found this from 2 months prior to my first injection of T

Total T LC/MS 806 ng/dl RANGE {348-1197}
Free T 8.5 pg/ml LOW RANGE {9.3-26.5}
- LH 5.1 mIU/ml RANGE {1.7-8.6}
- FSH 8.0 mIU/ml RANGE {1.5-12.4}
-Estradiol 10.1 pg/ml RANGE {7.6-42.6}

This lead me to try clomid before getting told “just do T” by some randoms on Reddit who were also telling me I wasn’t even trying when I wasn’t happy with my strength gains.

On the other hand e2 has always come back a bit too high when I was “on”. Last bloods back in March I was on 100mg of Test per week thinking I’d need no AI at this dose… total T 600 e2 60. WTH.


#5

Have you ever had your SHBG checked? that’s key


#6

Came back low on TRT a couple times, and e2 was higher than aimed

Albumin being in range SHBG can only be high with free T around 1% in 2017. Since e2 is mostly formed from free T I’ve come to think that e2 and SHBG are inversely correlated which is what would make sense from a physiological standpoint.

And also for many others apparently; view below

negative relationship between SHBG levels and the E2/T ratio

But at the same time my T isn’t high enough so I don’t want to have SHBG low now. It all screams “use clomid” to me ha.


#7

High TT and low free test is always high SHBG.

Clomid increases SHBG.