T Nation

Steroids and the Newbie

Okay, this is my first post. I’ve read the rules and rather than adding to all the posts out there I thought I’d start anew.

I am 43, 5 ft 7 and 200lbs and Iâ??ve been training sinceâ?¦well, 1988 when I joined the Royal Marines â?? Yup, Iâ??m a Limie as you guys (and gals) will call me ï??
Anyway, I have been training hard in the gym and home for the past three years, have a very good diet and well-toned. Yet despite eating nearly 2000 calories a day I never seem to put on that much weight. I never have!!!

But bearing in mind I am NOT a body builder but more a cardio man that wouldnâ??t surprise. That said for the past 2 years odd itâ??s been more about building muscle and looking/feeling good than any serious sporting events (after all Iâ??m getting OLD!!!)

Anyway, despite my efforts in the gym and at home and after ramping up my intake (close to 3,000 cals/day) Iâ??ve only gained a small amount. Iâ??ve been religiously reading and updating my workouts (so that I am constantly stressing myself in different ways) and ensuring I have good nutrition.

A typical days nutrition consist of four shakes (Whey Protein, Mass Effect Weight gainer, Mesh 200 Creatine, Scots Oats, Carbo load) on top of 3 good meals a day (breakfast eggs, fruit, coffee; lunch tuna/chicken and salad and dinner rice/chicken/steak etc) plus I have snacks of nuts, cheese, raisins. So I know I am getting good nutrition. My weight has steadily grown from 156lbs to 192lbs over the past two years but in the last 5 months plateaued.

A year ago I started looking into steroids and there was a lot of confusing information. So many different choices, so many side effects and way of reducing them, so many conflicting ideas. There also seems to be a lot of people willing to give information but deciphering the good from the bad came the next challenge. Initially I looked at Dianabol on its own but soon found out that Iâ??d merely lose everything I gained once I came of it. I felt Testosterone was a â??very heavyâ?? way to go so looked at staking with Deca-Durabolin.

Bit by bit I waddled the information down and taken my time digesting information and I am almost ready to take the plunge. I say â??almostâ?? â?? I still want to get up to 230lbs first unless of course I really have hit a plateau. Only time will tell.

So this post is more fact finding. I have altered my cycle numerous times based on the information I have found over the past 11 months or so. I was going to cycle Dianabol with Deca-Durabolin but I was wanting a much slower acting steroid rather than just â??massing upâ?? (my research shows that Dianabol seems to have a lot of water retention compared to Deca). There also seemed to be issued with blood pressure something that, at 43, thought would be advisable to miss out.

I am realistic that I expect losses after the cycle has finished BUT didnâ??t want to lose everything. After more research and a lot of information I opted for Testosterone Enanthate and Deca-Durabolin. I was (and am still) concerned with some of the side effects of Deca hence the PCT additions. For this reason I opted to use both Clomid and Nolvadex in PCT to cover all angles. However, that itself has added some confusion as many people advise using Arimidex instead of Nolvadex when using Deca.

Then came the issue surrounding HGC and when to add it to the cycle â?? during cycle or PCT? It seems there is common belief that post-cycle would aid natural testosterone recovery but it seems unfounded. Administering HGC causes further inhibition of the HPTA feedback loop through elevated testosterone (and thus oestrogen) thus worsening the recovery situation. Iâ??ve opted to include dosages (500/1000IU per day) during my cycle.

My intended cycle (which once altered yet again through this post) is intended to be posted on this site with weekly photos (thinking it may be useful to other â??newbiesâ??). Anyway, itâ??s a standard 12 week cycle (again as recommended):

Week Enanthate Deca-Durabolin Proviron Nolvadex Clomid Tribulus
1 1ml 200mg
2 2ml 400mg
3 2ml 400mg 25mg/day
4 2ml 200mg 20mg/day
5 2ml 200mg 25mg/day
6 2ml 200mg 20mg/day
7 2ml 200mg 25mg/day
8 1ml 20mg/day
9 750mg/day
10 750mg/day
11 50mg/day 750mg/day
12 50mg/day 750mg/day

Questions to the forum are thus:

  1. The Test/Deca ratio has been set up as suggested through a number of sites (most people seem to agree). That said I have also come across the ration of 2:1 but as a novice would this be too strong - as a complete beginner wanting modest gains and thus should the Test be increased or left as it is?

  2. There is also a debate on whether I should drop the Deca-Durabolin as a newbie and just start with Test. This would uniquely identify whether Test was a good starting point rather than Deca/Dianabol. Iâ??ve also been told that if I cannot gain on a Test/Deca stack then I never willâ?¦.so is it worth splitting them out to identify which works best or just stack them as suggested?

  3. There seems to be conflicting information as to the use of Deca and then PCT with Nolvadex. Many seem to suggest that the Deca/Nolvadex combination is a bad thing and that an AI should be used (such as Arimidex). This could be old vs. new information over the past 12 months so suggestions please.

  4. In regards to the effects of elevated estrogen (leading to dreaded â??man titsâ??), if at ANY point during a cycle you start to see/feel the effects, do you simply stop the cycle and go to PCT OR continue the cycle and start using Proviron/ Nolvadex to counter the effects. Issue here is that using these will effectively make the muscle gain process stop so is there a point in continuing?

  5. When to use an HGC. Again two different camps here but from my research its best to use during the cycle (using at the end has the potential to raise estrogen levels via aromatisation of the natural testosterone = gynecomastia/man tits!!!). Again being a beginner and wanting to reduce possible side effects I wanted to reduce testicular atrophy.

Overall
I will be taking the plunge BUT not until I have further clarified what my cycle should be and once Iâ??m sure I canâ??t gain much more. Everyone is different and thus get different results from different cycles. Iâ??m after a fairly modest 10lb overall gain over a twelve month period (couple of cycles) after water retention has subsided. Iâ??ll value everyoneâ??s thoughts but kindly ask that, as a newbie, donâ??t give me too hard a time â?? we all have to learn and the Vets out there are sure to give some good (but also harsh at times) advice.

thanks for everyone help :slight_smile:

it’s too much text for anyone to be bothered reading.

Give us your:
Age
Height/weight
bodyfat
cycle history
proposed cycle

[quote]Sniper45 wrote:
Yet despite eating nearly 2000 calories a day I never seem to put on that much weight. I never have!!!

Anyway, despite my efforts in the gym and at home and after ramping up my intake (close to 3,000 cals/day) Iâ??ve only gained a small amount. Iâ??ve been religiously reading and updating my workouts (so that I am constantly stressing myself in different ways) and ensuring I have good nutrition.

[/quote]

You don’t eat enough as it is, let alone eat enough to let’s gear do it’s job effectively. 200 lbs, but only 2000 cals?? That’s a pretty big caloric deficit (I’m of course making a couple of assumptions). Even 3000 cals is pretty low if you’re looking to add size at your current stats. I’d really jack up the food intake for a while, and see if that helps you get past your current plateau before turning to gear for size.

As I said before, you don’t currently eat enough to add size when you’re off, so adding gear with that caloric deficit won’t do much for you.

Also 5’7", 200 lbs and you claim to be lean… pics.