[quote]MrZsasz wrote:
Why? Many people on this board did. And I am willing to bet that the gained more benefit from their first cycle because they did.
And just to be clear, I use benefit to refer to physical gains, knowledge about their body and it’s reaction to a cycle, ability to learn from and correct any mistakes made, and a clarification of future goals.
I could throw out some names of people that exemplify this but I don’t want to single them out.
And I agree that Newb, for instance, is being very mature. But you will notice that he is not looking to start a cycle today or has already started one and is looking for people to fix it. I put him in the “seriously considering” category rather than the “I’m going to do it anyway” one.[/quote]
I did as well. I waited till I was 30, but had 90% of my overall gains between the ages of 14 and 16. I was squatting 400 lbs and benching 315 at 16.
Gaining at a huge rate was extremely motivating back then. The next 14 years I eked out another 10% or so on my lifts and consider I was pretty close to my genetic max at 230lbs at 8% bf.
Were those last 14 years and 10% worth it? Could I have done bigger and better things back then if I decided to use at 18? Possibly. I was a top ranked track and field athlete.
I stalled out shortly afterwards and could not improve my scores. It was frustrating to say the least. Back problems didn’t help either. I don’t have any regrets though. I’m just throwing it on the table.
I find it unrealistic for one to wait till they 25 or 30, to take their training to the next level.
Why? Many people on this board did. And I am willing to bet that the gained more benefit from their first cycle because they did.
[/quote]
I think its because of the society that we live in today. I belive the more fitting word should be “uncommon” which in some ways makes the expectation to wait until you are 25-30 unrealistic.
Just like the exapmle given earlier, it is very uncommon for someone to wait until they are 25-30 to have sex which makes the expectation for them to do so a bit unrealistic.
AAS are one of the biggest fad of our society right now and teens are involved in it wheather we like or not.
The point is, since they are more than likely going to use them anyway, it is wise to give them the knowlege necassary to do so in as safe manner. This does not mean that we advocate teens to use, its just a parallel to an already existing phenomenon.
[quote]Dopamineloveaffa wrote:
Growing_Boy wrote:
Responsible teenagers are rare. At times its more of an oxymoron. A jock I know at my local high school is proof. He started turning yellow, he was so responsible with this SD administration. I think responsible is a rather ambiguous term.
I agree, the odds are greater that someone younger will misuse over someone older.
Young girls can misuse the birth control pill and become pregnant if that is any kind of parallel. Getting pregnant is a pretty serious outcome, probably more so than what can happen with a male teenager using steroids.
Many girls won’t take the pill the same time every day, will skip days, or will continue having sex while taking the pill when it was not properly digested due to illness.
If steroid use could be supervised by a physician we wouldn’t be having a lot of these problems. A doctor could check liver function, estradiol levels, etc… to ensure safe use. Similar to how doctors prescribe different birth control pills to girls according to their unique physiology.
We do not have the option of doctor supervision so girls have a leg up with respect to hormone use. Maybe our children will have this opportunity in the future, who knows. One can only wish, especially for the older population.[/quote]
I just watched a program on FX called “30 days”, and it was on steroid usage. The guy was under a docs supervision and went infertile. Scary shit.
It doesn’t seem all that different (comparatively) to steroid abuse. And most (if not all) sides can be avoided on steroids with proper care.
That said, anyone who abuses steroids deserves what’s coming to them. Especially if people with more experience have said don’t.
Now I ask you - do any of the teenagers asking about AAS post pics and stats? No. They simply come on here and say dumb shit like “Yo, can i drink the winny?”
Now if someone mature enough came along and asked… that a different story.
[quote]bushidobadboy wrote:
BTW, the reason the WHO didn’t end up using test as a male contraceptive? Because it was too unreliable. Some folks were still ‘firing on all cylinders’ despite being administered 200mg/wk test.[/quote]
Man that sounds like good birth control if it actually worked. You’d be making great gains while still being horny as fuck?
[quote]bushidobadboy wrote:
edk3335 wrote:
I just watched a program on FX called “30 days”, and it was on steroid usage. The guy was under a docs supervision and went infertile. Scary shit
I didn’t watch the program, but the guy didn’t ‘go infertile’, he simply became temporarily lacking in sperm production, or the sperm he was producing were immotile.
The WHO themselves piloted the use of testosterone as a method of birth control, so why didn’t the programme mention this? Oh yeah, because they wanted to scare you, of course. If they did mention it, they probably glossed over the fact that all birth controls are reversible. If not, it’s called sterilisation, not birth control.
BTW, the reason the WHO didn’t end up using test as a male contraceptive? Because it was too unreliable. Some folks were still ‘firing on all cylinders’ despite being administered 200mg/wk test.
Bushy[/quote]
I watched this program last night as well. Piss poor journalism from start to finish. The participant did no real research of his own and was ill-informed as to the effects of his regimen, the most startling example being the temporary infertility bushy explained above.
I was dumbfounded at how little this guy and his wife knew about what he was doing. Then the show goes on to lose all credibility by sensationalizing a teen suicide that was blamed on steroid use.
[quote]arthursaxon wrote:
I watched this program last night as well. Piss poor journalism from start to finish. The participant did no real research of his own and was ill-informed as to the effects of his regimen, the most startling example being the temporary infertility bushy explained above.
I was dumbfounded at how little this guy and his wife knew about what he was doing. Then the show goes on to lose all credibility by sensationalizing a teen suicide that was blamed on steroid use.
Shame on you, Morgan Spurlock.[/quote]
Got a YouTube link or something? I like watching comedy.
[quote]Makavali wrote:
arthursaxon wrote:
I watched this program last night as well. Piss poor journalism from start to finish. The participant did no real research of his own and was ill-informed as to the effects of his regimen, the most startling example being the temporary infertility bushy explained above.
I was dumbfounded at how little this guy and his wife knew about what he was doing. Then the show goes on to lose all credibility by sensationalizing a teen suicide that was blamed on steroid use.
Shame on you, Morgan Spurlock.
Got a YouTube link or something? I like watching comedy.[/quote]
The show was atrociously biased against any kind of steroid use, the guy didnt even give it a try, he had a total of 2 or 3 test shots and took 1 iu HGH for less than two weeks. The whole thing was so ill informed I stopped watching half way through.
[quote]tpepper88 wrote:
Makavali wrote:
arthursaxon wrote:
I watched this program last night as well. Piss poor journalism from start to finish. The participant did no real research of his own and was ill-informed as to the effects of his regimen, the most startling example being the temporary infertility bushy explained above.
I was dumbfounded at how little this guy and his wife knew about what he was doing. Then the show goes on to lose all credibility by sensationalizing a teen suicide that was blamed on steroid use.
Shame on you, Morgan Spurlock.
Got a YouTube link or something? I like watching comedy.
The show was atrociously biased against any kind of steroid use, the guy didnt even give it a try, he had a total of 2 or 3 test shots and took 1 iu HGH for less than two weeks. The whole thing was so ill informed I stopped watching half way through. [/quote]
that whole show was a farce…
The Dr gives this guy test and never tell him his sperm count will-- WILL go down and gives him a mountain of pills (micro nutrients) Shit even Bob Cicherillo tells him to lay off the pills… and his wife!?
Forget the body dude there is the really big problem in you life…
It was so disingenuous and riddled with ignorance…
At best it was Very Lazy journalism at worst it was fiction…
THANK YOU FOR THIS POST. I wish more people could see as clearly as you can.
PS- an anecdotal story…
I used Superdrol in HS. Gained 18 lbs in 4 weeks. Buddies from the football team wanted to know what it was and use it, and I said no. Ya know why? They literally said… “Dude, couldn’t we just take like five of them bro, and get twice as big?”
Teenagers are USUALLY idiots. Shit, I was, for using superdrol.
Problem is… so are a lot of adults. I know guys that are 25-30 years old shooting test without sterlizing their skin first. Reusing needles. Guys that pop D-bol for a while and then get a hold of some injectable stuff and stack it, not even knowing what it is. no PCT.
It comes down to this:
Idiots give steroids a bad name, and Idiots come in all ages, shapes, and sizes. Idiots, not young people exclusively, should be banned from steroid use… not those that are under the magical age of 21.
ohhh and in response to the 30 days TV show… It was a fallacy. Kinda like the MTV true life I’m on Steroids with the gay guy that hated his life (depression) in the first place.
I agree. One has to be smart enough or resourceful enough to curb the side effects of steroid use AT ANY AGE. Bottom line is, if you don’t know how to prevent the side effects of steroids then you shouldn’t be using. That includes the correct use of ancillaries and PCT.
The primary differance with teenagers are the additional side effects. Estrogen has to be kept in a much narrower range to prevent premature closing of the growth plates.
The effects of hormones on development also has to be considered. Males can withstand higher levels of androgens than females without receiving side effects. They have more of a “slop factor” if you will.
I feel the same way with women using steroids. At what dosage and compound do side effects start showing up. Since women naturally have testosterone, steroids aren’t totally foreign to a woman’s body, just as estrogen isn’t foreign to a man’s body.
There’s risk with everything. If people want to be 100% safe they shouldn’t be considering steroids for ergogenic reasons. It’s not “healthy” for anyone to be on a gram of test a week. The dosage makes the poison. It becomes harder and harder to mitigate side effects the higher you go in dose.
The higher the competitiveness the more people are willing to sacrifice the side effects. High level bodybuilders, strongmen, powerlifters, and other athletes are willing to arguably shave a few years off their life to be the best of the best. Above HRT levels for extended periods of time increase the probability one will have health problems.
Steroids can be healthy if one is naturally deficient in testosterone and are brought up to normal levels. They can also be considered “healthy” for the intended uses they were approved for i.e. wasting diseases, anemia, osteoporosis/osteopenia, arthritis, etc… You have to weigh the pros and cons of each.
Great topic. I agree with the op totally. Who says a teenager cannot use steroids responsibly? I started competing at 18 and was also using steroids at 18. I was lucky however because I trained in a gym full of national level competitors and a few pros who taught me what to use, how much and when. They also taught me how to diet and train. I did very well competing as a teenager more because of the guidance I had then my own knowledge.
So how does an average teenager, training at a normal gym learn these things? I really can not answer that. If I had to learn on my own what I was taught about diet, drugs, training and competing while getting ready for my first contest it would have took a great deal of time and I probably would not have used the drugs as responsibly as I did or have since.
The problem is that teenagers read flex magazine and really believe that so and so gets his chest so big from his special workout regime. I remember when I started to really learn that all these bodybuilders at the gym I trained at, who I idolized at the time, were all on steroids. It was a real eye opener.
So I guess if the teenager is doing it for the right reasons and knows what the hell he is doing then why not. I did not have any lasting ill effects from using steroids from the time I was 17 and I would repeat it if I could do it over.BTW I am 33 now
[quote]Growing_Boy wrote:
Responsible teenagers are rare. At times its more of an oxymoron. A jock I know at my local high school is proof. He started turning yellow, he was so responsible with this SD administration. I think responsible is a rather ambiguous term. [/quote]
I have never, ever seen anyone develop jaundice from steroid use. Please tell me more.