T Nation

Starting the Transformation Soon...


#1

First,hi,this is my first post here :slight_smile:

I am 16 year old,with 110kgs and 193 cms in height.
I play basketball in a club,but going to pause this summer.I decided to use it to straighten up my life.
My goal is this: Burn Fat,Build muscle,get to 91kgs until September 1st,starting from 12th June (or 10th,will see).

So,my diet plan is made,my mind is ready,I read a lot of articles online,got advice from few forums,but decided to check the facts here.

Now,the only problem is training.
I thought about combining Weights and Cardio,but not sure in which schedule.
I would like to do both of them in one day,but everyone says that it is bad then.

So,I thought about this:

Day1 - Weights
Day2 - Cardio
Day3 - Rest
Day4 - Weights
Day5 - Cardio
Day6 - Rest
Day7 - Cardio

Is it good?
And after Weights day,should I do any kind of cardio?
play basketball,soccer?

Can I do Cardio in morning (Bike 15kms,Swim,Bike 15kms again),rest for 8 hours,then weights?
What time of the day is too late for training?
Jumping rope is considered cardio as a warmup for weights?

And one more thing...is my goal possible?

Thank you in advance,Loco :slight_smile:


#2

Why don't you start with starting strength, learn all the compounds correctly that includes power cleans. After you've built your base str. you can move onto somthing else be it a split or continue with someone like a 5x5(madcow). For starting strength since your a big guy you don't need to worry about eating more, just clean your diet up some or not at all tbh and just get strong, that will take anywhere from 3-6 months.

Honestly I wouldn't even try to lose weight, just lift and get big and the weight will take care of itself. I know it sucks to be 16 and weigh alot but finding a plan and if you can stick to it will turn you into a big muscular 16 year old.

Ok here is why I suggested starting strength over a 4 day split because it will come up.
1. The guy who started this, Ripetoe is a very well know strength coach who actually specializes in kids your age. The plan was made for them and is proven to get the best results.

  1. It's a novice program. Been alot of write ups on it so if you do what your supposed to do and nothing else you will get results, learn about lifting. You can even find the excell program that you can plug your starting numbers in and you don't even have to do anything.
    3.Learn some basic but very important lifts.
    1. Again it's a novice program, well written and a great introduction to weight lifting which will give you a base strength that will help you in whatever you do be it power lifting, athletics or more of a body building type of training.

Weighing alot is an advantage in your case. You already have the size, you just need to turn it into muscle. Your skinny friends will have to do things like drink a gallon of whole milk a day and eat and eat and eat to get anywhere near the size you could have if you stick with it.

There is a book and DVD called starting strength both are recommended, especially the DVD.
This is a link to a forums where the author will critique your form or answer any questions you have as long as you've taken the time to read the book. Look at it this way, he's doing this out of his own time and for free so the least you can do is read the book and watch the dvd.
www.strengthmill.net/forum/forumdisplay.php?s=742509b3c81ddf88f4cdc0ab0996cbf2&f=36


#3

An interview done by him on this site.
http://www.tmuscle.com/free_online_article/sports_body_training_performance/starting_strength


#4

Thanks for your advice.
I will check out the Starting Strength,it seems interesting,but the problem is I don't have anywhere around here to buy the book (from a small city in europe).

So you say I shouldn't worry about weight?

Well,my doctor recommended me that I lose some,and I don't like the mirror reflection.I'm not that fat,but I wanna lose some of it,and get some strength for the challenges which await me next year (basketball in over19 league ^^ ).

I have some strength already(push-ups,squats,running,etc on basketball training) and read some articles around here,and wasn't so sure about starting easy.

And there is a problem with these training programs for me.
During the summer,I want to go to sea with friends,mostly on bikes,and that is 15kms riding,so I'm not sure if I can do that,because everyone says that I shouldn't do cardio on the same day.


#5

1) Buy the book online: http://www.aasgaardco.com/ ; find someone to teach you the lifts; check this also: startingstrength.wikia.com/wiki/Starting_Strength_Wiki ;

2) Just lifting weights and doing some others activities will get you leaner, if you reduce your calories just a little (no need to get anorexic!!!);

3) It's godd to start with a base of general strenght, but you're an absolute beginner on weight training, so start with a beginner program;

4) lol! I made the best gains of my life in the sumer of 1993 (I was 17, yes, I'm old...), when I was jogging to the beach (5kms), swimming with friends, jogging back home, weight training in the early afternoon and playing soccer at about 7pm for (at least) one hour...

I agree that cardio right before weight training isn't good (it may leave you tired, so you won't be able to put 100% of effort), but for fat loss, you can do it early in the morning or right after weightt training.

Enjoy your summer holidays!


#6

Like I said the video for starting strength is real good but you really need to nail your form down. Meaning if your going on your toes when you squat, not going below parallel, not doing power cleans etc. I've done this twice, I start out with it after a layoff and the 2nd time I learned power cleans rather than doing rows and it did wonderful things to my body where as rows did crap, so learn em. You should probably clean up your diet a little bit, I mean if you eating a gallon of ice cream or a bag of chips that needs to change but like was said above as you get more muscle it will take care of itself to a degree.

Right now worry about getting big and strong and worry about diet after the program. Your a big kid and probably are never going to be a thin kid so you might as well aim for being a big strong kid since you already have the weight. Btw I'm not saying it can't happen but I'm assuming your a big guy like 6+ feet? So trying to be realistic.


#7

Thanks for the advices fabiop.
Considering cardio,what rest should I take between cardio and Weights? 8 hours?
And is it ok then do do weights at 7-8PM?

I will do that too when I start training,I am currently making my diet plan :slight_smile:

I have 6'4" (I think,if I converted well).
I don't want to be thin,just lose the fat,get some abs and muscles and strength :slight_smile:


#8

1) eight hours are enough, especially if you do cardio in the morning and take a nap after lunch;
2) whatever fits your schedule;
3) I have a hard time too converting cm and kg in feet, inches and pounds !

As Rapt wrote, be shure to lift with good form. The best option is to find a good coach or an experienced lifter to teach you how to lift.


#9

Ehh,finding someone experienced is hard,as this is small town...but,I might know someone,nut sure.
Anyway,you recommend starting strength?
Any other more intense program I could try?


#10

What do you mean by more intense?

I don't know if everyone needs to do Starting Strength, but don't mistake the term "starting" for "easy."

Your split in the original post is not ideal. You need more than 2 weights days -- at least 3, probably 4. You don't ever need a rest day from cardio, especially if you have a good amount of fat. You can play basketball/soccer every day with adequate diet and sleep. Eating more food and getting more activity is better than less food, less activity.

Go to T-Cell Alpha and read the thread "Bauer Chronicles" to see how Bauer97 was able to train for and play football as well as lift for size at the same time because he ate to fuel it all.


#11

Just reading the chronicles ^^
But,woah,eating 10-12k calories...isn't that like 1.5kg a day? O.o

What kind of split would you reccomend?
In this one,can cardio count as a rest from weights?
Because if so,I could do this:

Day1 -Early morning cardio,evening Weights
Day2 -Early morning cardio,evening Weights
Day3 - Rest
Day4 -Early morning cardio,evening Weights
Day5 -Early morning cardio,evening Weights
Day6 - Rest
Day7 -Early morning cardio,evening Weights

Would that be better?

I am having free time as much as I can and can change my schedule freely (no obligations,jobs and such),so anything can work for me ^^


#12

No man it's real easy, get the book and dvd to learn your lifts, then video it and go to the site I provided and have Rippetoe tell you if your doing it wrong or not if you can't find someone who knows what they are doing. In the mean time go through the forums and look for starting strength or google it, there is a nice long thread on it on bodybuilding.com or somthing. Remember learn to do power cleans rather than rows. There is also a excel program that you can plug your numbers into it. Then just do the program. Thats it. Go play basketball or somthing for cardio. Thats it man, nothing else, do the program as it is written in the book. Your haven't even started and already asking for somthing more advance.


#13

You will NOT be eating 10-12k calories per day. The point is that if that you CAN train a heck of a lot if you eat for it, and over time (the Bauer chronicles span YEARS, right?) you'll be able to train more and more and eat more and more. You don't jump to that level overnight, you build up to it.

There is no reason for beginners to be trying to reinvent the wheel here designing their own training splits. Follow a well-designed one from an excellent trainer like Christian Thibaudeau, and you will get GREAT results. I can hardly think of a beginner who has posted training/diet of his own design that is likely to work better.

Weight training 4 days a week would be about right. If fat loss really is a reasonable goal for you, Christian Thibaudeau's Destroying Fat program is excellent:
http://www.tmuscle.com/free_online_article/sports_body_training_performance/destroying_fat_war_room_strategies_to_maximize_fat_loss

His Hypermetabolic program is even better; although written for females will work just as well for males:
http://figureathlete.tmuscle.com/free_online_article/bodybuilding/getting_hypermetabolic

For maximum fat loss, you would eat a good clean diet that puts you in a deficit every day, but do use a recovery drink after the workouts.

For recomping, eat above maintenance PWO, and maintenance all other meals on lifting days. Eat below maintenance on rest days.

At your age, height, and weight, I'd recommend the recomping diet plan.


#14

Dude, no offense, you're giving sound advice, but it's kinda complicated for a 16 y.o. beginner, with nobody to learn from, and with just twenty kgs to loose during summer...

Just starting lifting weights, doing "cardio" (going to the sea, riding his bike, running, playing with friends...) and getting ride of junk food should be more than enough!

OP, if you want to make Starting Strength more "intense", just add some high-intensity cardio at the end of your sessions, just like 30 seconds of sprints on stationary bike, followed by 30 seconds of moderate pace. Repeat until you puke, clean up and leave the gym :slight_smile:

Something like:

Day1 -Early morning cardio, later on going to the sea, evening Weights + high-intensity cardio

Day2 -Early morning cardio, later on going to the sea, evening playing (basketball, soccer...) with friends

Day3 -Early morning cardio, later on going to the sea, evening Weights + high-intensity cardio

Day4 -Early morning cardio, later on going to the sea, evening playing (basketball, soccer...) with friends

Day5 -Early morning cardio, later on going to the sea, evening Weights + high-intensity cardio

Day6 - Early morning cardio, later on going to the sea, evening playing (basketball, soccer...) with friends

Day7 - Having fun with friends and/or trying to find a girlfriend (which you can do every day, it doesn't lead to overtraining :slight_smile: !!!

You can do "playng with friends" in the morning and "going to the sea" in the afternoon :slight_smile:


#15

@Rapt - I can only get the book illegal ways...paypal doesn't support my country,can't buy it...

@fabiop
Thanks for this,this split is something that I like and might try^^
Day 7 doesn't lead to physical overtraining,my mind boils from doing that sometimes xD

So,the plan to lose around 15-20kg and gain muscle isn't impossible?

@andersons - Recovery drinks? Sorry,but I don't understand what do you mean...


#16

Your parents don't have a credit card or there is no western union?


#17

1) Where are you from?

2) At a very beginner level, it's possible to loose fat and gain muscle; nobody (from the internet) can tell you how much...but follow the plan, and you'll be leaner, stronger and more muscular, that's shure!

3) To maximise muscle growth, after weight training is good to feed muscles with a carbs+protein shake; if you don't want (or can't) buy supplements, just lift before dinner, and have a serving of pasta (or rice or potatos or bread) + meat (or fish).

Don't make things complicated...eat cleaner, lesser, move more, and have fun!

Post your diet, when it's ready!


#18

@Rapt - Well,it is country...

@fabiop
1. Croatia (you know,Cro Cop,Janica Kostelic,Handball chamionship)...
Basically,we are retarted considering technology xD

  1. Well,even if I don't lose the fat in 3 months,I sure will follow it on...I love healthy lifestyle :slight_smile:

  2. Carbs + protein shakes?...going to ask around where can I buy some supplements (I need whey,right? :smiley: )

btw,just a little note,I don't go to the gym...weights at home :smiley:


#19

True that a recomping diet is not the simplest thing in the world. . .but then again, gaining muscle while losing fat isn't always easy to achieve even for beginners. He's already been playing basketball in a club. On the other hand, if he's eating tons of junk food, just cleaning it up will do for now.

Just wanna know -- what exactly is "going to the sea" in terms of cardio?


#20

15 km of bike riding to get there, swimming and riding back home...to me is a sound "cardio" program :slightly_smiling:

I agree with all you posted, but we're dealing with an absolute (weight training-wise) beginner, who's going to lift home and don't know that much about nutrition and supplements...I may be over-simplifying things, but I think that we have to give him a simple base to start from.

Exiledloco: go to www.stronglifts.com ; you'll find a beginner program very similar to Starting Strength, for free (legally :), a good description of lifts (subscribe the newsletter and dowload the .pdf), and many videos on correct lifting techinque.

Yes, a whey+maltodextrine (or glucose) shake after lifting is good, if you can afford it...

Jumping rope is fine form warm-up and high-intensity cardio (after weight training).