Whichever one looks more fun to you.
[quote]1 Man Island wrote:
[quote]1 Man Island wrote:
OP, what have you been doing since joining here?[/quote]
iceman, you never answered this.
Brick, I totally agree and am running GSLP, but I’m not really giving this kid the benefit of a doubt on anything.[/quote]
What are you getting at?
[quote]theiceman13 wrote:
[quote]BrickHead wrote:
[quote]1 Man Island wrote:
[quote]BrickHead wrote:
I think Greyskull LP, which draws from SS, is better than both. It is far more balanced, and many have gotten more out of it for a longer period of time. [/quote]
You know he’s going to spend the next 3 weeks researching that instead of choosing one.
OP, what have you been doing since joining here?[/quote]
Disclaimer: 1) Your post makes sense considering noobs’ reputations. 2) Not arguing with you. 3) I’ve liked your posts. Simply, no e-beef in this post.
That program can be understood in about a half hour or from a quick skim of and detailed read of key parts in the book. If someone can’t wrap their head around a workout consisting of bench press, curls, and squats, or overhead press, chinups, and deadlifts, with some plugins for weak parts or desired muscle size, something else is going on.
Greyskull corrects SS’s weakness, I believe, namely progressing in reps after a stall (double progression) or progressing with better autoregulation when reps over 10 in key lifts are reached. Plus being it has more volume for upper body and upper body is hit before lower body each session, there will better muscular balance and symmetry (bodybuilding term) for the body. I’ve heard quite a few people dislike their lower-body-dominant results with SS.
And I think it’s good if he takes the time to look into the GS philosophy overall considering Johnny Pain emphasizes sound bulking (not that GOMAD stuff) and recommends other activity such as recreational sports, running, conditioning, and the like, rather than Rip’s recommendation of lifting three times per week, overbulking, and little or nothing else (unless I missed his recommendations for better nutrition and other activity).
The GS LP ebook can be read in a few hours, and a routine can be written in very little time and can be implemented tomorrow. [/quote]
Lol just looked up that routine and a thread from the SS recommending it to intermediates after they stall on SS.
Btw dos it change a program if i add more warm ups and dos this sound ok or is it too near my working sets.
99lbs, 115lbs (working set) 139lbs for deadlifts.[/quote]
Try it and find out
[quote]T3hPwnisher wrote:
They both work. Flip a coin. Once they stop working, do something else.[/quote]
This. Just do something and do it with consistency, intensity, and eat enough to support your activity.
Noobs spend a lot of time looking for the magic pill. Red, blue… doesn’t matter. They’ll both get you there if you put in the work with consistency, intensity, food, and recovery.
[quote]dt79 wrote:
OP, I suggest you do a program where progression is already planned for you if you’re going to overthink all this.[/quote]
this
[quote]theiceman13 wrote:
[quote]BrickHead wrote:
[quote]1 Man Island wrote:
[quote]BrickHead wrote:
I think Greyskull LP, which draws from SS, is better than both. It is far more balanced, and many have gotten more out of it for a longer period of time. [/quote]
You know he’s going to spend the next 3 weeks researching that instead of choosing one.
OP, what have you been doing since joining here?[/quote]
Disclaimer: 1) Your post makes sense considering noobs’ reputations. 2) Not arguing with you. 3) I’ve liked your posts. Simply, no e-beef in this post.
That program can be understood in about a half hour or from a quick skim of and detailed read of key parts in the book. If someone can’t wrap their head around a workout consisting of bench press, curls, and squats, or overhead press, chinups, and deadlifts, with some plugins for weak parts or desired muscle size, something else is going on.
Greyskull corrects SS’s weakness, I believe, namely progressing in reps after a stall (double progression) or progressing with better autoregulation when reps over 10 in key lifts are reached. Plus being it has more volume for upper body and upper body is hit before lower body each session, there will better muscular balance and symmetry (bodybuilding term) for the body. I’ve heard quite a few people dislike their lower-body-dominant results with SS.
And I think it’s good if he takes the time to look into the GS philosophy overall considering Johnny Pain emphasizes sound bulking (not that GOMAD stuff) and recommends other activity such as recreational sports, running, conditioning, and the like, rather than Rip’s recommendation of lifting three times per week, overbulking, and little or nothing else (unless I missed his recommendations for better nutrition and other activity).
The GS LP ebook can be read in a few hours, and a routine can be written in very little time and can be implemented tomorrow. [/quote]
Lol just looked up that routine and a thread from the SS recommending it to intermediates after they stall on SS.
Btw dos it change a program if i add more warm ups and dos this sound ok or is it too near my working sets.
99lbs, 115lbs (working set) 139lbs for deadlifts.[/quote]
Greyskull is good for beginners and SS is not necessary before starting it.
One to four warmup sets are recommended for lifts. You would have known this if you researched SS or strength training in general correctly.
Yeah, that’s fine for warming up for the DL if you are DLing 139#.
Only because no-one else has overtly mentioned it:
The Starting Strength program is designed for just that – giving a foundation of strength from which you can develop in any direction you want, sports/powerlifting/bodybuilding/nameyourpoison.
Reg Park’s program is foundational bodybuilding.
Strength does relate to muscle size, but they are two distinct goals. Choose the goal, then choose the program for it, yes?
As for warmups, you decide how much warming-up you need for yourself on the day, based on age, injury, ambient temperature and workout requirements.
I have seen people look terrible after running Reg Park.
I have seen people look amazing after running Starting Strength.
I have seen guys lose poundages on the 1rm running Smolov.
I have seen guys win Powerlifting meets while training DoggCrapp.
I have seen guys ready to step on stage while running Sheiko.
The program is really of minimal consequence; the effort drives the changes. A ton of trainees really want to believe that the rep ranges, number of sets, percentages of 1rms lifted, etc etc are going to plug into some mathematical formula that your body is totally built for and ready to accept and all you have to do is use the right formula to get the right results.
The longer I train, the harder I find it to train “wrong”.
Of course you get better at training as you gain more experience!
If you’re a beginner, your routine should revolve around what you can do NOW.
As you get better, you can do more things. Your routine should include new stuff.
Some you will like. Some will work for you. Some won’t. Collect all the things that work! Dump what doesn’t.
Until you get in there and try, you’ll never know. Until you do some new shit, you’ll stay a beginner.
Reg Park at least challenges and motivates you with the prospect of exciting, new stuff in the future.
Starting Strength starts with lifts you can’t do, and then is the same thing forever. Over and over, until it just grinds you away until you’re as grumpy as Rip.
[quote]FlatsFarmer wrote:
it just grinds you away until you’re as grumpy as Rip.
[/quote]
LMAO!
[quote]theiceman13 wrote:
[quote]dagill2 wrote:
[quote]theiceman13 wrote:
Is more warm ups better then 2? and if yeah! why[/quote]
Do enough warm up sets to get you warmed up and no more. If this sounds vague, it is. So many things can affect how much of a warm-up you need it’s almost impossible to program, but with a bit of experience, you’ll know whether you’re ready for your work sets or not.[/quote]
So other words, you recken SS is a better program since Reg Park only has two warn ups, well heavier warm ups like for example for deadlifts 22kg, 43kg and 63kg for the working weight or 23kg, 25kg and 27kg for bench.[/quote]
Nope. I think they are both good programs, I think you’re missing my point. My point is that a warm up is just a warm up, you should not be basing your programming decisions around it. Warm ups do not need, and shouldn’t be programmed, they should be a given, like breathing.
dt: That was funny
But no disrespect to Coach Rippetoe. 5x5 on the basics is great. It just worked best for me after periods of higher rep, more varied “muscle building” work.
Do people read John McCallum anymore? The Complete Keys to Progress is just one routine after another, all to be used for a short time. Different routines really stress different weight lifting “styles” or “approaches.” He tells a little story, and clearly points out the goal of the routine. Then he gives you the routine, and reinforces the goal again. You try it for a month and “learn” how to bulk or cut or build your arms or build strength or whatever.
As you experiment and refer back you learn how to train with weights. Its awesome!
[quote]FlatsFarmer wrote:
Do people read John McCallum anymore? The Complete Keys to Progress is just one routine after another, all to be used for a short time. Different routines really stress different weight lifting “styles” or “approaches.” He tells a little story, and clearly points out the goal of the routine. Then he gives you the routine, and reinforces the goal again. You try it for a month and “learn” how to bulk or cut or build your arms or build strength or whatever.
Its awesome![/quote]
-Actually a great way to build a foundation and ‘learn’ your body (as long as you stick closely to each template)
[quote]Steve-O-68 wrote:
[quote]T3hPwnisher wrote:
They both work. Flip a coin. Once they stop working, do something else.[/quote]
This. Just do something and do it with consistency, intensity, and eat enough to support your activity.
Noobs spend a lot of time looking for the magic pill. Red, blue… doesn’t matter. They’ll both get you there if you put in the work with consistency, intensity, food, and recovery. [/quote]
I am not looking for any magic pill, am not one of those guys who look for shortcuts and do curls after curls etc, that is not me but my goals are to be massive and strong.
I had one guy coming up to me and trying to give me his routine, (it was just curls and curls) it obviously wasnt working as the guy looked 9 stone wet, he was also one of those stubbon guys acting like a advanced trainer, its guys like him that gives us beginners a bad name.
Did you have any more questions?
Yeah i am getting a bit confused about either adding weight to warm ups every session so for example : 2x5 with empty bar, 1x5 with 30lbs, 1x3 with 40lbs, 1x2 with 50 and 3x5 with 60lbs and then add 2, 5, or 10 to every set.
As long as you get warm, you will be fine.
There’s no hard or fast answer to the best way to do warmups.
The way I look at it, there’s really two goals:
- to actually warm the muscles up and work out whatever stiffness they may have
- to prepare your body for your work sets
For a given movement, I primarily warm up using that same movement. So I warm up for deadlifts with deadlifts, squats with squats, overhead press with overhead press.
I’ll start with the bar for presses and squats, and 135 for deadlifts (mostly because it’s at the right height).
I’ll do one or more sets of 5 or 10 with that starting weight. Then I’ll add some weight, do a set or two of 5. The goal here is just to warm up the joints and muscles. Usually I’m feeling good by this point, but if not, I’ll do a few more light sets until I am.
Then I start priming the body for whatever my work set is for the day. I’ll add some weight, do a set of 3. Add a bit more weight, do a set of 2. Add a bit more weight, and do a set of 1. I repeat this until I’m pretty close to my working weight.
Here’s a couple examples. The first is for a deadlift variation. The second is for an overhead press variation.
[quote]General warm up:
135 x 5
185 x 5
Transitioning to priming the body for the work sets:
225 x 3
275 x 2
315 x 1
350 x 1
Work sets:
380 x 5
350 x 5 [/quote]
[quote]General warmup:
45 x 10
45 x 10
Transitioning to priming the body for the work sets:
65 x 3
85 x 2
90 x 1
Work sets:
100 x 5
90 x 5[/quote]
As you can see, the basic concept is the same, but the details are a bit different. For the pressing, I need a bit more general warmup than I need for the pulling.
[quote]theiceman13 wrote:
Yeah i am getting a bit confused about either adding weight to warm ups every session so for example : 2x5 with empty bar, 1x5 with 30lbs, 1x3 with 40lbs, 1x2 with 50 and 3x5 with 60lbs and then add 2, 5, or 10 to every set.[/quote]
You are overthinking this. It’s a warm-up, it’s single and only purpose is to get you ready to do your working sets. My approach on exercises I’m not familiar with is to start incredibly light, with the bar if you have to, and keep adding “some” weight every set until you feel ready to do your work set. The “some” will depend on how well warmed up you feel at that moment. It does benefit you in any way to have this preplanned or to follow strict guidelines on how to do it.
EDIT: I assume you mean kg’s, not lbs btw?