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Starting Strength: Squatting Heavy all the Time??

I just started ripptoes workout this week, and I’m just wondering am I supposed to be doing heavy squats with the same weight all 3 days, until I’m strong enough, and my form is good enough to increase the weight??

or is it supposed to be mon-heavy,wed-medium,fri-heavy(PR day)?? reason I’m wondering is because on monday I managed to do 245 for 3x5 fairly easily, but then on wed.

my legs were still pretty sore from the squat-deadlift combo on monday, so I wasn’t as strong enough to lift 245 for 3x5, and missed reps. Is this a issue of not taking in enough calories?? or not doing the program the way it’s written??

Not very good advice on my part…

[quote]matso1236 wrote:
With a 245lb 5rm you might be moving too much weight to g up weight every workout, so go for a PR once per week. Make sure you dont overdo the amount of weight you start with, i would maybe start with 10-20lb lower then you actually 1RM for the first workout and work from there.

Example:

Monday:
Squat 3x5 (245lb)

Wed:
Squat 3x5 (245lb)

Friday 3x5 (245lb)

next Monday:

Squat 3x5 (250lb or 255lb)

Eat enough calories to recover, and take your time between sets.

If this doesn’t work maybe look into 5x5…
[/quote]

Negative. He needs to add reps/weight each time he’s in the gym. Wednesday and Friday won’t force an adaptation if he’s already done the same thing on Monday. The point of “Starting Strength” is that he will have recovered from the previous workout due to being in an early stage of training where the poundages are light.

OP:

If you’re getting strong enough that you are not completely recovered from the previous time in the gym, it might be time to move to an intermediate program, like a Westside template or the Texas Method.

[quote]PRCalDude wrote:
matso1236 wrote:
With a 245lb 5rm you might be moving too much weight to g up weight every workout, so go for a PR once per week. Make sure you dont overdo the amount of weight you start with, i would maybe start with 10-20lb lower then you actually 1RM for the first workout and work from there.

Example:

Monday:
Squat 3x5 (245lb)

Wed:
Squat 3x5 (245lb)

Friday 3x5 (245lb)

next Monday:

Squat 3x5 (250lb or 255lb)

Eat enough calories to recover, and take your time between sets.

If this doesn’t work maybe look into 5x5…

Negative. He needs to add reps/weight each time he’s in the gym. Wednesday and Friday won’t force an adaptation if he’s already done the same thing on Monday. The point of “Starting Strength” is that he will have recovered from the previous workout due to being in an early stage of training where the poundages are light.
[/quote]

I’m sure i read somewhere that Rippetoe advices that if you cant add weight every workout you should try to add weight every week, i can be wrong tough. He also advised to get micro weights since adding 5lb to your squat every workout would be beastly.

From a writeup;

Every week make it a goal to increase each of your lifts by 2.5%. Meaning if I lifted 100lbs for my Bench Week 1 then Week 2 I would try for 102.5lbs. If I did 200lb Squats Week 1 I would try for 205lbs in Week 2. Sometimes you will be able to do more but don?t mess with your form just to lift more.

[quote] The point of “Starting Strength” is that he will have recovered from the previous workout due to being in an early stage of training where the poundages are light…
[/quote]

…relative to genetic potential (Rip’s concept, not mine). SS is a beginner’s program, so it would make sense to try yo determine if OP is a beginner. Of course, we can’t do this with any certainty over the net, but appropriate questions would be:

How long have you been training, and with what sort of programs?

What was your squat when you first started out?

How much do you weigh and how much are you eating?

[quote]matso1236 wrote:

I’m sure i read somewhere that Rippetoe advices that if you cant add weight every workout you should try to add weight every week, i can be wrong tough. He also advised to get micro weights since adding 5lb to your squat every workout would be beastly.

From a writeup;

Every week make it a goal to increase each of your lifts by 2.5%. Meaning if I lifted 100lbs for my Bench Week 1 then Week 2 I would try for 102.5lbs. If I did 200lb Squats Week 1 I would try for 205lbs in Week 2. Sometimes you will be able to do more but don?t mess with your form just to lift more.
[/quote]

This is the basis for the Texas method and other intermediate and “advanced-beginner” programs. In the former, you follow a volume-recovery-intensity pattern, you don’t do SS with the same weight all three sessions.

In the latter, you would do front squats on Wednesday (instead of back squats) to recover from Monday’s workout, then on Friday, add five pounds to Monday’s squat.

Thanks for correcting me up there, i apologize.

Here is another piece of info:

“If you get at least 12 or 13 of the reps total (i.e. 5/4/4 or 5/4/3 or 4/4/4) then keep the weight the same for the next workout”

And once again:

“Be on the safe side, start lighter than you think you need to, and go from there. This also helps develop a base of conditioning with slightly less weight than absolute max, which helps reduce initial DOMS”

[quote]tom8658 wrote:
The point of “Starting Strength” is that he will have recovered from the previous workout due to being in an early stage of training where the poundages are light…

…relative to genetic potential (Rip’s concept, not mine). SS is a beginner’s program, so it would make sense to try yo determine if OP is a beginner. Of course, we can’t do this with any certainty over the net, but appropriate questions would be:

How long have you been training, and with what sort of programs?

What was your squat when you first started out?

How much do you weigh and how much are you eating?
[/quote]

Rip covers this in PP. It’s based on 1RM for the squat, bench, dead and power clean vs. the OP’s weight.

[quote]matso1236 wrote:
Thanks for correcting me up there, i apologize.

Here is another piece of info:

“If you get at least 12 or 13 of the reps total (i.e. 5/4/4 or 5/4/3 or 4/4/4) then keep the weight the same for the next workout”

[/quote]

Yeah. You keep the weight the same but add REPS next time around. So if you got 5/4/3 on Monday, you shoot for 5/5/5 on Wednesday. If you do monday’s reps again at the same weight, you’ve induced no adaptation.

[quote]PRCalDude wrote:
tom8658 wrote:
The point of “Starting Strength” is that he will have recovered from the previous workout due to being in an early stage of training where the poundages are light…

…relative to genetic potential (Rip’s concept, not mine). SS is a beginner’s program, so it would make sense to try yo determine if OP is a beginner. Of course, we can’t do this with any certainty over the net, but appropriate questions would be:

How long have you been training, and with what sort of programs?

What was your squat when you first started out?

How much do you weigh and how much are you eating?

Rip covers this in PP. It’s based on 1RM for the squat, bench, dead and power clean vs. the OP’s weight.

[/quote]

Is there a chart somewhere in the Novice or Intermediate section? I’ve read PP and don’t remember Rip giving specific numbers, but I could have just missed it.

I want to say that 1.5x BW on the squat was generally considered intermediate, but I can’t remember where I read that, either. I was under the impression that Rip’s definition of “intermediate” was “one for whom novice programming no longer works”.

EDIT: I’m dumb. The tables (strength standards) are in an appendix to the book, they indicate that an intermediate has a slightly less than 1.5xBW squat. These are standards, though, and have to be adjusted for all manner of individual factors, so it’s most useful for the OP to tell us how far he’s come, as well as his weight.

[quote]PRCalDude wrote:
matso1236 wrote:
Thanks for correcting me up there, i apologize.

Here is another piece of info:

“If you get at least 12 or 13 of the reps total (i.e. 5/4/4 or 5/4/3 or 4/4/4) then keep the weight the same for the next workout”

Yeah. You keep the weight the same but add REPS next time around. So if you got 5/4/3 on Monday, you shoot for 5/5/5 on Wednesday. If you do monday’s reps again at the same weight, you’ve induced no adaptation. [/quote]

Good advice. Also, if you miss your 15 reps for three workouts in a row, or regress in one of the sessions (got 5/4/4 Monday, but only 5/4/3 Wednesday), you should deload.

[quote]matso1236 wrote:

“Be on the safe side, start lighter than you think you need to, and go from there. This also helps develop a base of conditioning with slightly less weight than absolute max, which helps reduce initial DOMS”[/quote]

Also very good advice.

[quote]tom8658 wrote:
PRCalDude wrote:
tom8658 wrote:
The point of “Starting Strength” is that he will have recovered from the previous workout due to being in an early stage of training where the poundages are light…

…relative to genetic potential (Rip’s concept, not mine). SS is a beginner’s program, so it would make sense to try yo determine if OP is a beginner. Of course, we can’t do this with any certainty over the net, but appropriate questions would be:

How long have you been training, and with what sort of programs?

What was your squat when you first started out?

How much do you weigh and how much are you eating?

Rip covers this in PP. It’s based on 1RM for the squat, bench, dead and power clean vs. the OP’s weight.

Is there a chart somewhere in the Novice or Intermediate section? I’ve read PP and don’t remember Rip giving specific numbers, but I could have just missed it.

I want to say that 1.5x BW on the squat was generally considered intermediate, but I can’t remember where I read that, either. I was under the impression that Rip’s definition of “intermediate” was “one for whom novice programming no longer works”.[/quote]

Yeah, basically you do SS until your strength gains plateau on it. There’s a chart in PP, but it’s better to just go with when you hit the strength plateau so you squeeze all you can out of the novice program.

Yeah, start lighter I think. I ran the program from January to May with a starting squat of about where you’re at to a tough 335 for 4. So it’s doable, you just have to get used to the squatting frequency.

[quote]PRCalDude wrote:
OP:

If you’re getting strong enough that you are not completely recovered from the previous time in the gym, it might be time to move to an intermediate program, like a Westside template or the Texas Method. [/quote]

The Westside Template is hardly intermediate. You have to reach a certain strength level to benefit from the Max Effort method and the Dynamic Effort Method more than you would from just the good old Repetition Effort Method.

Maybe Westside For Skinny Bastards if you’re an athlete, but if getting absolutely jacked-diesel and muscle size is your main concern, then obviously a BODYBUILDING template will serve you best. Something like Super Squats or a 5 day split.

[quote]FightingScott wrote:
PRCalDude wrote:
OP:

If you’re getting strong enough that you are not completely recovered from the previous time in the gym, it might be time to move to an intermediate program, like a Westside template or the Texas Method.

The Westside Template is hardly intermediate. You have to reach a certain strength level to benefit from the Max Effort method and the Dynamic Effort Method more than you would from just the good old Repetition Effort Method. [/quote]

Yes. That’s why Rippetoe has it listed as an intermediate program: it’s for week-to-week strength gains after daily, linear strength gains can no longer be made. We’re trying to figure out whether he’s at that stage.

[quote]
Maybe Westside For Skinny Bastards if you’re an athlete, but if getting absolutely jacked-diesel and muscle size is your main concern, then obviously a BODYBUILDING template will serve you best. Something like Super Squats or a 5 day split. [/quote]

Has he stated his goals?

[quote]PRCalDude wrote:
FightingScott wrote:
PRCalDude wrote:
OP:

If you’re getting strong enough that you are not completely recovered from the previous time in the gym, it might be time to move to an intermediate program, like a Westside template or the Texas Method.

The Westside Template is hardly intermediate. You have to reach a certain strength level to benefit from the Max Effort method and the Dynamic Effort Method more than you would from just the good old Repetition Effort Method.

Yes. That’s why Rippetoe has it listed as an intermediate program: it’s for week-to-week strength gains after daily, linear strength gains can no longer be made. We’re trying to figure out whether he’s at that stage.

Maybe Westside For Skinny Bastards if you’re an athlete, but if getting absolutely jacked-diesel and muscle size is your main concern, then obviously a BODYBUILDING template will serve you best. Something like Super Squats or a 5 day split.

Has he stated his goals?
[/quote]

This IS the Bodybuilding Forum Section.

I might as well clear a few things up. I’ve been training seriously since last october/november. Before I started on this plan, I was doing Max-OT’s 5 day split for about 8-12 weeks, and before that it was a push/pull 4 day split for a few months as well.

I’ve done starrs 5x5 but I didn’t get the squat strength out of it as I wanted, which led me to believe ripptoes program would be better for me. My goals, with this program, are to primarily increase my squat (since that’s my weakest lift at the moment) while getting some mass as well.

My 1RM’s are(these are just estimates but I’m pretty sure they’re close enough, given my 5RM’s):

Bench-around 245
Squat-probably around 295
Deadlift-between 435-450
BB row(90 deg.)-230
standing MP- 155-165

I weigh between 210-215 at 5’11

[quote]NeedforStrength wrote:
I might as well clear a few things up. I’ve been training seriously since last october/november. Before I started on this plan, I was doing Max-OT’s 5 day split for about 8-12 weeks, and before that it was a push/pull 4 day split for a few months as well.

I’ve done starrs 5x5 but I didn’t get the squat strength out of it as I wanted, which led me to believe ripptoes program would be better for me. My goals, with this program, are to primarily increase my squat (since that’s my weakest lift at the moment) while getting some mass as well.

My 1RM’s are(these are just estimates but I’m pretty sure they’re close enough, given my 5RM’s):

Bench-around 245
Squat-probably around 295
Deadlift-between 435-450
BB row(90 deg.)-230
standing MP- 155-165

I weigh between 210-215 at 5’11[/quote]

Time to switch to the texas method.