T Nation

Starting Out - Bulking


#1

I've just started lifting.
My stats are
5'7, 150lbs, 15%bf(Approx).
I intend to bulk till I touch around 200lbs- so that's going to be for another two and a half years atleast I'm guessing.

I train five days a week,no cardio, & ingest 3000 calories a day (on all days) with 285gP, 325gC and 75gF.
Do my cals and macros look alright?
And is 200lbs too heavy considering my height?
Been talking to a few members, thought I'd get some more feedback.
I'd be grateful for any advice.


#2

1) Probably don't need nearly that much protein if you have 127 lbs of LBM. Save your money for the time being.

2) Consider being a little more cyclical in your approach rather than just gaining for 30 straight months. If you stop and take 8 weeks to lean out and drop some of the fat you will inevitably gain every 20 lbs or so, you will be leaner, more muscular, and healthier for it in the long run. Do it slowly and methodically, don't get caught up in the scale weight. If you got to 200 lbs but ended up gaining another 30 lbs of bodyfat, then you're going to be north of 26% bodyfat, and trust me, at your height, you'll just look like a fat guy.


#3

Some trouble uploading my reply. Not sure if the last one came up.
That sounds like a plan. Bulk till 180lbs, lean out, then bulk again?

As for the protein bit, I'll put up my diet as of now, could you tell me how I need to re-arrange it?

6:00 AM: 4 Egg whites, 2 Oranges.(Pre-Workout)
6:45-7:45 AM: Train
7:45 AM: 1 Scoop of Protein Powder, 2 bananas.250 Ml Milk (.5% Fat) (Post Workout)
9:00 AM: 3 Post Original Shredded Wheat Biscuits, 250 ml Milk (.5%fat, 1/2 cup Blueberries and Strawberries, 1 Scoop Protein Powder.
1:00 PM: 0.5Cup(When raw) Brown rice, 200gms Chicken Breast.
5:00 PM: 4 slices of Whole wheat toast, 10 almonds, 1 tbsp Mayo.
8:00 PM: 200 Grams Tuna, Mixed vegetables- Steamed.
10:00 PM: 3tbsp Natural Peabut Butter, 1 Scoop Egg Protein.

That's pretty much what i eat through the week. I might have a cheat meal in there somewhere.


#4

The enthusiasm is great, welcome to the iron game : ).

I agree with SH, protein is a bit too high, but that's not the worst thing in the world.

I would start a bit lower than you are right now (macros), and increase every 2 weeks or so according to the scale. What does your training currently look like as well? Since you just started lifting, I would really focus on getting as strong as possible on big compound lifts in the next year or so...that will give you a solid foundation and doing so will take advantage of beginners gains the best.

I would not be surprised if with proper nutrition and intense training, you could be up to 185-200 at the same BF shortly.

Your diet is a bit too restrictive IMO...you are just starting out. Don't go from 0-100, go from 0-10, then 20, 30, etc...What I mean is that I like the food choices, but feel free to be less restrictive especially if you are training compound lifts intensely as the extra calories will be very beneficial.


#5

Thanks a ton Ebomb. I've been floundering around, getting more and more confused the more i read.

I train five days a week:

Monday:
Chest,Triceps,Abs:
Incline Barbell Chest Press 6x4
Pec Deck Flyes
Flat DB Press
Cable Cross Over

Skull Crushers
Cable Push Downs

Machine Wrist Curls.
Abs

Tuesday:
Back:
Deadlift 6x4
Lat Pull down.
Bent over BB Rows.
Lying down DB Overhead Extension.

Wed:
Legs:
BB Squats 6x4.
BB Lunges.
Leg Curls.
Stiff Leg Deadlift.

Standing Calf raise.
Seated Calf Raise.
Abs

Thursday:
Off.

Friday:
Shoulders

Seated DB Shoulder Press 6x4
DB Front Raise
DB Lateral Raise
Incline Reverse DB Flyes.

DB Shrugs.

Abs

Seated Calf Raise.
Standing Calf raise.

Saturday:
Arms:

Incline DB Curl
Cable Push down.
Incline Hammer Curl.
Close Grip Bench Press
Machine Preacher Curls
One handed Cable Tricep Push Downs.

Machine Wrist Curls.

That's pretty much been my training routine for the past two weeks.
Except for the lifts that I've marked out, the others are done on 3 sets of 8 reps each. the workout takes around 50 minutes. I'm not sure when to fit in the cardio, so I haven't been doing any. Not sure if I should be doing it on a bulk.

Could you help me tweak my diet? Where can I lower the protein? And by restrictive-dyu mean I should be eating more?


#6

Oh, and if more, of what should I get more?


#7

Training doesn't look bad, but I would recommend a 5x5 or program that focusses on improving the compound exercises quicker. Check out 5x5, Bill Starr, or some of Dan Johns stuff...

As for your diet, it's not that it looks bad or is deficient, It just appears to be more like a contest diet of a bodybuilder than a diet of a beginner who is looking to gain muscle.

Since you are looking to gain, don't worry about throwing different food choices that might be considered "less clean," especially since you are going to be experiencing beginners gains and not a ton of that will be fat.

I would just follow a few rules:

Eat a large meal every 2 hours (whatever that may be) (consisting of protein, carbs, fats)

Consume as many calories post-workout as possible.

That's it...I think if you keep it simple, you'll reap the benefits early on.


#8

Thanks man.
You've a link to his program? There appear to be several versions of it.

I'll leave the diet as it is as of now. But I'll keep it more in mind of a guideline, if i can eat more, I will. I'm just thinking of interchanging a few things so i get more carbs and protein pre workout.
And wow on your DP, I just saw it. If I can get to that someday in the future, that'll be something.


#9

This is the one I found. Does this look alright

Bill Starr's Beginner 5x5
Monday (Heavy Day - > 85%)
Back Squats: 5 x 5 Ramping weight to top set of 5 reps across 5 sets
Bench Press: 5 x 5 Ramping weight to top set of 5 reps across 5 sets
Deadlifts: 5 x 5 Ramping weight to top set of 5 reps across 5 sets
Wednesday (Light Day - <70%)
Back Squats: 5 x 5 using 60% of Monday's weight
Bench Press: 5 x 5 using 60% of Monday's weight
Pullups: 5 x 5 Ramping weight to top set of 5 reps across 5 sets

Friday (Medium Day - 70-85%)
Back Squats: 5 x 5 using 80% of Monday's weight
Bench Press: 5 x 5 using 80% of Monday's weight
Rows: 5 x 5 Ramping weight to top set of 5 reps across 5 s

I'll do HIIT on Wednesday and Friday along with Abs.
And after talking to a few people here, this is how I've changed the diet.

6:00 AM: 4 slices whole wheat toast, 1 scoop Egg Protein Powder.(Pre-Workout)
6:45-7:45 AM: Train
7:45 AM: 1 Scoop of Protein Powder, 2 bananas.250 Ml Milk (.5% Fat) (Post Workout)
9:00 AM: 3 Post Original Shredded Wheat Biscuits, 250 ml Milk (.5%fat, 1/2 cup Blueberries and Strawberries, 1 Scoop Protein Powder.
1:00 PM: 0.5Cup(When raw) Brown rice, 100gms Chicken Breast.

5:00 PM: 2 slices of Whole wheat toast, 10 almonds, 1 tbsp Mayo, 100gms Chicken Breast.

8:00 PM: 200 Grams Tuna, Mixed vegetables- Steamed.
10:00 PM: 3tbsp Natural Peabut Butter, 4 egg whites.

Does this sound like a good plan?
I'd really appreciate it if someone took the time off to point me in the right direction


#10

A few things with the diet that I might change...

Don't feel the need to eat 6-8 times/day...It's an old myth, and IMO is out dated. I'd personally like to see much more of your carb distribution post-workout, maybe add in 3-4 pieces of toast, a big bowl of oatmeal + protein, rice etc.

If you normally train around 7-8 am, I would have a large PW meal around 8:30, then eat again every 3-4 hours...I would actually combine two of your meals and just eat them at one time. Does that make sense?

Training looks solid. Also, check out Stronglifts program which is the following:
Workout A: Squat: 5x5, Bench Press: 5x5, Barbell Row: 5x5
Workout B: Squat: 5x5, Overhead Press: 5x5, Deadlift: 1x5

But any of the 5x5 templates will work well if you train hard.

Also, what is DP?


#11

Got it.
DP Is display picture.

I'm moving up the carbs to put them around my workout. I've left around 100g for the rest of the day, out of around 320g in total.
I saw the SL program as well. I'll start out with Starr's and then see how it goes.

Last question about cardio.
Do I need to do it on my off days? Tuesday and Thursday in this case. If so, of what type and how much?


#12

^ If you're new to physical activity - especially something as taxing as HARD weight training (not that pussy shit you see in the gym), then your body is going to be put through the wringer. Bill Starr's program is really solid for a starting strength program, and that should do for now. Whenever someone starts off, I always tell them not to do 'too much too soon.'

I think that you would be well served to start off eating a lot, lifting HARD according to Starr's program, and on your off days just do what you gotta do. Don't shy away from a game of ball or something, but no need to start in on the cardio quite yet.

If you start to gain too much fat (which is HIGHLY unlikely at this stage), then reconsider, but right now, your body will respond amazingly quickly to a good strength program. Just whatever you do, DO NOT SKIP EATING. Food is arguably more important than the program you're following. Don't make the same mistakes I made lol. Feel free to PM me or anyone else who has more experience than me haha. Good luck.


#13

Thanks a lot guys, the both of you.
I'm starting out day after. I'll lay off the cardio for a while then see how it goes.
Will update and ask if you anything comes up.


#14

Thanks a lot guys, the both of you.
I'm starting out day after. I'll lay off the cardio for a while then see how it goes.
Will update and ask if you anything comes up.


#15

Agree with everything said here, particularly about not trying to think about eating particularly clean and about not trying to overcomplicate both the training and the diet. You are new to the iron game, and this is the period where you have the highest potential for growth.

Best of luck and welcome!


#16

^All Great Advise^

Why No Pull UP or Dips?

Hit the Squats and Deadlifts hard and keep those calories coming. Be prepared to shit alot more! Good luck on your goal.

~Ecto


#17

thanks ecto and new guy.
Starr's program does have pullups on the 'light' day. I dont think i saw dips anywhere there.

Also when he says 'rows' i'm assuming he meantBB bent-over rows.