T Nation

Spike / HOT-ROX Endurance

In that case. It appears as though HOT-ROX would have more benefit to my training. Any thoughts?

I don’t have an answer for you other than to say in the Spike discussion I believe it was advised several times not to take the two together.

There are ingredients in HOT-ROX that do NOT work with Spike. Tim P. recommends in several places in the various threads NOT to take the two together. For the people who are going to do it anyway because they think they know more than T-Nation (and you know who you are), make sure there’s at least 8-10 hours between taking the two and start off with the lowest dosage to assess tolerance.

MicroSlash - “Testing people’s tolerance for insanely loud guitars since 1988…”

Slash, is it that they don’t work together or just that they thought it would be too much stimulation? I’m not sure, it didn’t seem clear to me but I probably missed something.

On 1/28/2005, in the Spike thread, Tim Patterson wrote: "Taking Spike with Other Stimulants and Fat-Burners

I’ve given guidelines for taking Spike with other stimulants and fat-burners. It seems, however, that some people are deadset on ignoring my recommendations and going hog-wild with maximum dosages of everything – all at once!

Let me try this one more time. And if people continue to abuse Spike . . .

I WILL REMOVE IT FROM THE MARKET!

So, listen up!

Do NOT take Spike in combination with any other stimulant or fat-burner.

Please, guys . . . I don’t want a handful of overzealous people to be responsible for taking this incredible supplement away from everyone."

I assume when he said ‘fat burners,’ he was referring to HOT-ROX as well.

MicroSlash

TC seems to indicate that one CAN use both together…you just have to start off slowly; i.e. one cap of each and then slowly increase if you need to.

As far as contraindications, I’ve also saw that TC implies Spike can be taken with RED KAT which has Scaremax as a common ingredient with HOT-ROX. When comparing the ingredients of HOT-ROX, RED KAT, and Alpha Male, the ONLY contraindicated ingredient appears to be the guggulsterone stuff.

If it is the guggulsterone that is contraindicated, I’m curious then if it is a good idea for those of us on partial thyroid replacement therapy to use with Spike. HOT-ROX has been great for me, at only a single cap a day (with my thyroid medication of course). Spike taken alone with my thyroid medication (only a single cap again) has also been pretty damn good. So, if one, like me, were to take HOT-ROX AND Spike at a single cap a day (no more), it appears to me that it would be at least as beneficial as taking only Spike at 2 to 3 caps a day.

My 2 cents worth.

HOT-ROX contains a fair dosing of caffeine I believe, so, yes its stimulatory and shouldn’t be taken in conjunction with Spike. This is why there has been talk of a standalone A7-E product.

I’d still like to know whether yohimbe falls into the realm of stimulatory agents that should be avoided. I’ve ceased using it just in case, but I’m still debating whether it was conflicting our not.

buffd_samurai, its not the guggulestrone that would be a problem, as that is part of their A7-E gel, which is being talked of as a potential fat loss agent by itself to be used in conjunction with Spike. The problem would come with the caffeine in the HOT-ROX.

That’s an interesting opinion Moon Knight (by the way, Moon Knight was always one of the coolest Marvel comics characters created in my opinion).

Until Biotest tells us though, I’m going to err on the side of 1 cap of HOT-ROX + 1 cap of Spike’s caffeine total being less than 2 or 3 Spike’s caffeine intake.

Now, I’m not doing this yet…I’ll wait for more info. BUT, it just doesn’t sound so BAD to me based on the information provided so far by anyone.

No, I wouldn’t say the plan you outlined is bad, assuming you’re not talking about taking both at the same time.

As someone else stated, its been offered by TC and I think perhaps even Tim himself, that if one handles stimulants well, it wouldn’t hurt to try a small dose of Spike and then a small dose of HOT-ROX a significant time later in the day.

[quote]buffd_samurai wrote:
1 cap of Spike’s caffeine total being less than 2 or 3 Spike’s caffeine intake.
[/quote]

I don’t believe Spike contains caffeine does it? I believe its stimulatory effect is an entirely different mechanism.

This is a question, not an answer. Maybe I misread, but that’s what I have thinking up to this point.

Not that it makes much difference; you should still limit the over-stimulation. Just trying to clarify.

HOT-ROX, Green Tea, and Power Drive kicks so much ass! Oh yeah Spike is cool too.

     joe

Your choice boils down to being goal-dependent.

If you’re looking to amp up your training sessions, then give Spike a whirl.

If you’re more into revving your workouts while dropping some body fat, then HOT-ROX is the perfect side-kick.

I wouldn’t mix the two (duh!). I know Tim has said if you do, then stick with that absolute minimum dose; but, I think you’d see better results, whichever your goal, if you stuck with one at the higher dosage.

Hope this helps!