I’m glad the HCG helped you out! I’m a little hesitant to add anything since I’m still trying to see if I can get the T dialed in. I’m definitely overall happy with it, but the fine tuning is what I’m hoping gives the best results. My appetite, mood and body composition are at least pretty consistent, the sex drive is a roller coaster though.
i don’t have labs. subjectively it ramps e2. i noticed typical for me e2 symptoms when i go above a certain dose of HCG which are alleviated by an AI, and for the upper dose seems to be Tprop 30mg/daily + 600 HCG 3x weekly. i’ve tried 3x1000IU hcg which seems to high
Obviously I’m not @lamehack, but I use 100 mg T per week with 1000 IU thrice per week. My T is usually 700 to 1000 on any day of the week and my E is in the 30s. Using HCG has not had a huge difference in lab values.
@lamehack why do you use propionate?
I just feel better on it. libido is higher. i think the highs and lows allow your body to take a ‘break’, similar to a natural cycle. not a believer into the steady state T levels. I can also handle higher doses on Prop. for some reason I need 200mg+ of T. its probably not a common thing. my last labs on 210mg/Prop and 1800IU hcg weekly were 973ng/dl Total, 30 free T. which is the level I feel on good on. on Cyp for some reason at 200mg/week I was around 600/20 or so.
what I also noticed is that I don’t i need to wait weeks for a change in protocol. i’ve try going as high as 50mg/daily, and i feel the effects the same day. this could be due to e2 obviously.
at 100mg T /week i feel like i am on no T at all.
I don’t know if this was due to being younger or directly from fluctuating, unsteady levels from Androgel or Testim. When I used either of those for 10 g of gel per day, my libido was ridiculous! I had to stop because of transfer onto my then fiancé/now wife.
Don’t you advocate injecting 3 times a week???
i switched my protocol to daily Tprop a while ago. for Tcyp it absolutely makes no sense to inject daily due to half life. 3x seems plenty often
But pushing anything more than 1, maybe 2, times a week for Cyp is essentially following the steady state train isn’t it?
It makes perfect sense to inject daily, if you’re having side effects, because injectable testosterone spikes your hormones in an unnatural way, far removed from natural, and that can cause side effects.
Update to my original post: I am currently doing 50mg every other day with a good amount of improvement to erections and sexual function. I didn’t lower my dosage too much but I feel close to where my body needs to be.
How long? Only a matter of time before the over all total dose catches up to remind you frequency won’t change anything.
the variations between injecting 2-3 vs 7x a week between peak and low will be fairly small.
That depends on the absorption rate, which varies greatly person to person, affecting the difference between peak and trough.
So preaching for steady state?
there is no way to mimic natural fluctuations with Tcyp. you will have to large drops which do not copy a natural cycle and feel like crap most likely if you go to lets say 1x every 2 weeks injections. this can be somehow improved with Tprop. IMO if you decide on Tcyp it is better to go lower on the dose and have a steady state, but going for Tprop was a game changer for how I feel. Maybe creams will achieve that too. I personally was able to raise my dose and feel much better, at 30mg Tprop daily and ~200mg Tcyp 3x week.
I am saying you always advocate cyp 3 times a week, which essentially falls in line with the steady state train.
If you’re working with a Doc, I think you should look at supplementation that helps get your free Test higher. My Test level just came back at 144, and my Free Test is 148.6.
Secondly try S5 Labs Horny Goat Weed. Take two a day, along with Tribulus and Tongkat Ali. That cocktail can help with sex drive.
I was in a similar situation with natural T levels that ranged from 800 - 1000 at 49 yo with a high sex drive pre-cycle.
I decided to do my first cycle in decades and perform PCT. At the end of PCT, T was in the 900s, e2 42, FSH/LH still > 14. Leading me to believe I was trending back towards my normal, yet sex drive was absent.
Given I used a 19-nor during my cycle and used a mild OTC prolactin inhibitor on-cycle, I took a small dose of caber. The results led me to believe prolactin was the major culprit. I further benefited from a weekly 12.5 mg dose of exemestane. I added this because my e2 level was higher than “my normal” and is only expected to increase at this phase (post-PCT estrogen rebound).
We’re all different and I will add prolactin to my next lab test. I only offer this as an idea of what else could be contributing beyond T and E.
It’s ok to have horny goat weed with trt? What about with cialis or viagra?